Hello!

I ran "Forsaken Bounty" last sunday and my folks are eager to play again next. I suppose I will run "Dark Frontier" but then I'll move to my own ideas. So we are on and rolling. In preparing for Rouge Trader premiere I desgned maps and props for space combat, and here is my question: is mechanic of space combat written with maps in mind? If so, does it use hexes or squares?

The rules allow for hexes or squares. It's your preference

I don't recall seeing hexes in my copy. There were squares and gridless maps in mine. How odd.

As an aside, I use the gridless map with minis option

I've been planning on using gridless with minis as well. Of course... I don't own any minis and I don't want to spend a whole bunch before I've played so I'll probably end up playing gridless with small paper cutouts.

I have map for space comabt almost done (it needs to be printed and laminated), as well as some props: planets, asteroids, debris . also I plan to copy images of ships from BFG rulebook, reduce them, print and glue on cardboard.

Time to get out the BFG playboard!They even has mini's for a rogue trader fleet,although the RT's ship is a cruiser.

I'm still working on a way to have proper 3d representation of ship combat. Filling the room with light smoke and setting up two or three video projectors programmed to create interference points of light in the room might just...

Honestly, is anyone here computersavvy enough to make a small program where the GM can place and move simple things like planets rocks, ships, warprifts etc in a 3d-grid, and display that on a normal computer screen in a way that allows me to rotate, zoom and move ships with a simple mouse/keyboard interface? Doesn't really need graphics, different coloured blips is allright (or all in green on black to give more ingame feeling). A bit like the combat interface that old Starwars strategy game where you created starfleets and fought over the universe. Maybe I should make a separate post for this request.

Mellon,

I don't know if you have a "good" answer to your request. But I have an easy answer for you-- check out what POVRAY can do. It uses a simple ASCII script to generate 3D ray-traced images. Using Excel or dBASE to store your objects, you can regenerate the script with different camera angles and object positions very quickly.

http://www.povray.org

djpeterso23662 said:

Thank you for that link. It looks very interesting. If I get a setup that I like, I'll make sure to share it here.

Haivng spent a few minutes looking on pov-ray, it looks very promising. I think it will be easy, if timeconsuming, to set up a few excel (or open office calc more likely) documents with built in macros that will allow any semiskilled GM to select and place a few objects to create an interesting combat field. Then adding a few options for movement of the ships, both more intuitive ones ("Place us alongisde that cruiser, aim portside batteries at them"), in relation to other objects ("directly away from that growing warprift, maximum speed") and free form movement (40 degrees elevation and 22 degrees north of our arbitrary combat grids arbitrary horisontal planes arbitrary east, travel 4 VUs), all done by macros as well. I think I'll keep all the rule-management for the GM, and only have the macros do what they are told.

Ships and objects with facings will be indicated by arrows of different size and colour, most other things by blips, since I'm far from an artist. Also means no waiting times for rendering, even on slow systems.

Useful macros: Tell the distance between any two objects. Rotate the camera. Place new freeform markers on the map if needed ("Maximilians burning guncutter"). Show the potential fire arc for a ship (starboard broadside will cover this cone: colour red). A simple function that makes sure the blips stay the same size to the viewer on all zooms of the map.

It might even be possible to insert text tags into the rendering, must check that out. Then each blip can display distance to object X (often your starship), type, shipclass, name etc etc.

If I manage to get this working, I will have a calc-page that will be (mostly) interface driven. Some rare functions might require direct editing of the calc-stats, depending on my macro skills. And I will have a mapview with blips and maybe some stats. These tow I will have to alt-tab between. If I colour most of the interface in iron and glowing green displays, and add an aquila somewhere as well it will look decent :-)

Sorry for the rambling, I needed to think out loud a bit. Feel free to come with inputs and suggestion btw. Something along the lines of "But I'm a skilled php-programmer, I can make that work in an afternoon" would be very welcome. I'm just a creative fanboy...

Just to throw another idea out there... Vassal has a BFG module, which maybe useful.

As this is a "Games Workshop" game, I don't think I'm far from the mark suggesting that it may have been intended for you to use a ruler . I can't remember a GW game that used hexes, but Space Fleet (ZOMG lame) used squares.

One could argue that Space Hulk uses squares, but considering the context and the maps, it's proper for that game. It's just my opinion, but squares in a starship combat game would be ...well aweful. If tactics and positioning matter at all, squares aren't proper.

I haven't read the rules (due to lack of rules on game store shelf...COUGH) but I plan on painting my game table black and using an official Games Workshop tape measure. I have BFG minis and due to the scale I'd have to go WAY out of my way to find a black hex mat that would accomodate the large bases on most of them.

Oh, for those of you who don't have the minis, the bases on most of them are actually octagonal. There's 4 (?) slots on them intended to hold counters for BFG, hits, Void Shields, etc. They're about mmm...2 or 3 inches across.

Another cheap alternative is spreading out black construction paper on the kitchen table. Works great, and costs pennies. Ping-pong balls make good small moons, whiffle-balls papier-mache'd to cover the holes... If you want nice planets on the cheap, check out the local fabric or craft store (where middle aged chicks go to buy crap to make jewelry and scrapbook stuff). They have balls and half balls usually of several different materials and sizes. Couple bucks and a can of spray paint and you have an entire solar system.

Maxim C. Gatling said:

Very good points. Crafting is fun. Go improvising! Also potatoes does look a lot like huge asteroids. And they will handily turn into nurgleinfested asteroids if left in the gaming supplement box for a while! Excellent for evolving campaigns... Take black cloth, spread out on a table, grab hold of a spot somewhere random and twist that spot a turn or two. Hold still, spray with spotty paint. After it has dried you got a sort of galaxy-like pattern on the cloth.

Curiosities: Mighty Empires used hexes, and one of those stupid WHFBfranchised "strategy" family board games that was sold as an easy way into the gaming hobby at least 10 years ago. I wonder if the acient spacehulk-wannabe game with the tyranids vs spacemarine scouts (anyone remember the name?) used hexes, it sure ought to. The tyranid force organisation cards to the old Epic-system was hexagonal and had to be linked up in organic patterns... but now I'm stretching it, right?

Heh, heh! A little bit.

Most "old skool" gamers consider hexes "proper", as they make movement options fairly realistic and eliminate the need for measuring devices. I'm not against hexes, of course. For me though, given the size of the models and the size of my game table, rulers make the most sense.

Spraying one side of my game table black, adding some galaxies and nebulae will look better than a hex map with 2"-3" hexes, even if I could find one.

What really sucks is they make some really, really nice floorplans these days but Chessex stopped making their clear hex mats. If I could find a clear 1" hex mat, I'd use it for DH and RT...