Lets get one thing straight right now.

These are not concert tickets to see the Stones, Led Zeppelin, or Metallica at a single appearance concert.

These are tickets for a niche hobby toy soldier convention. The hobby being tabletop wargaming...a gobby that has to fight to survive in this world of video games, online entertainement, and MMORPG'S.

Tabletop gaming ALWAYS needs all the help it can get. Xwing is a healthy game in a dying hobby.

Increase the slots available.

Dagobahdave and cleardave;

You are correct that event planning for something this size is not something a person just does with no education and no experience, at least not with any expectation of success. On the other hand...

My wife and I have been involved in the planning and execution of many conventions, some first time conventions, as well as successful business launches. It is a learned, professional skill, and something that a company of FFG's size should be willing to invest in either through hiring the appropriate people in-house or contracting event organizers. There are several excellent alternatives in Minneapolis/Roseville. Many large weddings have attendance far in excess of 256 people (or 512, or even 1000), not to mention pretty much every convention everywhere. Conventions we have done have had in excess of 5000 people, so I can assure you that it is not difficult to adequately plan for something this size. The Radisson hotel less than a block away from FFG can easily accommodate an additional 256 (or even 1000) players on a single day. At $70 per person, a 512 person event will bring in ($70 x 512 = $35,840). I could rent the CENTURY LINK CENTER in Omaha for $25,000, and that is a SPORTS ARENA with seating for 20,000 people in addition to all the floor space you could possibly desire.

Keeping the entire event in a single location is a laudable goal, but the compromises being made here are far too extreme. I'm sure there is a local game store somewhere in town that is also inadequate to the task. Preregistration would allow FFG to secure adequate facilities and plenty of time to plan for this event. What we have here are people who created an inflexible plan, one designed to compel miniatures players (generally more willing to take time off/travel for events) to take a Wednesday time slot with the idea that they would then stick around for the weekend and pick up a secondary game such as any of the more casual card games. I am not just complaining for the sake of it, I am hoping to catch the attention of someone in a position to do something about it so that plans can be remade and errors corrected.

FFG with X-Wing has been the posterchild for a company that did not anticipate success of this magnitude and has struggled to adapt. From major, major logistics issues, to brain dead decisions (remember the playmat near-fiasco?) FFG has struggled to come to grips with the rockstar property they control. Fortunately, FFG has also shown itself to be a company that actually does care about it's customers and is not too proud to admit a mistake and take steps to fix it. If we were talking about GW I wouldn't have bothered, but I have some hope that FFG will be willing to step up.

The post above is entirely valid - assuming all the assumptions it makes about FFG motivations and capabilities regarding the event are correct.

Missing the point. That the "opening bands" also sold out is not the issue. The issue is that space for the main event was curtailed.

Relatively speaking, yes, but not in comparison to last year (not disagreeing that maybe something could have been done differently this year and I don't disagree it was a mistake). Part of what I left unsaid and was maybe missed in my point is that there is demand for the other games is outstripping their space as well and, while I don't know if there's as much frustration and effort in those other games from the players, it's a bigger challenge than just X-wing.

Feel free to copy and forward to organized play. The more voices the bigger an impact we have.

We as the X wing community would like to request a second flight be added for X wing at world's. We understand logistics is an issue. Most of us look forward to coming up and playing X wing with people we have talked with online, met in forums or played with online. These people are from all over the world and this is our chance to come together and enjoy playing this game we love. Thank you for your consideration.

A Fix for X-Wing single flight. Armada has 2 days. Really?!?!?!?! Why? Take day 1 away from Armada. Make flight 2 on Thursday and push back the finals to Friday. I don't know any store running Armada tournaments. So why does it have 2 days and X-Wing with the hugest following 1. I'm not a big brain but I would like someone to explain to me why.

