Well, in the background itself, nothing really changed - it is more a question of focus, and in the past couple years GW focused almost exclusively on Space Marines (gothic grimdark) rather than places like Necromunda (80s cyberpunk).

Various redesigns such as new "Tempestus Scions" certainly do not help either, though ...

But I don't think the Tau make the Imperium feel any more evil or backwards than the Eldar already did, especially as it's rather easy to give the Tau a dark spin as well. The "Greater Good" is perfect for justifying smaller atrocities and/or infringements, as the real world has proven again and again, and is proving again right now with stuff like the Patriot Act etc.

I really liked older version (focus) of 40k. Now i think that 40k is more grotesque than grimdark. Especially when you read any new codex when all is so grimdark to the point than no civilization can properly function.

Well, in the background itself, nothing really changed - it is more a question of focus, and in the past couple years GW focused almost exclusively on Space Marines (gothic grimdark) rather than places like Necromunda (80s cyberpunk).

Various redesigns such as new "Tempestus Scions" certainly do not help either, though ...

But I don't think the Tau make the Imperium feel any more evil or backwards than the Eldar already did, especially as it's rather easy to give the Tau a dark spin as well. The "Greater Good" is perfect for justifying smaller atrocities and/or infringements, as the real world has proven again and again, and is proving again right now with stuff like the Patriot Act etc.

Oh yeah the Tau have their own skeletons in the closet, and they certainly aren't the good guys, it wouldn't be grimdark if there were "Good" guys... But the Tau do have some anti-imperium traits built into their background:

The Imperium of Man

• Technologicaly stagnated, mysticism.
• Xenophobic
• Combination of modern/outaded military tactics
• Totalitarian regime
• Relgious fanatism

Tau empire:

• Technologicaly advanced, progressive
• Willingness to work will all race (I.e. The Federation from star trek)
• Fight more like modern (2015 amerika) humans do than the humans of the Imperium
• Totalitarian regime, but better at hiding it.
• Closest they get is swooning over the ethereals

Also the Tau tech is comparable with those of the imperium, just more advanced and less esoteric stuff like warp drives.

Eldar on the other hand are space elves with soul powered constructs, pathways trough alternate dimensions, psy reactive materials that are grown, and more of that weird stuff. The Eldar outlook on life is to different from a human to compare, the tau are a lot more "human" to the point that they are the only race to employ propaganda that goes beyond:

• Join us chaos is good for you. (Chaos)
• We are on your side mon-keigh, no honest. (Eldar)
• head on pike (everyone else)

I actually don't mind the original concept of the Tau being genuine good guys. It was a pleasant breath of fresh air in the growing "grimdark for grimdark's sake" that was beginning to irritate me at the time. Especially when what could be inspirational beacons of light later on ended up being horrible caricatures thanks to talentless hacks (s. Draigo).

I actually don't mind the original concept of the Tau being genuine good guys. It was a pleasant breath of fresh air in the growing "grimdark for grimdark's sake" that was beginning to irritate me at the time. Especially when what could be inspirational beacons of light later on ended up being horrible caricatures thanks to talentless hacks (s. Draigo).

Speaking of Matt Ward: I heard one reviewer of age of sigmar, describe the game's backstory as: "Bring back matt ward. If you know anything about wxarhammer 40k you know how bad this is."

I actually don't mind the original concept of the Tau being genuine good guys. It was a pleasant breath of fresh air in the growing "grimdark for grimdark's sake" that was beginning to irritate me at the time. Especially when what could be inspirational beacons of light later on ended up being horrible caricatures thanks to talentless hacks (s. Draigo).

I'm a big fan of the Tau being actual good guys too. At least, as far as you can be good guys when you're desperately consolidating power for your Empire to fight against unending hordes of tyranids and orks. :-D

I think it's fun that instead of just being total jerks like everyone else in the setting, they're relatively nice, but have other huge disadvantages (lack of FTL).

Tau? I hope they all burn.

I've learned to accept them in the 40k universe, but I'm not a fan of them.

Tau? I hope they all burn.

I've learned to accept them in the 40k universe, but I'm not a fan of them.

Well, you know what they say:

"Different warp drives for different hives."

Different strokes for different folks?

ha.

ha.

*cough*

The Tau opening an important door for contrasts that allow you to add depth to the setting is the main reason I like them, and I prefer them 'good'. Don't get me wrong; I don't want my 40k noblebright, but if everything is dark, the darkness is less appealing and becomes more a monotonous sludge where nothing really stands out anymore on an emotional or aesthetic level. Good guys have a place in Grimdark. They're important, because they're doomed.

I actually don't mind the original concept of the Tau being genuine good guys. It was a pleasant breath of fresh air in the growing "grimdark for grimdark's sake" that was beginning to irritate me at the time. Especially when what could be inspirational beacons of light later on ended up being horrible caricatures thanks to talentless hacks (s. Draigo).

Speaking of Matt Ward: I heard one reviewer of age of sigmar, describe the game's backstory as: "Bring back matt ward. If you know anything about wxarhammer 40k you know how bad this is."

Hahahaha, I just had a look at it in detail and I'd agree, if AoS weren't obviously a very...pricey joke. I'm really hoping they get the 80s style back, mind, mixed with a dose of actual British humour. AoS is a bit, well, I'd say childish but even as a kid I'd have disliked it. Oh, I know...A bit too DRUNK for me!

