https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=BqpJvey-7-s

(Arguably, we didn't get either of those things right, but it's a great ad.)

YUP... was a good weekend for me, hope the rest of you can say the same.

Good food, freinds, and toys... wins.

Don't hate... been 200 years now ole fuddies.

:lol:

Cerrio-what-what-blub-blub...

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=BqpJvey-7-s

(Arguably, we didn't get either of those things right, but it's a great ad.)

It's not so much that you didn't get them right - it's that you think you're the only folks that have got them

I love how the truth of the matter is that the whole 'tea party' business was actually about organised crime's smuggled tea being more expensive than legally imported tea.

At that time the east india company had a massive surplus of tea and slashed prices leaving the smugglers with tons of tea they'd paid over the odds for...

Fair enough, but the British government had decided to tax those legal tea imports to pay for all its wars, and we were slightly miffed at the thought of being taxed without having a vote in parliament. If the "organised crime" syndicate happened to be the ringleaders of our revolution, so be it - we ended up getting our own official government instead of being told we were incapable of governing ourselves. (Which again, arguably we're not the best at - but at least we're not governed by another.)

You know, I could see Obama flying an F-18 (or F-22 now I suppose) into the laser of a giant mothership for America.

Bush not so much. Clinton would ram a lancer frigate into something , sure, but not an F-18 into a mothership.

Happy Independence day, just don't pretend that you were revolting against an oppressive government - history has proven that one false.

You know, I could see Obama flying an F-18 (or F-22 now I suppose) into the laser of a giant mothership for America.

Bush not so much. Clinton would ram a lancer frigate into something , sure, but not an F-18 into a mothership.

Happy Independence day, just don't pretend that you were revolting against an oppressive government - history has proven that one false.

Of the three "presidents" listed above, Bush was the only one with actual piloting experience (Air National Guard), and Obama could not "lead" America out of a wet paper bag. Not even sure if he even knows how to drive himself, except for riding a bicycle in mom-jeans.

While I accept that Bush does have the flight experience, so far Obama's leadership seems to have done great things for the US. - at least from this neutral observer.

While I accept that Bush does have the flight experience, so far Obama's leadership seems to have done great things for the US. - at least from this neutral observer.

this neutral observer does not think obama has leadership or has done great things for the US (or the world)... Heer Darius, do you have an example of obama-greatness?

On behalf of America everywhere, thanks for remembering our special day.

I'm so glad I'm not president. Yeah, I could play real-life games of Air Superiority, but would the rest of the world agree to settle territorial disputes via games of Axis & Allies? I know some countries would prefer games with more granular levels of simulation, some countries would prefer games with less ("how about we play Rock-Paper-Scissors for our independence?"), and then there are the oddballs who complain that dice could never simulate the true intricacies of warfare and demand we LARP the whole conflict with live ammunition.

Socialized healthcare, improved economy, more or less pulling the US out of 2 wars and under his administration Osama bin laden is kaput.

Seems ok to me.

Oh yeah, under his administration federal gay marriage approved. There is that too.

I should add that if this post becomes about politics then I retract everything, this isn't the place.

I should add that if this post becomes about politics then I retract everything, this isn't the place.

Too late, lol. Let's just head that off at the pass and return to history (which has no political ramifications whatsoever, I'm sure...). Maybe a moderator could move this to Off-topic?

Happy Independence day, just don't pretend that you were revolting against an oppressive government - history has proven that one false.

I'm not trying to characterise it as "oppressive" by any stretch - the Sons of Liberty were certainly fomenting discontent for their own ends, but at the same time, not being able to vote for the laws that governed us was a valid point of contention, I think. When you say "history has proven that one false," of what specifically are you thinking, and what is your evidence?

You know why most Americans don't own kettles, don't you?

We don't need them; we make our tea by shoving it into the harbor.

Fermenting discontent for their own ends just about sums it up. The founding fathers continued to toast King George throughout the war of independence.

The whole thing about no taxation without representation.. well:

https://books.google.ca/books?id=tW_Cy4uvqTgC&pg=PA11&dq=salutary+neglect+navigation+acts&cd=7&hl=en#v=onepage&q=salutary%20neglect%20navigation%20acts&f=true

Then of course this: https://books.google.ca/books?id=lZUHwGxyI2oC&pg=PA111&dq=stamp+act+ben+franklin&cd=2&hl=en#v=onepage&q&f=false

As Gadge also mentioned that whole boston tea party, well https://books.google.ca/books?id=XWbcrS9SV-sC&pg=PA175&dq=tea+party+smugglers&lr=&cd=19&hl=en#v=onepage&q=tea%20party%20smugglers&f=false

I found that quite interesting too.

Not saying that the British were entirely the good guys, but we weren't Mel Gibsonesque baddies either. As per usual this was a matter of personal gains and politics, just like most wars revolutions and schizms in history.

