I don't know, the more I read about mists the less interested I become. I sort of feel like we're just getting a half expansion that's maybe a step above a H&M.

You mean... a small box?

Map tiles

New terrain type(s)

3 monster groups (vs the usual 2 in a small box)

3 LTs (vs the usual 1 in a small box)

Tainted cards

Shop cards

Travel Cards

0 heroes (vs the usual 2)

0 classes (vs the usual 2)

1 act campaign (at least equivalent to a usual small box)

To me, that looks just like a small box, but with a little extra OL stuff, and a little less hero stuff.

Well, it's a small box for sure. Just check the price, it's like all the other small boxes.

Well, it's a small box for sure. Just check the price, it's like all the other small boxes.

"...like the other small box ". Increased price, like MoR.

Anyways, you and Zaltyre are right at it, small-box-like price and content.

Indeed. Manor of Ravens is a bit higher

I mean... I get why people are disappointed.

Map tiles- that you'll most likely only see in the MoB campaign.

New terrain type(s) - On the map tiles used in the MoB campaign.

3 monster groups (vs the usual 2 in a small box)- Equal to an H&M Pack.

3 LTs (vs the usual 1 in a small box)- The tokens for them really. You'll have to get the figures in the lieutenant packs. And they can only be used in one Act.

Tainted cards- Only usable in MoB

Shop cards- A Positive!

Travel Cards - Always good.

0 heroes (vs the usual 2) - Why? More people play heroes and would probably like to see new ones. Not really a positive.

0 classes (vs the usual 2) Again, why? The class choices still need to be equaled and we haven't had any new ones for awhile.

1 act campaign (at least equivalent to a usual small box) -No one knows what to expect here.

The lack of heroes and hero classes makes it feel like this box is missing quite alot. Honestly, what's more appealing then this actual box expansion is the lieutenant packs. Of course, we shouldn't complain, because at least they're coming out with something.

The main thing the game needs now is more quest content and I think that is what this box set offers more of than other small boxes. Heroes especially are not needed with the huge number of H&M boxes. There are already a lot of heroes, classes and OL decks available, although admittedly the two hero classes to balance out the archetypes would have been nice.

It claims a full one act campaign with ten encounters. That is 3 more encounters than LotW and double the number of encounters in Trollfens and MoR. It will be probably be around 7 or 8 new quests, which is a lot for a small expansion and it is a new format for a campaign, although it's not clear what that format is yet. Together with Heirs of Blood it seems that the focus of the non-H&M expansions is having more quests and campaigns. Unlike the quest book, a box expansion can introduce new mechanics via cards (tainted, terrified) and new terrain and gives scope for more custom maps or even future crossover content like co-ops or quest books which could require this expansion (like the most recent co-op needed LotW).

Well, quite honestly, that's probably the main reason why anyone would get it, to play through the campaign. Just think of it as coming with the components needed to play it.

I can understand the disappointment as well- this expansion definitely offers less in terms of content that spans all campaigns than other small boxes. However, it also offers much more content overall than previous small boxes- the difference is that it is mostly expansion specific.

It is a different direction for the small box expansion. I happen to like it, but I can understand why not everyone would. I also don't mind so much because i can create additional content that uses these components.

I, for one, am really looking forward to the extra tiles provided by this new expansion. I love Descent tiles artwork and they are perfect for D&D and custom campaign.

I am also looking forward to the tainted cards. I got the feeling that it could bring a Shadow of Nerekhall likeness to this expansion which is so much appreciated.

I, for one, am really looking forward to the extra tiles provided by this new expansion. I love Descent tiles artwork and they are perfect for D&D and custom campaign.

Yeah, sure. I also used them, but those from first edition. Never played with the 2nd edition tiles. It's cool to give new meaning to the props. In my custom game, the corrpted tiles prevent using of healing spells (I don't remember how it works exactly on first edition to tell the truth). The corrupted glyphs acts as traps, shoting fire (red), lightning (purple) or poison bolts (green). The sarcophagus could contain tresure or a undead...or both. There are a lot of things we can do, and that's the maisn reason I don't give up the 1st edition

I, for one, am really looking forward to the extra tiles provided by this new expansion. I love Descent tiles artwork and they are perfect for D&D and custom campaign.

It would be really cool if there was a random map generator that used the tiles you own to create random things... oh if I only had more knowledge on programing

I, for one, am really looking forward to the extra tiles provided by this new expansion. I love Descent tiles artwork and they are perfect for D&D and custom campaign.

It would be really cool if there was a random map generator that used the tiles you own to create random things... oh if I only had more knowledge on programing

You mean like the Quest Vault?

http://tools.fantasyflightgames.com/descent/

I, for one, am really looking forward to the extra tiles provided by this new expansion. I love Descent tiles artwork and they are perfect for D&D and custom campaign.

It would be really cool if there was a random map generator that used the tiles you own to create random things... oh if I only had more knowledge on programing

You mean like the Quest Vault?

http://tools.fantasyflightgames.com/descent/

Well the quest vault is not a "random map generator" per say but you can found some awesome stuff like cool quest, full campaign and new game mods all crafted from the genius brains of our fellow forum users.

I know that Zaltyre put his heart out with a campaign of his own, you should try it out.

There is also plenty of other incredible stuff in there.

