Is it only about top tables at big tournaments?

nope

it's about Scyks just kinda sucking

they had some promise, 23 points for an HLC tie fighter seemed reasonable next to the Sigma phantom, but they're just hampered by horrible cost : effectiveness ratio

I'm shocked at you. You are the champion of the delta with control cannon, but you try to stuff hlc on those poor little sycks? I think 19 points for a nimble ion fighter is super awesome supporting a centerpiece ship. You can fit 2 with a 62 point monster or 3 with a 43 point hefty beater. Keep them at long range and annoy and control the enemy while your main ship does whatever he needs. At 19 points of control, it's honestly not that hard to get value back from them if you have the right payoff ship chewing up the enemy.

remember: ficklegreendice. At least Defenders have six health!

Scyks also don't have white 4ks (The 4k being incredibly important because they can really abuse their control cannons by maintaining dice mods after flipping around) or 3 red dice primaries and defenders don't pay four points for flechettes

Scyks also don't have a soontir fell to buddy up with

Scyks also don't have white 4ks (The 4k being incredibly important because they can really abuse their control cannons by maintaining dice mods after flipping around) or 3 red dice primaries and defenders don't pay four points for flechettes

Scyks also don't have a soontir fell to buddy up with

Both fair points. I think they can still provide pretty solid control, but they don't quite have an ace of Soontir quality in scum yet. Maybe wave 7 will yield something ace enough that the support from the sycks is usable.

Scyks also don't have white 4ks (The 4k being incredibly important because they can really abuse their control cannons by maintaining dice mods after flipping around) or 3 red dice primaries and defenders don't pay four points for flechettes

Scyks also don't have a soontir fell to buddy up with

Both fair points. I think they can still provide pretty solid control, but they don't quite have an ace of Soontir quality in scum yet. Maybe wave 7 will yield something ace enough that the support from the sycks is usable.

Who needs Scyk support when Wave 7 will bring YV-666 with stackable tacticians ?

it's a pretty exciting wave to be sure!

Dats SCUM Wave Duce!

Dats SCUM Wave Duce!

indeed!

also, thanks to the Y-wing bomb slot and 2ndary turret slot, both the K-wing and Tie Punisher are also scum ships (just indirectly)

only bad thing is that there's progressively less and less reasons to use the Scyk

The Syck, to me, feels like bringing a swiss army tool to a knife fight. Sure, you can do it, and if conditions match you can probably get the right value out of it.

Our game is mostly a knife fight though, not a survival show.

On the other side the Syck can also be a bazooka. Sadly, Bazookas are pretty easy to spot and prioritize and destroy before they do anything.

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I predicted it would cost 13pts and have a great dial and be fine. At 14 with a perfectly average dial it is not fine. The title costing 2 is also aweful. No Illicit slot? Also terrible.

It really has nothing going for it other than it looks good. It does a lot of things pretty well but gets outclassed in cheapness, efficiency, or firepower by just about every other scum ship.

Scum also suffer from not having a midrange fighter. Cheap Zs and loaded named pilots are where Scum is at right now. Scum warthogs don't seem to be making as much a splash as their rebel counterparts. A single mangler/ion/HCL packing Scyk might make a list here and there, like the random xwing here and there, but they just don't have the SWEETSPOT they need right now. I hope I'm wrong. I hope that changes.

Syck Aces anyone?

I think they'll get a healthy dose of new cannons and ordnance that might just make them useful.

Slug Thrower Cannon: 1pt, Scum Only.

Range 1-3, 3 red

You may spend a focus token to reroll all of your dice.

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You get a slightly better gunned alpha interceptor with no boost, worse dial, and +1 PS. For 1 less point.

Dirty Scyk: 1pt, modification

Your ship gains 1 illicit slot and 1 modification slot.

Syck Aces anyone?

Yah. I don't have a ton of games in with them yet but I'm having trouble finding their niche. It's sad to see new ships already floundering. Luckily, FFG isn't afraid to make things right if our initial assessments turn out to be true, but it does take time (see advanced and hwk).

Well, it's UK nationals tomorrow. I'll try to post my results so we can see how the scyks do.

I'm really hoping for a Scum Aces with Syck and Starviper. Both of these need some help. They could also use a few more pilots.

