Wouldn't you just take all Stealth Devices, and basically become invincible barring some ridiculously terrible defense roll?

Wouldn't you just take all Stealth Devices, and basically become invincible barring some ridiculously terrible defense roll?

Lt Blount says hai.

Name			Shields	Hull	Length	Speed	LIMGTW	Special
A-wing			50	16	10	120	2 2
Assault Gunboat		100	30	15	90	222
B-wing			100	62	15	90	332
Combat Utility Vehicle		7	15	35	22	repair/rearm
Missile Boat		120	20	15	125	1 4
R-41 Starchaser		30	15	15	100	22
T-wing			20	15	10	110	2
Tie Advanced		50	15	10	145	4 2
Tie Bomber			30	10	80	2 2
Tie Defender		100	15	10	155	422
Tie Fighter			10	10	100	2
Tie Interceptor			17	10	110	4
Transport		80	40	20	55	22	repair/rearm
Tug				5	5	10		repair/rearm
Tyderian Shuttle	100	25	20	65	4
X-wing			50	21	15	100	4 2
Y-wing			75	42	20	80	222
Z-95 Headhunter		20	15	15	95	2 2

It's interesting to think what ships have been significantly altered.

B-Wing - gone from having more hull than Y-wing to having only as much hull as X-wing

Y-Wing - less hull in the board game than the TIE bomber has (in the computer game it has more)

Headhunter - has over twice as much shields in the board game compared to the computer game

Tie Fighter - has as much hull as the X-wing (in the computer game it has a lot less)

A-wing - has as much hull in the computer game as a TIE defender (in the board game it has less)

And so forth.

Wouldn't you just take all Stealth Devices, and basically become invincible barring some ridiculously terrible defense roll?

Lt Blount says hai.

I guess that title card should include an extra 3 or 4 agility and cost an extra 10-20 points. Sorry Blount

I guess that title card should include an extra 3 or 4 agility and cost an extra 10-20 points. Sorry Blount

Meh, Blount's Ion Pulse missile still hits.

What happens after that however... that's a different story.

Blount + Ion Pulse would be a very very very hard counter to the single Defender list.

Blount + Ion Pulse would be a very very very hard counter to the single Defender list.

If he wasn't in a headhunter that blows up when you sneeze.

If he wasn't in a headhunter that blows up when you sneeze.

True, but he only needs to get one shot off. Then the other 80 points of the list get to do the cleaning up.

The best "fix" for the defender right now is to play with more than 100points. Then you can add additional cannon fodder to the pretty expensive defenders.

The best "fix" for the defender right now is to play with more than 100points. Then you can add additional cannon fodder to the pretty expensive defenders.

In this vein, I think the advanced fix is a defender fix since it gives some great wingman ships to fill out the list.

In this vein, I think the advanced fix is a defender fix since it gives some great wingman ships to fill out the list.

Yup, Vessery's going to love flying alongside ATC TIE Advanced.

Cannon slot: Sequenced Ion Cannons (not limited to Defender)

When making a primary weapon attack add 1 red die to your roll. If the attack hits, you must cancel 1 hit result to add an ion token to the target, if possible.

Thoughts?

Way too powerful. 4 dice means almost everyone will get ioned easy. Plus up to 3 hits/crits damage as well? I'd say keep it at a 3 dice attack, but allow up to 2 normal damage from it and/or one ion token for each damage (so possibility of double ion on a large ship).

I still think just making a Linked Ion Cannon cannon upgrade that lets you fire ion cannons and your primary weapons in the same round is the simpler solution.

I still think just making a Linked Ion Cannon cannon upgrade that lets you fire ion cannons and your primary weapons in the same round is the simpler solution.

It's been done with the Y-wing, it's not gonna happen again. The best solution, however, is a FAQ that gives the Defender +3 in all stats as well as adding evade and boost to actions and a systems slot and double EPT to all generics. And maybe cloak, just 'cause.