A Fix for X-Wing single flight. Armada has 2 days. Really?!?!?!?! Why? Take day 1 away from Armada. Make flight 2 on Thursday and push back the finals to Friday. I don't know any store running Armada tournaments. So why does it have 2 days and X-Wing with the hugest following 1. I'm not a big brain but I would like someone to explain to me why.

Because a single game of Armada takes 2x the space of X-Wing and about 2x the time. So even with fewer players it takes more time and space.

Yeah, just moving Armada isn't going to fix the space issue. AGOT Joust and SWLCG both running (heck, I would say even still having one going) would prevent the max of X-wing happening on day 2.

A Fix for X-Wing single flight. Armada has 2 days. Really?!?!?!?! Why? Take day 1 away from Armada. Make flight 2 on Thursday and push back the finals to Friday. I don't know any store running Armada tournaments. So why does it have 2 days and X-Wing with the hugest following 1. I'm not a big brain but I would like someone to explain to me why.

Because the Armada event won't be able to finish in one day due to the round time given by FFG. It is the same tournament spread over two days, not two seperate "flights".

I've yet to play a game of Armada... I hope its worth 2 days.

I've yet to play a game of Armada... I hope its worth 2 days.

It might not be, but there's nothing to do there if you don't get into the top 16 in X-Wing (besides Epic, which I'm just not excited about either).

Hi everyone.

I am the Spanish guy who wrote in the FB event (just for those who read me already). for those who has not, let me summarize. We are a group of 6 Spanish player who is planning to attend to World's. We had already planned and purchased everything, we were set, seated on the PC, and got our coupons just a few minutes after the registration opened, but we received the vouchers with different lags...That resulted in that only 2 of us got a seat in X-Wing. We did all get a seat for other events, but our core is X-Wing, the others are just to "exploit the trip".

We are foreigners, we live abroad, and therefore we need to plan with even more time everything (and you guys have the $ raising and our € is flooring hehe).

It is more than sad to see that we are not the only ones with this problem so far, though we are a big group of players who are really wanting to attend and cannot (I am including here everybody in the same situation).

What I really like is that people who is already in, or event that is not playing X-Wing has empathized and is supporting us. That should be enough for FFG for reconsidering the event and to see that they have the best community in tabletop games and consequently, everyone who is willing to attend, should be able to.

I strongly think FFG will take a backstep and will fix this situation, I really do, and that we'll meet you there in November, and why not, exchange some laser shots!!

This is the TL:DR from a post in the other World's thread. Basically, think about the product and customer service you generally receive from FFG. Are they poor? Are they lacking? Are you treated like cattle with wallets?

The answer (I'd hope so, anyway) is no. FFG gives you a very finely crafted product and backs it up with top notch customer service.

Let's get this out of the way: X-wing is a very enjoyable game with miniatures that redefined the quality of appearance that was possible with prepainted miniatures.

But is it "finely crafted"? Not even a close. Even three years down the line they can't hit a production deadline to save their lives. The rules are a mess of half-definitions, contradictions, and outright handwaving from developers who don't seem to actually know their own rules. Is the customer service good? If you limit "customer service" to how well they deal with misprints and missing parts, they're awesome. If you consider a more holistic view, and look at things like how well they run their OP structures and handle rules issues, then no - it's not top notch customer service - it's honestly pretty horrible. Honestly, dealing with missing parts is about the only thing they actually do well.

Really, while I am again sympathetic to KO's concerns, I'm not sure why anyone expected anything different from FFG at this point. Their handling of pretty much anything with the game has been pretty horrible, demonstrating a complete disconnect with the actual competitive side of X-wing and no familiarity with what it takes to actually run events.

I can understand having space limits for events, (still cant figure out why X-wing made a move to a Wednesday).

I guess thing thing that helped me miss out this year was how different signing up was from previous years. I remember having all the time in the world after tickets went on sale the previous years. So on my lunch break Monday took a trip to the bank, not even thinking there would be no chance to get my ticket after work that day.

I get back to work and see on FB that they sold out already.

