I'll admit I've only played about 8 games, 2 as First player, the others as Second player. We've been working through objectives and did the yellow ones first, partway through the blue ones.

The Objectives clearly favor the 2nd player if they have any bias at all. So far, my strategies haven't been penalized by not going first. If anything, I like making my opponent come to me (I play Imperials).

I can see some strategies where going first might help, but I don't see it as that big of an advantage. What are some of the advantages I'm perhaps not seeing?

The main advantage is for the imperial black dice, because it allows them to activate a ship last move into close range of a rebel ship that has already activated and then next turn activate and fire before the rebel has an opportunity to avoid the damage. And trust me in the hands of a competent player 1sy player is devastating

I've thought the same thing. The objectives just seem to give a huge advantage to the second player, I can't imagine actually wanting to be the first player. Plus, the second player is guaranteed that the objective being used is one of the ones he built his list around.

There is sometimes an advantage to being able to activate a ship first in a round, you can shoot and then get out of the way, but that seems too situational to warrant all the other benefits the first player gives up.

In the event of a tie, 2nd player wins.

The main advantage is for the imperial black dice, because it allows them to activate a ship last move into close range of a rebel ship that has already activated and then next turn activate and fire before the rebel has an opportunity to avoid the damage. And trust me in the hands of a competent player 1sy player is devastating

That only works if the rebels don't outnumber the imps. If they do then they can simply activate the ships that aren't in danger of that first and wait until all imp ships have moved before bringing up the at risk ships in a way that denies the imperials their best shot.

The whole system just feels weird since it forces you to take a sub-optimal shot and then move closer to then enemy so they can have a better shot at you. I figure that was deliberate to encourage forward thinking and advance planning, unlike x-wing where you are reacting to the constantly changing field, but it REALLY feels off.

Going first for the Imperials trumps any objectives as that means a star destroyer will eliminate an enemy capital ship before it gets to shoot.

Playing a balanced list can help mitigate some of the advantages given Second Player through Objectives, but obviously not all.

Personally, since I fly either a CR90 and 2x NebB or a 2x CR90 and 2x NebB list myself, I really prefer going first over taking chances with my objectives.

I generally like going 2nd, especially as Rebels vs. Imperials. They're forced to make a really tough choice on objectives that I've so far been able to punish them for. Out activating them is also really great, especially going 2nd. That means I'll at least get the last ship to shoot them after they've moved everything into range and often I will get 2 ship activations in a row if they're running few ships. And even in the setup I love forcing my opponent to deploy first, committing their forces to an area that I can then react to in my placements.

All in all, at least for my Rebels thus far, going 2nd feels like a decent advantage.

It depends on the two lists and how much each player has tailored their lists to their objectives. When both sides are fighter heavy, I think going first is better as you are more likely to get in the first squadron command which can be devastating to your opponent's squadons.

Objective wise, I think it really depends on how you built your list, and is certainly something to consider while building. If you tailor your list to a few particular objectives, going second to ensure those objectives can be critical, and worth bidding several points on. If you have a more general list, or a list tailored to one type of Objective, selecting the specific Objective can be of value.

During play, going first can benefit you from having a better chance to take out an enemy ship before it activates, or remove your ship from their line of fire. You get more control over setting the pace of the game, and force your opponent into a more reactive position. Meanwhile, going second allows you to optimize slower and less numerous fleets by making it more likely that your opponent comes to you, getting to strike at them after they've moved into position.

We both agree that activating a ship with your opponent in your strong arc at close range, and then moving out of the way, is a strong play. However, with careful manoeuvring, you can accomplish this as the second player as well: point yourself at where they need to end up, and if your opponent doesn't outnumber you, they will have to activate their ship first, moving into your arc and allowing you to activate last, shooting and then fleeing. Obviously, your opponent has more control over the positioning, but in something like a Victory on Victory slugging match, that counts for very little.

It's a big boon with manouvrable ships if you also outnumber the enemy. 180 point core set games are a good - if extreme - example.

The rebel player can move whichever ship is not under threat of the destroyer's forward guns, then, once it's moved, move in with their faster speed, then next turn shoot it and scarper again before the destroyer gets to go.