I'd like to add that the reason Americans traditionally drink coffee is because after the independence war t hey considered Tea unpatriotic.

Given that tea is awesome, and coffee is nasty I'd not count that one as a win.

Anywho, back to discussing the MKII TIE Engine, or why Imperials really have the best ships now.

I'm afraid as a citizen I can't say Obama has been anything but horrible, but back to history, yea, I've always found the Revolution to be kind of pointless, but I'm still proud to be American :D

EDIT: But tea tastes soooo much better than coffee :D

A long time ago i once said to my good friend Jon Russel (then an officer in the US air force):

"You know the great thing about being British Jon, we never really lost an important war to a foreign nation in a very long time"

and he said

"What about the revolutionary war gadge?"

and I said

" Ah, Jon , old boy, you misunderstand. That was a police action or 'civil war' between two groups of British people, the winning group of colonial Brits not being internationally recognised until after the war, so we sort of lost a war with ourselves"

"fair enough, " said he, smiling.

(and as Jon could tell i was joking then as i'm joking now, so please don't get defensive about it anyone).

The irony of the whole 'independence' thing is that despite it we've always had two incredibly allied countries (likewise with canada and australias more peaceful seperation) and that *culturally* its a combination of British and American culture in equal measures that now has a 'new empire' across most of the world.

I travelled in Africa where people spoke to you with American accents by learning English watching 'friends' and wore 'manchester united' soccer shirts. You could get more for your money with sterling or dollars than you could with the local currency.

We're probably closer together as nation states these days as we ever were in the 1800s.

Obama made me late to work the other day (helicopter landing blocking my work route), so there's that.

Thanks, Obama. Thanks a lot...

The irony of the whole 'independence' thing is that despite it we've always had two incredibly allied countries (likewise with canada and australias more peaceful seperation) and that *culturally* its a combination of British and American culture in equal measures that now has a 'new empire' across most of the world.

I travelled in Africa where people spoke to you with American accents by learning English watching 'friends' and wore 'manchester united' soccer shirts. You could get more for your money with sterling or dollars than you could with the local currency.

We're probably closer together as nation states these days as we ever were in the 1800s.

It actually really wasn't until WW-1 that we came closer together, heck, in the 1800s we actually supported Napoleon against the UK and that's what started The War of 1812 (I'm not sure if it's named differently in the UK or if it's even considered separate from the Napoleonic Wars)

To a degree but the UK sent 'advisors' to the south during the ACW iirc (we may have sent them to both sides to make sure we were in with the winners )

Oh yes the war of 1812, the one where we burnt down the whitehouse... thats why it had to be painted white.

Sorry about that

We'd have done a total number on you but we were a bit busy kicking napoleon around spain at the time and could only send our third rate troops over to give you a kicking

(joking again patriots... )

But yes i think you're right its WWI where the real collaboration comes in. I don't actually think we've not assisted each other in a war since. Even in vietnam we sent our SAS over covertly to train your marines as we'd won two jungle wars in Malaya and Borneo (in which im sure we had some discrete help from your chaps as well) and we were pretty good at sitting in stinking swamps ambushing terrorists by that point... we'd pretty much been doing it since 1941 at that point with Burma, Korea, Malaya, Borneo, Sarawak etc etc

I know for a fact my fathers friend who was with british special forces in malaya was 'seconded' with some mates to the Australian SAS for the vietnam war so we could assist without being seen to take sides

I think my main point is that while a little light hearted ribbing never hurts, we're actually culturally very closely aligned these days. I spent a fortnight in Canada recently (and while not the US being on the border its not that different around Toronto) and didnt feel 'alien' in any way.

To a degree but the UK sent 'advisors' to the south during the ACW iirc (we may have sent them to both sides to make sure we were in with the winners )

Oh yes the war of 1812, the one where we burnt down the whitehouse... thats why it had to be painted white.

Sorry about that

We'd have done a total number on you but we were a bit busy kicking napoleon around spain at the time and could only send our third rate troops over to give you a kicking

(joking again patriots... )

But yes i think you're right its WWI where the real collaboration comes in. I don't actually think we've not assisted each other in a war since. Even in vietnam we sent our SAS over covertly to train your marines as we'd won two jungle wars in Malaya and Borneo (in which im sure we had some discrete help from your chaps as well) and we were pretty good at sitting in stinking swamps ambushing terrorists by that point... we'd pretty much been doing it since 1941 at that point with Burma, Korea, Malaya, Borneo, Sarawak etc etc

I know for a fact my fathers friend who was with british special forces in malaya was 'seconded' with some mates to the Australian SAS for the vietnam war so we could assist without being seen to take sides

I think my main point is that while a little light hearted ribbing never hurts, we're actually culturally very closely aligned these days. I spent a fortnight in Canada recently (and while not the US being on the border its not that different around Toronto) and didnt feel 'alien' in any way.

If they had sent the 42nd, they would still control the US :D