Only complaint I have is that it is a little hard to navigate. (maybe I just didn't find the trick as of yet)

If you are trying to find a specific campaign (like mine) you can search by author. If you are just looking for a fun map to play, you can browse by like- the top rated ones were actually made by FFG. I hoped/heard at one point they wanted to include a better way to explore the quest vault, but I haven't seen any development with that yet.

Meaningless death is a disappointing part of 2nd edition, it's one of the things 1e did much better.

D2e did many things better than 1e, especially when comparing core sets.

Imperial assault took the best bits from both systems.

If you don't mind the change is settings it's well worth a try.

I do not agree that death is meaningless. Many quest have a harsh time cap so losing an action can really influence the outcome. Losing Items while only having a limited amount of gold/drops is really harsh and makes killing heroes too attractive for the overlord. The way it is now in the 2nd edition the overlord has to weight between killing a heroes and his objective.

Yeah and it makes for a hell of a boring game. The very moment heores started to be immortal Descent lost most of its charm. Lets face it, this game is based on its theme - plastic minatures, colorful tiles, flavour text - all in attempt to evocate feeling of fantasy adventure, and suddenly all of this goes into hell when you realize this game is not an adventure where your heroes are risking lifes to go deep into dungeon to defeat some evil monster and powerful, all knowing overlord uses monsters to hunt them in dark corrdior of dungeon. You realize Descent 2ed. is just a lame racing game where your heroes are just a racing vehicles and overlord tries to blow their tire and force them to one round pit stop. It is so lame, it totally ruins theme.

I may sound bitter, but you must understand that Descent 2ed. on its very box promises dungeon delving adventure; meanwhile it is totally awful racing game with ruined theme.

I think this is mostly due to the removal of the exploration mechanic from 1st ed where there was hidden info and whole parts of the dungeon that were not revealed until they opened a door. It also gave the over lord something fun to do knowing he had hidden info they were not privy to. Another advantage to this is if you want to doctor the game if they are getting frustrated and loosing you can adjust things behind the scenes and the heroes don't know so they don't feel cheated or pity from you etc. You can't do any of this in 2nd ed due to the everyone knows all and can read the entire quest with no hidden info. So when you are crushing them you can't do anything but say sorry guys this is just how the game is made.. My group actually never wanted to play again after our first run through the campaign. And it sucks because I loved to play 1st ed with a different group that is no longer available and now I can never get them to play descent. Even imperial assault is a hard sell to get them to play.

1st had issues but it was better in some aspects than 2nd imo. They focused too much on getting the play time down and cut too much out of the core game. I think it would have been better to just make it easier to pause the adventure at any point with out the need for such short quests and quick land slide victories to facilitate stopping points. In 1st ed I actually just took photos of the entire map on my table and then packed it all up. When we would continue our game at a future session I would put the pics on my tv and then recreate the map and setup so we were where we left off. It was so much fun I really didn't mind the time it took.

For the purposes of a more first edition style experience, I created my Legendary Play Variant Rules . Which can handle pre-made quests and official first edition quests, but also includes a random map generator.

Well, I'm facing some problems in my life, and my game time was really reduced. At this point, I can say I played really few quests for the core game, 1st edition, back in the day, and had to quit playing the 2nd on the middle of the shadowrune campaign.

At first, I really liked the 2nd edtion, but then I've got a bit disapointed with the 'rush to end/win', like you mentioned. But this doesn't mean I'll quit for good or stop buying related stuff. I'll just make my house rules and apply to make it a exploration game, like the first was. Besides, let's say so, I was 'raised' playing pen and paper rpgs, so the role of an overlord willing to WIN is not that good for me. I prefer to act like a judge, keep the game fun to play than be a guy with win desire. And though it's against the idea of the game, I don't bother. There is so many cool miniatures, tiles, etc, we can create a lot of good stuff with it, on our own.

Well, I'm facing some problems in my life, and my game time was really reduced. At this point, I can say I played really few quests for the core game, 1st edition, back in the day, and had to quit playing the 2nd on the middle of the shadowrune campaign.

At first, I really liked the 2nd edtion, but then I've got a bit disapointed with the 'rush to end/win', like you mentioned. But this doesn't mean I'll quit for good or stop buying related stuff. I'll just make my house rules and apply to make it a exploration game, like the first was. Besides, let's say so, I was 'raised' playing pen and paper rpgs, so the role of an overlord willing to WIN is not that good for me. I prefer to act like a judge, keep the game fun to play than be a guy with win desire. And though it's against the idea of the game, I don't bother. There is so many cool miniatures, tiles, etc, we can create a lot of good stuff with it, on our own.

My group are mostly rule lawyer types and really like to play as accurately to the rules as possible. I'm a lot more flexible and would love to try out some home rules but its just not possible for me atm. I think its funny that most of them really disliked descent and now will never touch it as opposed to playing it again with home rules to make it something fun for them. They wont even touch the co-op kits with me after the campaign was such a bad experience for everyone. I'm the only one in the group who had experience with 1st ed and heroquest so I think thats a big factor in how I am still excited to mold the game into something that is fun again.

How do you add a more exploration feel back to the game for your group.

For the purposes of a more first edition style experience, I created my Legendary Play Variant Rules . Which can handle pre-made quests and official first edition quests, but also includes a random map generator.

Sounds really cool i'll have to check it out.