It's also significant for the defender in a fighter war to be the first player - as a rule you never want to be moving your fighters up to the enemy (because they shoot first) but the ability to move a fighter to 'pin' a bomber before it gets to make its run at a ship is a lot easier if you know your fighters move first.

The whole 'shoot then move' thing really does change planning on its head - I'm so used to things the other way around; in theory it shouldn't matter but it's going to take me a while to get my head round it.

Take a rebelnlist with 3 ships. The opponent has 2.

Rebel Player moves their Guppy last on one turn, parking it straight in front of an ISD after blasting it's front arc from range.

Then the next turn starts after the fighter phase. They fire first with the Guppy and move out of the front arc, evading that incredibly powerful attack.

First player with more ships is incredibly powerful.

Take a rebelnlist with 3 ships. The opponent has 2.

Rebel Player moves their Guppy last on one turn, parking it straight in front of an ISD after blasting it's front arc from range.

Then the next turn starts after the fighter phase. They fire first with the Guppy and move out of the front arc, evading that incredibly powerful attack.

First player with more ships is incredibly powerful.

Same number of ships, but with first player flipped:

Opponent moves big VSD.

You move your flanking Corvette that's not in danger.

Opponent moves other big ship.

Now you get to have your other 2 ships fire uninterrupted on their VSDs that just moved into range.

Second player with more ships is incredibly powerful as well.

In war games that I've played...

Second player will always have the advantage on Objectives...

First player will always have the advantage on dealing damage...

I assume that's the case here, but the big difference compared to the war games I play is that the "dealing damage" advantage isn't that big of an advantage now since you all trade off activations and it's not "You activate and fire all your stuff first, then I do." ....

So that may be what you're seeing...

It's always been an advantage in "objective" games to have the "last move." I'm not really sure how to fix that... other than as 1st player you need to plan for it.

Take a rebelnlist with 3 ships. The opponent has 2.

Rebel Player moves their Guppy last on one turn, parking it straight in front of an ISD after blasting it's front arc from range.

Then the next turn starts after the fighter phase. They fire first with the Guppy and move out of the front arc, evading that incredibly powerful attack.

First player with more ships is incredibly powerful.

Same number of ships, but with first player flipped:

Opponent moves big VSD.

You move your flanking Corvette that's not in danger.

Opponent moves other big ship.

Now you get to have your other 2 ships fire uninterrupted on their VSDs that just moved into range.

Second player with more ships is incredibly powerful as well.

considering "kill your opponent" is also part of the objectives*, I think it's still significant to have a damage advantage

*compared to games like Warmachine, where a player can win with one model against hundreds so long as he scores enough objective points

I agree with the comments that boil down to First Player has a Damage Dealing Advantage while Second Player has an Objective Advantage. In my opinion, it seems to work fine with this game. To be honest, at this point, I prefer being first player, but it is not worth holding back lots of fleet build points to guarantee it.

My opinion: Outnumbering an opponent in the Ship category is more an advantage than 1st/2nd turn order. 1st player AND outnumbering...is glorious. Off topic I guess.

What it boils down to is that your initiative bid is important.

What it boils down to is that your initiative bid is important.

I could argue that if you just build your list in preparation for any Red Objective as Player 1...you will do fine.

have to agree that the initiative bid's importance varies with the list in question

the more balanced and well-rounded the list is, the less the bid matters and the more you can invest into your ships

of course you have to way the advantage against those last few upgrades. Do you really need those hangars or are you just paranoid ?

I like my objectives, so I typically pass initiative.

I'm surprised how many rebel players want to play Hyperspace Assault with my Demolisher on the field. That is by far the most popular choice, and I'm ok with that.

Let us not forget this:

RR page 5:

If both players have effects with the same timing, the first
player resolves all of his effects with that timing first.

I like my objectives, so I typically pass initiative.

I'm surprised how many rebel players want to play Hyperspace Assault with my Demolisher on the field. That is by far the most popular choice, and I'm ok with that.

Are they crazy?

I like my objectives, so I typically pass initiative.

I'm surprised how many rebel players want to play Hyperspace Assault with my Demolisher on the field. That is by far the most popular choice, and I'm ok with that.

Are they crazy?

Short answer, yes.

Long answer, yes.