Honestly, gunner1764's suggestion seems the best; some native way for Defenders to double down on Focus tokens would be nice (although it would probably instantly propel Rexler to God-tier)

I don't think it will propel Rexlar to god-mode. His ability only triggers on hull hits and when he can take an action, so stress, blockers, and anything with a small amount of hull is largely unaffected, as it will likely die anyway at that point. So the only small base ships that this change would really hurt are Ys, Hwks, bombers, etc. A case could be made for Interceptor aces, since they typically only take a hit at a time depending on dice. Of those, Rexlar would kill them anyway (except fel and maybe carnor)

It would however be a benefit on large base turret ships, which is what dominates the meta. And it would allow the ability to come into play more often. Ive probably played 20 games with rexlar and triggered the ability 4 or 5 times, and it was usually not a game changer.

We would definitely see it trigger more, but it would still be at the opportunity cost of defense and only useful on less than half the playing field, and you still have to pay the points to get him into the list.

How about something like, "super duper advanced targeting computer" when defending, if you have a T/L on the attacker you get a free evade token.

Honestly, gunner1764's suggestion seems the best; some native way for Defenders to double down on Focus tokens would be nice (although it would probably instantly propel Rexler to God-tier)

I don't think it will propel Rexlar to god-mode. His ability only triggers on hull hits and when he can take an action, so stress, blockers, and anything with a small amount of hull is largely unaffected, as it will likely die anyway at that point. So the only small base ships that this change would really hurt are Ys, Hwks, bombers, etc. A case could be made for Interceptor aces, since they typically only take a hit at a time depending on dice. Of those, Rexlar would kill them anyway (except fel and maybe carnor)

It would however be a benefit on large base turret ships, which is what dominates the meta. And it would allow the ability to come into play more often. Ive probably played 20 games with rexlar and triggered the ability 4 or 5 times, and it was usually not a game changer.

We would definitely see it trigger more, but it would still be at the opportunity cost of defense and only useful on less than half the playing field, and you still have to pay the points to get him into the list.

You might want to check the FAQ. There are a few crits that work with his ability.

It's interesting to think what ships have been significantly altered.

B-Wing - gone from having more hull than Y-wing to having only as much hull as X-wing

Y-Wing - less hull in the board game than the TIE bomber has (in the computer game it has more)

Headhunter - has over twice as much shields in the board game compared to the computer game

Tie Fighter - has as much hull as the X-wing (in the computer game it has a lot less)

A-wing - has as much hull in the computer game as a TIE defender (in the board game it has less)

And so forth.

Believe it or not, I actually like what FFG have done with the stats in several cases. In the PC sims, the B-Wing is a straight upgrade from the Y-Wing. Once the B-Wing is available, there is not a single reason to use the Y-Wing at all (they were BTL-A4 models in that series, so no turrets). Also, it was also almost as fast as the X-Wing, and had ions and more torpedoes, so it also kind of made the X-Wing obsolete. (Well, that did FFG transfer to the miniature game too...)

The A-Wing is quite close to what it was in the sims, only that its two laser cannons were somewhat more effective there than they are in this game. It is the Defender the one that has wrong stats.

It was basically a faster A-Wing with B-Wing shields, Interceptor attack power, and Gunboat ions. It's stats would have been 3, 3, 2, 5. But I guess 5 shields behind 3 agility would have increased the price quite a lot more that it already has.

Beyond that, one of the main assets of the TIE Defender was its tractor beam, and its absence is maybe one of the reasons that makes FFG's T/D underwhelming compared to LucasArts's T/D.

Now, the tractor beam worked by aiming it to the enemy fighter, then the fighter couldn't change bearing, so it couldn't evade at all, although neither could you, since you had to fly in a straight line to keep your target in the tractor beam.

I understand why FFG didn't bring that mechanic here. In the multiplayer game "X-Wing vs TIE Fighter", using the tractor beam against your friends felt quite cheap, because the other couldn't do anything against it once it was 'trapped'.

In this game, the "ionized" effect has a similar flavor, but they can still boost or barrel roll. I guess the closest we could have would be a T/D equipped with Ion Flechette Cannon, that deals both an ion token and a stress token, but no damage.