Oh, I know...A bit too DRUNK for me!

Are you referring to those rules that give mechanical benefits for the player doing silly things?

Totally. Reminds me of when we still gamed with a keg of ale on the table.

Totally. Reminds me of when we still gamed with a keg of ale on the table.

Ok, yea; I couldn't believe that either.

Players have been yelling "Blood for the Blood God" and "WAAAAGH" during games for years, and it got really old really fast. Now they've mechanically incentivized it!?

In my opinion, Initiative should be decided by who shows up in the best cosplay appropriate for their army.

In my opinion, Initiative should be decided by who shows up in the best cosplay appropriate for their army.

Now THAT would at least be comparatively fresh.

Three things:

1. The hot chick cosplaying as a deamonette/ dark eldar would always get Initiative.
2. My girlffriend won't let me play 40k anymore if that were the case.
3. And i'd get banned from the gamestore if i'd show up in my Deldar Wrack cosplay.

:D

Three things:

1. The hot chick cosplaying as a deamonette/ dark eldar would always get Initiative.
2. My girlffriend won't let me play 40k anymore if that were the case.
3. And i'd get banned from the gamestore if i'd show up in my Deldar Wrack cosplay.

:D

1.) Right up until some PC weasel became "offended"

2.) Wife in my case but, yeah!

3.) THAT would be interesting! got pics?

On the OP: Deathwatch does not list the SM's as having the chem-geld talent. Therefore it is unlikely that they are physically unable to perform. However, their monastic lifestyle and hypno-conditioning probably heavily reinforce a celibate lifestyle! It is likely though, that the massive genetic tinkering that makes a Space marine what he is also renders them Sterile!

As to the SOB: Sisters, as Lynata pointed out, also live a Cloistered lifestyle with very little opportunity for "Mingling". This makes them much like Catholic Nuns (With Flamers! ) today and like said Nuns, some have been known to fall from the path. Of course this also explains the Sisters Repentia! Some sisters can and have fallen from the path of purity in "his" eyes! For these, there is the redemption among the Penitent! Such failures would be rare though! Most Sisters are pretty fanatical in their faith to begin with!

Nunnery's in history often had orphanages attached and a lot of the children were the Nuns own offspring. Likewise a lot of old Nunnery's in Britain are next to streets called 'Lovers Lane' because this is where the Nuns met their lovers.

Three things:

1. The hot chick cosplaying as a deamonette/ dark eldar would always get Initiative.
2. My girlffriend won't let me play 40k anymore if that were the case.
3. And i'd get banned from the gamestore if i'd show up in my Deldar Wrack cosplay.

:D

1.) Right up until some PC weasel became "offended"

2.) Wife in my case but, yeah!

3.) THAT would be interesting! got pics?

None that wouldn't get me banned from the forum Nah just kidding.

Ps: good point about the Space marines and chem geld.

Tau? I hope they all burn.

Spoken like a true follower of the Emperor! BURN THE XENO FILTH!

+++ Tought for today: Despise the Tau! They will sacrifice your babies to their gods! +++

The Tau were an icy cool blast of fresh air amidst the arid, burning, stinging ichor of WH40k.

Frankly, I'm less than pleased by the latter day revisionism that has made them xenocidal.

Also: Someone mentioned that the Tau use modern tactics... I would argue that they use near future tactics with a strong and hefty dose of Mongolian horde: The Tau, in their first Codex, like the Mongols, were stated as not valuing land militarily. The idea of dying on land purely to hold onto it was anathema. The value of land was purely to make a kill from. Like the Mongols (and as many imagine a near future open conflict), the idea is that the force is light, adaptive, fast, very agile, and prefers to keep the enemy at a distance.

Frankly, I'm less than pleased by the latter day revisionism that has made them xenocidal.

If you're referring to that bit from Dawn of War Dark Crusade that occasionally gets bandied about by Tau "haters", keep in mind that the way the franchise works, this is just one interpretation among many -- not so much revisionism as simply a (potentially) different take on the setting. Although I will also have to point out that I do not actually consider partial sterilization to be at odds with Tau doctrine:

When we look at it pragmatically, it makes some sense to reduce a troublesome population to a more manageable size for easier reeducation before allowing them to breed fully again in a now-reshaped culture more conforming to the Tau way of life. Sterilization allows you to achieve this without having to kill someone, so on the long run you might prevent a lot of unnecessary deaths by reducing the amount of unrest.

Alternatively, it could simply be demographic planning: if there is an overpopulation elsewhere in the Empire, then you can send them as settlers to the newly subjugated human world whilst simultaneously "scale back" the human population by reducing the number of births (and letting troublemakers disappear). I'd regard it as perfectly understandable if the Tau prioritise their own citizens before conquered subjects when it comes to finding people a home.

I love the Tau tactics. They're such a nice change from:

Orks: Charge the enemies head on

Chaos: Charge the enemies head on (after some corrupting)

Tyranids: Charge the enemies head on (after some genestealing)

IG: Meatgrinder time!

Space Marines: ... tactics?

Did I miss anyone?

Oh, I guess eldar have tactics. But is being mysterious really a military tactic?

Altough tatctics is hooting at stuff and then land your delvish APC in the path of charging enemies.

I wonder if you could make an entire drone army...

Tactics is spamming D-cannons. What are you ta-...oh, right, our less evolved cousins. Enjoying your primitive sharp objects, still?