Even then we have a few local guys who tried but due to the tech issues on FFG site they never were able to get theirs.

Thread support.

Hi everyone.

I am the Spanish guy who wrote in the FB event (just for those who read me already). for those who has not, let me summarize. We are a group of 6 Spanish player who is planning to attend to World's. We had already planned and purchased everything, we were set, seated on the PC, and got our coupons just a few minutes after the registration opened, but we received the vouchers with different lags...That resulted in that only 2 of us got a seat in X-Wing. We did all get a seat for other events, but our core is X-Wing, the others are just to "exploit the trip".

We are foreigners, we live abroad, and therefore we need to plan with even more time everything (and you guys have the $ raising and our € is flooring hehe).

It is more than sad to see that we are not the only ones with this problem so far, though we are a big group of players who are really wanting to attend and cannot (I am including here everybody in the same situation).

What I really like is that people who is already in, or event that is not playing X-Wing has empathized and is supporting us. That should be enough for FFG for reconsidering the event and to see that they have the best community in tabletop games and consequently, everyone who is willing to attend, should be able to.

I strongly think FFG will take a backstep and will fix this situation, I really do, and that we'll meet you there in November, and why not, exchange some laser shots!!

BTW, the same thing happened to the Icelandic contingent. Only 1 of 5 or 6 got the X-Wing event ticket even though all of them got the general tickets.

I also have a bunch of friends that missed out on signing up for Worlds that were definitely planning on attending (of which a few who have never been). Unfortunately I see this as hurting the growth of the game significantly. I know for myself, the beginning of the year is store champs, and TONS of people were getting hyped for X-Wing. Then there was a bit of slow down in between Store Champs and Regionals (the first SW regional for SoCal peoples is this weekend). This has sparked hype again. Then there is Nationals, which helps spark hype for sure, but is expensive, so its a toss up whether people can attend or not (I won't be able to this year per financial decisions). So, from August 2015 to Jan 2016 (the next Store Champs season), there is only one big official event bar local fall kit tourney's: the World Championship. If you missed out on attending Worlds due to not getting a chance to sign up, that is a LONG time frame to harbor resentment. Yes, the hardcore fans will keep playing for sure, but their spark for the game won't quite be the same. They probably won't champion the game as hard, and the community is what sparks interest for the game. This will trickle down to the casuals, that are trying to decide if they should invest in the game (especially with the golden opportunity of the ep VII coming out). Whereas, if you get another 200 people to fly out to Minnisota in Nov, FFG will send back 200 more hyped recruiting officers for the game.

Hopefully FFG will realize soon, and open up another flight (offsite) on Wed at least, shouldn't be THAT hard to get a couple more people to run a side flight. Besides, I would bet that most of the people that missed out on X-Wing won't sign up for a World's ticket if they only get to play Armada, IA skirmish, a LCG, etc. I like Armada and IA skirmish, but if I could only sign up for those two games and not X-Wing, I wouldn't be going to Worlds, that's for sure. So that's $60 per person, not the $10 extra for another event.

Based on accommodations last year, they might be able to fit 128 people in their side event location. I'd be shocked if they can fit another 256. They'd have to purchase a ton of mats (from themselves) but that is a manageable issue if they plan ahead.

The biggest issue though is that the secondary location is not up to par with the primary: mainly there are no concessions there. Anybody with the bad luck to end up in that flight would be missing out on much of the experience. Whether that lack matters depends on the individual. Better something than nothing, right? But the experiences would not be equal.

This is the TL:DR from a post in the other World's thread. Basically, think about the product and customer service you generally receive from FFG. Are they poor? Are they lacking? Are you treated like cattle with wallets?

The answer (I'd hope so, anyway) is no. FFG gives you a very finely crafted product and backs it up with top notch customer service.

Let's get this out of the way: X-wing is a very enjoyable game with miniatures that redefined the quality of appearance that was possible with prepainted miniatures.

