Our regular four-player group are now fully into the swing of playing melee and we're noticing a definite 'pecking order' for the titles has appeared. In fact, we're considering one of the titles somewhat overly powerful compared to the others. Once this thread has run its course I'll say what our pecking order is and which title we consider to be the pick of the bunch.

Of course, I'm generalising here. There will of course be circumstances where title X takes on additional importance for whatever reason.

But I'm interested in hearing what other people's experiences are of the relative strengths of the titles, whether the titles tend to get selected in a particular order or not, whether there are titles which rarely get picked (and if so, why), and whether anyone can identify my mystery "OP" title that our first player will invariably reach for.

Depends on the deck I'm playing, and what opponents I think might be doing/playing. Generally, when my deck is running as it's supposed to I'll try and grab the Crown Regent for it's effect. Which is also my guess as to your groups top pick too.

The ability to redirect a challenge can help you maintain a balance and divert the worst-case challenge against you in a phase. Or it can force someone to attack a preferred player, etc. Balancing it with the opposes/supports mechanic can really make it a powerful tool, as well as table-talk negotiation leverage.

That pretty much says it right there. If my deck is working the way it is supposed to I don't normally need any of the challenge boosts. The gold and card draw are of limited use mid-game, and I should have all the influence I need in play. so if my deck is performing properly then yes Crown Regent is the title I'm going to try and take every time in the mid-game and endgame.

That said, if you have high-initiative plots in your deck, you can do a lot to insure you get the title you need the most when you need it the most. I've built very successful decks that had leveraged the fact I knew I'd get one or another title every turn. So an extra two influence or a boost to my intrigue (in my meta the titles the other players took the least often because Stark, Lannister, and Baratheon were the most popular houses with these players) was something I could depend on and which I used to great advantage.

So it is possible to build a deck that can make more use out of the less chosen titles, but outside of that, Crown Regent is the way to go after the first few rounds unless you haven't been able to get your draw engine working or finding yourself gold choked.

As promised, I'll reveal that it was indeed the Crown Regent title which stands apart from the others in terms of popularity in melee. It wins Power challenges, it allows a challenge to be side-stepped, and it means you don't have the problem of supporting somebody you'd rather be attacking.

On the other hand, Master of Whispers I think I've seen selected precisely once. Ever. So the Crown Regent needn't worry too much about being opposed either by that distinctly unpopular title. Ah, poor old Master of Whispers... supports a popular title and is supported by a relatively unpopular title (at least in our games - that may change though). Also, opposed by another popular title. It's just not a title worth taking too often. Very situational.

The titles in general add a nice layer to the game, but could do with a re-think imho. However, two replies tells me that either nobody plays melee, or that nobody thinks it's an issue, or that I'm alone in thinking they're not balanced.

Now, where did I put my Overzealous Scout...

I think they are relatively balanced. You'll notice we both talked about what section of the gamee you are in. Even if my deck is working well I'll take the extra gold or card draw early in the game if only to deny my opponents that boost. Hate-drafting as it were. Everything is situational, and the more you guys play melee, the more you'll realize that picking a title that makes someone strong unable to attack you is often better than redirecting a single challenge. Who before me picks things is more important a deciding factor than almost anything else.

Remember, you can't redirect a challenge if there are no other legal targets, so in a 3 person melee picking Crown Regent can be a nearly useless choice, and in 4 person still only have limited effectiveness.

In my group is popular to win Inntiative and decide that next player is First Player. Titles balaned this a little - you can be a last player or take very good Titles.

Laban Shrewsbury said:

I think the titles are fine as they are. Sure, some are useful in more situations than others and get picked more, but I don't think any are too strong or weak relative to the others. And I think some people have said that they'd like to see the titles' effects changed periodically but I prefer that they be stable (I instead like what FFG did with the GJ expansion, giving a whole different set of titles to be played with a game variant).

I agree with LGR - the titles are fine the way they are.

Its funny - the first year or so we played, both in NY and in MD the draw/gold/INF always got picked first three - the challenge ones were distinctly unpopular. Even Crown Regent. It wasn't until after about a year of playing the CR seemed to get selected first three. Now - its a pretty popular choice.

Personally, I'll almost always take the draw title if I am anything under a relaible three cards per turn engine. Mid game, late game - unless its a support/opposition issue - I'll take free draw anytime.

Laban Shrewsbury said:

No offense, but it wasn't much of a mystery. Crown Regent has the most unique title effect, gives people a certain feeling of control and closes a gap in STR for the power challenge (which almost everyone outside of Baratheon players tend to treat as an afterthought when building decks). It is the title that adds the most unique dimension to Melee play and fits most naturally into the typical deckbuilding and play styles of most players. It's the only real "control" title in a game that favors "control" strategies. Lord Commander pretty much requires a specific (and intentional) build strategy to make the most use of it and the others simply fill holes that, as others have said, you are not going to be concerned about if the deck is clicking on all cylinders.

That said, I don't think it is the most powerful title. I have won Melee games without ever choosing the Crown Regent title. I have lost Melee games where I have had it almost every turn. I have seen Master of Whispers chosen pretty consistently, either by people who were trading off responses to intrigue challenges (and finding ways to initiate multiple challenges) or who were more comfortable being supported by the player who used a lot of influence and thus went for Hand of the King a lot (this hasn't happened much in the LCG era...).

The titles themselves are not unbalanced; they compliment the decks that are brought to the table. If one title seems to be less popular or never used, I'd be more inclined to say that a complimentary deck has not been brought to the game than that there is something deficient in the title.

Also, they lack of replies was not an indication of melee's popularity, but more of the diffinativness of the first reply, especially this part:RJM said:

crown regent is nice, but so is the gold, draw, lord commander (i've used this to hurt the person w/ the crown regent many times as they pick this the turn they want to win, find an unopposed military challenge that i redirect to myself and take a power from them...), and in my lanni deck master of wispers is great (it helps lanni claim power easier w/ 2 opposed players and makes my 2 STR int icon guys 5 STR...). Targ should fall all over themselves for hand of the king...

I don't think you can claim an extra power for the second opposed player. (Whispers)

Stag Lord said:

Correct, but it does give you more options in that with two opposed players, you're more likely to be able to win a challenge against one of them.

I've taken Hand of the King just to keep the Targ player from being able to get it. Protect my attachments and low strength characters? Yes that is worth the title choice, at least some of the time.

Played a melee yesterday for the first time

+1 for the Crown Regent fans

and, by the way, the melee game is awesome