The Raider involves a lot of painting, and has a lot of parts.

If (and this is speculation) FFG found during their quality controls that the Raider's wings or other parts were not properly mounted and were falling off during shipment, then that could have necessitated some retooling and repair. I know a lot of people (myself included) were frustrated with the engines that fell off of the CR90.

Why frustrated? You could always glue them and they would never fall off. I have only one that comes off, and I always take it out and put it on the table if my aft section is crippled

I'd be frustrated because I've paid for a pre-built and painted model, not something I'm expecting to have to put together myself. For the sort of dollars FFG wants for these models I'm not expecting them to need repairing right out of the box.

Sure, I'd just fix it myself rather than complain or send it back, but I'd still be annoyed and frustrated that I had to do it.

Please FFG I beg you, please don't punish those of us who cannot attend Gen Con.

This is a flawed premise. It begins with an assumption of entitlement, namely that you deserve early access to game pieces. You do not.

Early access is just that -- early. There is an expected date of release for FFG's new products (which, for the Raider, is floating at this point) and after that date those products will available to purchase by anyone. By attending GenCon you have the opportunity to purchase products before the official release date. I attended GenCon last year and, after waiting in a line that snaked around most of the convention hall, I bought a Decimator, a YT-2400, and Rebel Aces from the FFG store. These were expressly not-legal for tournament play until after their official release date, so the effect of buying at GenCon was being able to unwrap these new toys and play some friendly games a little early. Competitively, the ships were available for everyone to use at the same time.

In contrast to last year, I won't be attending GenCon 2015. The timing just isn't going to work out. By not attending GenCon, I won't be able to buy FFG products before they're officially released. This is a missed opportunity, which is disappointing, but the opportunity was mine to take by attending GenCon. It wasn't a priority for me this year, so like everyone else who is not attending the convention, I'll have to wait to buy the new ships until they're available in stores. I don't believe I deserve to purchase new ships before they're released just because I want them very badly, nor do I deserve the same early access as all the people who bought passes and booked hotel rooms and traveled hundreds of miles just to attend the convention -- and then waited hours in line.

Buying things before they're available in stores is an earned privilege for attending GenCon and suffering the stresses of attending a large convention. A lack of privilege is not a punishment.

At least you live up to your forum name.

I am not asking for the ability to purchase at the same time as gencon, i am just hoping, that its not 4 months later like wave 5 was.

If read my post with an open mind and a condescending ass you would have realized that.

The new 40K board game was at the printer a week or 2 after the raider hit the printer (which was on the boat and put back to at the printer)

Now call me crazy, but this is a new game, a board game with lots of pieces and cards and stuff. It is shipping now, and the raider is still at printer.

I know I am going to draw flak for not being patient and all that stuff, but how does a brand new board game hit the printer after a game piece for an established game and is completed in record time?

I can only guess that they are not giving us all the information on the raider and are holding it for a special release, say Gen Con. which if it goes the way wave 6 did, where Gen Con people got theirs months before it was released to the rest of us, will really tick me off. I can understand holding off until the regionals are at least done. But for the love of the Emperor, please do not have another Gen Con repeat unless you release the raider within a week or two after Gen Con.

Please FFG I beg you, please don't punish those of us who cannot attend Gen Con.

thank you

Hang in there buddy,

At least you live up to your forum name.

I am not asking for the ability to purchase at the same time as gencon, i am just hoping, that its not 4 months later like wave 5 was.

If read my post with an open mind and a condescending ass you would have realized that.

You said that it wasn't fair that some people would get to buy new ships before you, and that if you have to wait for the official release date you're being punished. You're telling me now that instead of wanting to buy new ships early too, you just don't want anyone to be able to buy them sooner you. That's not much better. I understand why you feel the way you do, but there's a reason why this early release happens.

As others have explained, there are supply reasons why only a limited number of ships would be available for purchase at GenCon. I'm pretty sure I had a similar argument with someone last year. The Raider has suffered a number of setbacks, and as you've probably noticed from the rash of "filler" articles lately, FFG is struggling to maintain interest while they try to get these ships to market. Being able to sell a limited run of ships at a convention of GenCon's size generates new enthusiasm before they're able to release them to stores. The privilege of buying from this limited run comes from attending GencCon, which generates publicity. After, and even during the convention, there's a flurry of articles and forum unboxing posts, and FFG is able to ride that wave of enthusiasm until they're able to get the full run of ships to stores. The reason I'm not very sympathetic here is because you're thinking about this from the wrong point of view. FFG is stalling for time, not being witholding for fun.

At least the announcement of the Team Epic side-event at Worlds means that FFG is anticipating a release before that date.