But is it "finely crafted"? Not even a close. Even three years down the line they can't hit a production deadline to save their lives. The rules are a mess of half-definitions, contradictions, and outright handwaving from developers who don't seem to actually know their own rules. Is the customer service good? If you limit "customer service" to how well they deal with misprints and missing parts, they're awesome. If you consider a more holistic view, and look at things like how well they run their OP structures and handle rules issues, then no - it's not top notch customer service - it's honestly pretty horrible. Honestly, dealing with missing parts is about the only thing they actually do well.

Really, while I am again sympathetic to KO's concerns, I'm not sure why anyone expected anything different from FFG at this point. Their handling of pretty much anything with the game has been pretty horrible, demonstrating a complete disconnect with the actual competitive side of X-wing and no familiarity with what it takes to actually run events.

Well...I don't want this to sound like a personal attack, so please don't take it as such.

Just want to point out that, if you honestly believe FFG is doing a substandard job, then how did they get you hooked on the game? Buhallin, I'm never on the forums enough to really get a reputation (nor do I use an avatar, which allows me to lurk in the shadows) but I've seen you on the forums for a while and I know you've dedicated a lot of time to the game. Sure, there have been some hiccups, but they always get handled. FFG actually responds to customers and rules questions (I don't believe all game companies do that) and they also replace parts that are completely the fault of the end user (broken game boards (non x-wing), ships, lost dials/components, and that's just from personal experience). They go far beyond fixing their mistakes, as you claim.

I'd be willing to stand fast and argue with you that X-Wing is a finely crafted game. Maybe it's a clash of definitions: I don't consider finely crafted to be free of mistakes and tweaks...that isn't possible, or we'd still be on Wave 2 at this point. Keeping up with the demand for releases (how many complaint threads do we get of "boo boo bee boo! I want a new announcement!") the game has struck a good balance of rate of new content vs stability of system.

Whatever...I'm getting off on a tangent now and, as mentioned, I don't want to turn this into a personal attack. Long story short, I firmly disagree with you. I feel FFG has it together but based on your comments, I don't understand why you would bother with the game? Value your time, dude. If you really believe your statements about FFG having "horrible" customer service and handling of anything to do with the game, why are you still here? Please reconsider.

One thing I think everyone should consider...I don't play either, but I see a lot of people coming to X-Wing from Magic The Gathering and...what is it? Warhammer? (40k? Warmachine? One and the same? I'm afraid I'm ignorant to the difference). Anyway, I've seen people self proclaim themselves as "refugees" from these other games...the main "atrocity" I see cited is money. Those other games get out of control on their releases or are exorbitantly priced. X-Wing, on the other hand, is very reasonably priced and much more in control of what comes out.

The downside is: FFG makes less money from you. Sure, X-Wing may be super popular, but if everything that comes out is reasonably priced, they aren't making crazy amount of money off of you. I'm not going to pretend I understand the financials of FFG, but I'm going to assume that money they make is being reinvested into more content, both X-Wing and otherwise. I play a lot of boardgames and the ones that stick with me (didn't realize this until recently) are all FFG games. So...maybe this won't make me so popular, but I'd rather have FFG spend money on new, "fine crafted" games backed by "top notch" customer service that lose money on an event to make everyone happy for a day.

EDIT: It's anecdotal and an assumption either way, but I haven't seen a convincing argument that moving to a venue they don't control, especially after tickets went on sale, would be profitable.

Just want to point out that, if you honestly believe FFG is doing a substandard job, then how did they get you hooked on the game? Buhallin, I'm never on the forums enough to really get a reputation (nor do I use an avatar, which allows me to lurk in the shadows) but I've seen you on the forums for a while and I know you've dedicated a lot of time to the game. Sure, there have been some hiccups, but they always get handled. FFG actually responds to customers and rules questions (I don't believe all game companies do that) and they also replace parts that are completely the fault of the end user (broken game boards (non x-wing), ships, lost dials/components, and that's just from personal experience). They go far beyond fixing their mistakes, as you claim.