There you have another version of the tractor beam:

Tractor Beam Weapon

Cannon, TIE Defender only

Attack 3, Range 1-2

If this attack hits, the defender is assigned an ion token and a stress token;

then cancel all dice results; and you may perform a primary weapon attack.

Cost: 7

Actually, the Defender would have been 3/3/3/8 if it went by the 200SBD shields that it had in the original TIE Fighter game, or 3/3/3/4 going by the nerfed version (100 SBD Shields, and significantly lower maneuverability) in X-wing Alliance and later.

There you have another version of the tractor beam:

Tractor Beam Weapon

Cannon, TIE Defender only

Attack 3, Range 1-2

If this attack hits, the defender is assigned an ion token and a stress token;

then cancel all dice results; and you may perform a primary weapon attack.

Cost: 7

A. Tractor Beams weren't limited to Defenders.

B. Defenders carried Tractor Beams and Ion Cannons. Making the Tractor Beam a cannon means it can only have one.

Personally, I would like it if the Tractor Beam made it so that it made a ship's Green maneuvers were White, White maneuvers were Red, and Red maneuvers were disabled.

That way, the ship could still maneuver somewhat, but not without taking Stress.

Honestly, gunner1764's suggestion seems the best; some native way for Defenders to double down on Focus tokens would be nice (although it would probably instantly propel Rexler to God-tier)

I don't think it will propel Rexlar to god-mode. His ability only triggers on hull hits and when he can take an action, so stress, blockers, and anything with a small amount of hull is largely unaffected, as it will likely die anyway at that point. So the only small base ships that this change would really hurt are Ys, Hwks, bombers, etc. A case could be made for Interceptor aces, since they typically only take a hit at a time depending on dice. Of those, Rexlar would kill them anyway (except fel and maybe carnor)

It would however be a benefit on large base turret ships, which is what dominates the meta. And it would allow the ability to come into play more often. Ive probably played 20 games with rexlar and triggered the ability 4 or 5 times, and it was usually not a game changer.

We would definitely see it trigger more, but it would still be at the opportunity cost of defense and only useful on less than half the playing field, and you still have to pay the points to get him into the list.

You might want to check the FAQ. There are a few crits that work with his ability.

Not sure what you are trying to say here? Technically all crits work with the ability...but thats not my point.

My point is for ships with low hull, Rexlar or the rest of the squad will kill it outright in yhat round as opposed to needing to spend a token to flip the damage cards. Meaning that a second focus token wouldnt propel him to "god-tier," as it is only going to have a real impact on roughly half the ships you could face in any given match.

Would it make his ability good/better? Absolutely, but it wont be broken. Fel, Vader, Corran, Chewie, etc. all have strong abilities, and I think that second token would bump his into line with those while at the same time fixing the defenders overcost and defense problems.

Sorry if this has been brought up before, I haven't waded through all 9 pages yet.

What about the following idea as a defender title?

- Title: Linked Cannons- when using a [cannon symbol], do not cancel dice results after assigning a token

This would allow defenders to hand out stress or ion tokens while still inflicting damage, and would differentiate it from the BTL-A4 title. Just need to figure out how to word the card correctly so that the title doesn't hand out a free extra damage as well.

Thoughts?

Sorry if this has been brought up before, I haven't waded through all 9 pages yet.

What about the following idea as a defender title?

- Title: Linked Cannons- when using a [cannon symbol], do not cancel dice results after assigning a token

This would allow defenders to hand out stress or ion tokens while still inflicting damage, and would differentiate it from the BTL-A4 title. Just need to figure out how to word the card correctly so that the title doesn't hand out a free extra damage as well.

Thoughts?

When a Cannon you are attacking with would cancel dice results, (alternate: Cancel or modify dice results) instead do damage normally.

The alternate would nerf Manglers and buff heavy lasers.

Yes but those cannons cost more on an already expensive ship.

We would actually see flechette/ion cannons in use as a cheap way to mitigate range bonus & hand out stress/ion to boot.

With something like that I would run both the named guys & give an ion flechere combo.

It would give imperials a more viable control list instead of space cows & bounty hunter IMO.

It's a great idea & hope ffg take note.