November at the latest, guys!

We don't know FFG is stalling. That's an assumption.

It's a conspiracy!!!

The longer FFG keeps the Raider out of the hands of the Players, the more they think people will buy Armada. My group is waiting for the Raider to play EPIC PLAY! I WILL NOT invest to another miniatures game.

A conspiracy against themselves?

To everyone accusing FFG of stalling, they have absoluely zero incentive to it. It's not being sold because it's not in their warehouses to sell. The most common theory is that they're running into quality issues at the factory. As for GenCon last year, Wave 5 and Rebel Aces were also not in their warehouses to sell because of the dock delays, so they airlifted some in for GenCon.

And for everyone saying they're holding it back for GenCon to skew accountancy charts, if that was their plan then they'd have put Q3 instead of Q1 on their announcement. Companies plan ahead.

We don't know FFG is stalling. That's an assumption.

Remember that the Raider was announced in December of last year. First it was supposed to be out Q1, then it was bumped to Q2. Now it's June. Go to the product page and you'll the Raider is still listed as at the printer. It has been for many months, with no news but filler articles.

Why assume bad faith when it's much more plausible they're having problems getting the Raider to market? I'm fairly certain they wanted to have it out much sooner, and at this point it's been delayed so long they're hoping people still want it by the time they do get it to shelves.

Hype! Marketing! Star Wars! GenCon! Working!

Never ascribe to malice that which can easily be explained by incompetence.

Yes, it's clearly a conspiracy. It's not like FFG has EVER set a release date it's missed. I'm sure they're just waiting for GenCon 2019 to release those tile based play fields they announced a couple years ago. You know, really build up that anticipation.

At least you live up to your forum name.

I am not asking for the ability to purchase at the same time as gencon, i am just hoping, that its not 4 months later like wave 5 was.

If read my post with an open mind and a condescending ass you would have realized that.

You said that it wasn't fair that some people would get to buy new ships before you, and that if you have to wait for the official release date you're being punished. You're telling me now that instead of wanting to buy new ships early too, you just don't want anyone to be able to buy them sooner you. That's not much better. I understand why you feel the way you do, but there's a reason why this early release happens.

As others have explained, there are supply reasons why only a limited number of ships would be available for purchase at GenCon. I'm pretty sure I had a similar argument with someone last year. The Raider has suffered a number of setbacks, and as you've probably noticed from the rash of "filler" articles lately, FFG is struggling to maintain interest while they try to get these ships to market. Being able to sell a limited run of ships at a convention of GenCon's size generates new enthusiasm before they're able to release them to stores. The privilege of buying from this limited run comes from attending GencCon, which generates publicity. After, and even during the convention, there's a flurry of articles and forum unboxing posts, and FFG is able to ride that wave of enthusiasm until they're able to get the full run of ships to stores. The reason I'm not very sympathetic here is because you're thinking about this from the wrong point of view. FFG is stalling for time, not being witholding for fun.

You are twisting my words,

I said i hope they dont do the same thing they did with wave 6, which i edited to wave 5 because i dont pretend to be perfect or know all.

My op said not to wait as long as they did to release wave 5 after gencon. 4 months is not a short amount of time. Most of the games i play are with freinds and not tournaments, so i could give 2 fecal matters if its legal or not. Please do the release for gencon goers i never said not to and never said its unfair. I just made a statement that those of us who for whatever reason cannot make gencon feel the brush off to have to wait 4 months to be able to purchase a product that was finalized (they didnt change anything between gencon and general release did they?) and ready for the public.

OK, let me explain it so my words cannot be miss understood:

I am not against gencon release before general release

I am against waiting 4 months after

Maybe a month or so, but 4 months, no.

That is what i meant when i made the gencon statement.

Sorry for not being clear.

as to the comments of the raider needing to be hyped up by filler articles, how many people are drooling over this ship whether they put up these articles or not. this thing has been hot since the announcement. everyone I talk to wants this thing, the only thing holding them back is the price point.

I consider them teaser articles, cause they are teasing us with all the goodies that are coming with this ship. its going to be epic, get it? EPIC. that was puny.

Except when they make the call to fly product over, things can still change in the release of that product. Rebel Aces and Wave 3 weren't released too long after Gencon, and I don't think they expected Wave 5 to be released when it did.

What would you do if they didn't post this kind of info? Whiners gotta whine...

♦ Expansion release dates (waves, aces, epic)...

My youngest son's grown more than a foot in the 18 months he was born. I am now seriously worried about how we're going to get clothes for him when he's twelve years old and ten feet tall.