I think you may have missed the part where I said X-wing is a pretty enjoyable game. It is - enough to get me to invest heavily and stick around for a good long while.

But "fun" and "finely crafted" are two different things. X-wing's core rules are an abomination of half-considered concepts and poor definitions. Compare the X-wing rulebook to something like Conquest, Armada, or even the SWLCG (that came out around the same time). Nor do they fix these problems - my favorite hobbyhorse is that turret upgrades are simply broken - they don't work in the rules. FFG has known this for years, and it still sits. Getting a rules response from them is a lottery, and FAQs release on an almost random schedule and often have often ignored existent issues because of release timing (they're getting better about this, but not much). When we do get rules updates they're frequently without context or even actively contradict themselves.

The formal OP system has been poorly handled from top to bottom. Sure, tourney kits are nice, but last year's regional locations were oddly distributed and a lot of people thought it showed a complete lack of awareness of the actual player base. This year's store championships included absolutely insane round requirements that were simply impossible for venues to meet.

Yes, X-wing is cheap, but it's also an exploitive distribution model that forces people into buying $15 models to get a $0.03 card. I would actually agree with you that this is indeed finely crafted, just not to the benefit of the players.

X-wing is a good game, and an enjoyable one, and I enjoy playing it so I stay. But it qualifies as "finely crafted" only in terms of the miniatures themselves (and even they were often a mess early). You're welcome to have whatever standard you want for the term, but there's no way they meet it objectively.

Yes, X-wing is cheap, but it's also an exploitive distribution model that forces people into buying $15 models to get a $0.03 card.

I honestly hate this argument. You are under no compulsion to purchase anything to play the game other than the Core Set. Anything outside of that is a choice you make the play the game the way you want to play it. Nobody compels you to play the game competitively - that is a choice as well.

$15 for a blister is hardly exploitative considering that this is their business model for this game - not selling card packs - especially considering what you get compared to other games, and IA is even cheaper for expansions.

Yes, the hardcore fans will keep playing for sure, but their spark for the game won't quite be the same. They probably won't champion the game as hard, and the community is what sparks interest for the game. This will trickle down to the casuals, that are trying to decide if they should invest in the game (especially with the golden opportunity of the ep VII coming out). Whereas, if you get another 200 people to fly out to Minnisota in Nov, FFG will send back 200 more hyped recruiting officers for the game.

This is the part that I was alluding to earlier but didn't spell it out: you can't buy this kind of targeted advertising. It would be business-savvy on their part to make it an unlimited attendance with pre-registration by a certain cutoff date, then plan for that player count accordingly. As KO says it could be challenging but not impossible.

Practically speaking, you can parallel one giant tournament into several smaller tournaments. You can also add an additional day for an extra tournament "stage". I.e. for example for 1024 registered players you could do this approach:

Day 1: 4 parallel Swiss tournaments run concurrently, ~256 players per. Intentionally split up Nationals / Regionals winners evenly between these 4 to keep them as "even" as possible. The hard part is getting enough manpower and TOs to judge 4 events, but you have plenty of time to plan for this. Top 32 from each tournament (128 total) advance to Day 2. Highly ranked players from Day 1 get 1 or 2 byes into Day 2.

Day 2: Single 128 player Swiss tournament, 6-7 rounds. Final Cut into the elimination rounds day 3.

Day 3: Elimination rounds. You can tailor the cut size however you would like. My personal preference is a Cut to Top 44, with the Top 16 from Day 2 getting a bye in round 1, and the Top 2 from Day 2 also getting a bye in round 2. Total elimination rounds would be 6 for this case, with Top 16 essentially starting in round 3.

It all comes down to motivation and manpower. These are both dictated by high level business priorities, and it is on the CEO Christian Petersen which way to steer the ship.