So you are saying your son is the CR90 Corvette at 18 months, and the Raider Corvette is your son at 12 years old. I hope you are not the one teaching him math, because that's just plain idiotic. You can't possibly understand what you've read as the two (son vs minis) are not at all the same thing. What makes you think the process for the CR90 Corvette and the Raider Corvette should be any different from each other, and why shouldn't they take the same time in the end? I hope you aren't holding your breath until Gen Con.

Gencon releases are fine. As long as they don't release ships or cards ONLY availble from Gencon. That would punish the majority of us that couldn't make it.

.

My youngest son's grown more than a foot in the 18 months he was born. I am now seriously worried about how we're going to get clothes for him when he's twelve years old and ten feet tall.

So you are saying your son is the CR90 Corvette at 18 months, and the Raider Corvette is your son at 12 years old. I hope you are not the one teaching him math, because that's just plain idiotic. You can't possibly understand what you've read as the two (son vs minis) are not at all the same thing. What makes you think the process for the CR90 Corvette and the Raider Corvette should be any different from each other, and why shouldn't they take the same time in the end? I hope you aren't holding your breath until Gen Con.

Ok. So now imagine the same thing, but instead of you, it's you. And instead of a bus, it's the point.

There is no raider. Just rid your mind of it's existence.

Never ascribe to malice that which can easily be explained by incompetence.

Yes, it's clearly a conspiracy. It's not like FFG has EVER set a release date it's missed. I'm sure they're just waiting for GenCon 2019 to release those tile based play fields they announced a couple years ago. You know, really build up that anticipation.

Oh, look who's back! And with a familiar phrase, no less.

Never ascribe to malice that which can easily be explained by incompetence.

Yes, it's clearly a conspiracy. It's not like FFG has EVER set a release date it's missed. I'm sure they're just waiting for GenCon 2019 to release those tile based play fields they announced a couple years ago. You know, really build up that anticipation.

Oh, look who's back! And with a familiar phrase, no less.

Is it Arnold Schwarzenegger? Because he did promise.

My youngest son's grown more than a foot in the 18 months he was born. I am now seriously worried about how we're going to get clothes for him when he's twelve years old and ten feet tall.

So you are saying your son is the CR90 Corvette at 18 months, and the Raider Corvette is your son at 12 years old. I hope you are not the one teaching him math, because that's just plain idiotic. You can't possibly understand what you've read as the two (son vs minis) are not at all the same thing. What makes you think the process for the CR90 Corvette and the Raider Corvette should be any different from each other, and why shouldn't they take the same time in the end? I hope you aren't holding your breath until Gen Con.

Ok so. Imagine you're running for a bus. You can see it at the stop, but the last person waiting has just gotten on so you know it's about to pull away and leave you. So you're running as fast as you can. But oh no! You trip! You catch your foot on the kerb and go sprawling! You skid down the pavement on one knee and tear your trousers and fall into the muddy gutter and as you're sat there, wet and dirty and bloody and embarrassed you see the bus pull away, blithely uncaring of your frustrating, ill-fated pursuit.

Ok. So now imagine the same thing, but instead of you, it's you. And instead of a bus, it's the point.

And just because you write a cute story about someone missing the bus/point doesn't make you point any more than worthless. Neither of the two Corvettes were ever growing any more than your son was manufactured in a factory. Your growing analogy is garbage.

He was comparing the extrapolation of his son's growth to your extrapolation of FFG's release schedule.

In the first 18 months of his life, his son grows very quickly. If you were to take that and project it forward in time (ie: you assume that he will continue to grow at that rate) then he'll be ten foot when he's 12. This illustrates the pitfall of extrapolation: you assume the trendline and all that influences it will stay the same and you need a good basis to asume that. Extrapolation works when you have a very large data set you're projecting forward a small amount (predicting average temperatures for the next three years based on the last fifty years). It rapidly breaks down when you do the inverse: predicting the next fifty years of temperatures based on the last three, for example.

Id guess painting is the main bottleneck at the "printer".

He was comparing the extrapolation of his son's growth to your extrapolation of FFG's release schedule.

In the first 18 months of his life, his son grows very quickly. If you were to take that and project it forward in time (ie: you assume that he will continue to grow at that rate) then he'll be ten foot when he's 12. This illustrates the pitfall of extrapolation: you assume the trendline and all that influences it will stay the same and you need a good basis to asume that. Extrapolation works when you have a very large data set you're projecting forward a small amount (predicting average temperatures for the next three years based on the last fifty years). It rapidly breaks down when you do the inverse: predicting the next fifty years of temperatures based on the last three, for example.

I stand by my Gen Con prediction and if it comes sooner I won't be disappointed. But I least I won't sound like I'm whining because it's not here already.