I think you may have missed the part where I said X-wing is a pretty enjoyable game. It is - enough to get me to invest heavily and stick around for a good long while.

Yes, X-wing is cheap, but it's also an exploitive distribution model that forces people into buying $15 models to get a $0.03 card. I would actually agree with you that this is indeed finely crafted, just not to the benefit of the players.

X-wing is a good game, and an enjoyable one, and I enjoy playing it so I stay. But it qualifies as "finely crafted" only in terms of the miniatures themselves (and even they were often a mess early). You're welcome to have whatever standard you want for the term, but there's no way they meet it objectively.

Yeah, I think we're just gonna have to agree to disagree on this one. I didn't miss any of your post, but to me, "horrible" is a pretty strong word goes hand in hand with "unacceptable under any circumstances" and then made an assumption about your meaning. To me, if something has a horrible aspect, it gets dropped/abandoned and I can no longer to afford spending time at it.

Regarding the exploitive X-wing model...I disagree about the value of the cards, even if that's the only thing you want out of the pack. The card would be worth $0.03 if it were blank or had some non-descript design on it, but considering it has art as well as rules/content that required people and time to develop, I'd say they are worth a lot more than $0.03.

And yeah, I guess us arguing our definitions of "finely crafted" is completely fruitless and unquantifiable. I still think FFG manages X-Wing exceptionally well, especially when compared to other games, but to each their own I guess.

Off the tangent....for the sake of argument, if FFG can't fix this World's space issue to everyone's satisfaction, what if World's was semi-invitational? I mean, it's supposed to be the premier X-wing of the year and determine the world champion. I participated in 1 store championship this year and placed in the bottom half. Skipped the other tourney's and missed the chances to register for all my possible Regionals. However unlikely as it may be, what if I attended Worlds somehow manage to win? Cool...who the 'eff is that guy? Wouldn't that be a disappointment? What if I am not, in other tournaments, consistently able to win, I just got lucky with some of the pairings and dice rolls? Is that really worth the title of World Champion?

I don't think so. I'm cool with keeping everything open up until World's, but World's should have some sort of "proving yourself" aspect of it. At least in my mind, anyway.

The hard part is getting enough manpower and TOs to judge 4 events, but you have plenty of time to plan for this.

Offer acrylic to TO/judge volunteers and this won't be a problem.

Off the tangent....for the sake of argument, if FFG can't fix this World's space issue to everyone's satisfaction, what if World's was semi-invitational? I mean, it's supposed to be the premier X-wing of the year and determine the world champion. I participated in 1 store championship this year and placed in the bottom half. Skipped the other tourney's and missed the chances to register for all my possible Regionals. However unlikely as it may be, what if I attended Worlds somehow manage to win? Cool...who the 'eff is that guy? Wouldn't that be a disappointment? What if I am not, in other tournaments, consistently able to win, I just got lucky with some of the pairings and dice rolls? Is that really worth the title of World Champion?

I don't think so. I'm cool with keeping everything open up until World's, but World's should have some sort of "proving yourself" aspect of it. At least in my mind, anyway.

It takes a lot more than luck pairings and dice rolls to win at any tournament, especially at Worlds. Even if someone made the cut on luck alone (that is, getting luck for SIX ROUNDS beforehand), going up against five rounds of the the world's best players isn't going to end well. Plus . . . don't we all kinda like an underdog story? If someone obscure wins Worlds, I think that gives hope to a lot of others. Just because you don't post on every forum and win every tournament doesn't mean that you're a poor player. Not to mention that limiting the tournament would actually cut down the number of people and therefore the number of rounds, thus making it MORE likely that luck would play a role in the outcome.

And . . . I'm sorry, Worlds doesn't have a "proving yourself aspect?" If you can make the cut, that means you're one of the best 32 (or 16?) X-Wing players IN THE WORLD, out of everyone ever, and that you were almost perfect through six rounds of play. You shouldn't have to prove yourself to get in; the tournament lets you prove yourself.