If they put "fix" cards in like 2 or 3 for the Scum Aces pack, it could easily fix a small fleet of Sycks and SVs for not too much monetarily.

Problem about additional SV pilots i think might be that you can only have one virago in a squad anyway. That said they could include a non unique title that upgrades the vipers.

For the styck i think its a little harder to adjust because the title already exist. A new Cannon would only fix it for exactly that weapon. A new title would compete with the other. Base stat lines are out of question, they wont do that. New pilots will only fix themselves. A modification takes away the slot (e.g. to get a hull upgrade).

So really what are the options concidering FFG doesnt want to change their fixing styles. Maybe if its an upgraded heavy-title that makes the old one obsolete. Given their decitions so far i guess a modification would still be the most propable solution.

My suggestion would be a mod that allows you to take a second mod and gives you bonuses to make the ship more viable while still giving you the options of mods.

Something like:

Reinforced Hull (Modification) 1 Point (Limited; not unique!)

You can equip another modification.

Increase your hull value by 1.

Or

Experimental Autothrusters (Mod) 0 Point (Limited; not unique!)

You can equip another Modification.

When defending, if you are beyond Range 2 or outside the attacker's firing arc, you may change 1 of your blank results to an evade result. Discard this card after using it the 2nd time in one game.

Anyone else bought 4 of them?

I ended up going with 3

Not really cost efficient in any possible loadout. For lots of examples scroll down to wave 6 here -- even with a cannon they can't break a "standard" efficiency, and they really don't have anything else going for them.

http://community.fantasyflightgames.com/index.php?/topic/128417-mathwing-comprehensive-ship-jousting-values-and-more/

As others have already said--I've had it in play several times, and it's too squishy.

The best way to use it would be taking one as an HLC carrier and keeping it as a sniper in a list that had other early target priorities, since its lack of defense doesn't matter in a match where your opponent can't afford to shoot at it. But I can't come up with anything in Scum that people are more afraid of than that cheap HLC.

Even then, a competent player is not going to let you flank him with a single glass cannon. Your opponent will divert his attention to that one ship and summarily execute it. Against a higher PS high firepower list (i.e. most of the meta lists right now), it'll explode before even firing once.

So it needs a fix too?

Do you think they'll add a card to the TIE Defender Aces that will buff the M3-A .

Kind of like adding the Auto-Thrusters to the Star Viper.

Anyone else bought 4 of them?

Just two but I was really going for the cards. Haven't used the ship yet.

Syck Aces anyone?

My Escadrille de Merde' I play casual games with Currently has 6 M3-A's. The thought of buying another 6 or so to get patch cards does not seem to be a pleasant option.

I always assume FFG will reprint a ship in a future expansion. It seems like a great way to update the ships. They have not done it enough in my opinion.

A number of people tried it out at my FLGS and it did not perform well. So my 2 M3-A's get no love. I'm interested in flying them but I don't know what to do with them.

Thats just it really. the Scyk has a number of upgrades over a tie fighter and Z-95's, the big issue is few of those upgrades are actually valuble.

One sheild is condictionally useful for example in only being good enough to absorb the first crit. decently likely with it's 3 agility dice. I would probably say this is the only major difference between it and a tie fighter.

Pilot skill 2 isn't very useful. It allows you to shoot before and move after pilot skill 1, but thats about it. Scum also lose any ties against either of the other factions thus it is unlikely to shoot first against other PS2 without a init buyin.

It has a great movement dial and a section of actions, barrel roll itself is noteably good over the Z-95 but again the repostioning value is lost if your skill 2 aside from against other skill 1's. However it is a fanastic block option, just a pity even the empire is starting to phase out the use of 12 point tie fighters so a 14 point ship doing the same doesn't really have a niche in this market aside from as a low skill glass cannon. It has some potential as a blocker, but one has to ask themselves just one question.

Would they use the Scyk if it was a imperial ship? Or a Rebel ship? If the answer is naither, it's weak.

I'm really hoping for a Scum Aces with Syck and Starviper. Both of these need some help. They could also use a few more pilots.

If they put "fix" cards in like 2 or 3 for the Scum Aces pack, it could easily fix a small fleet of Sycks and SVs for not too much monetarily.

Prolly they will be doing that by the Autumn... don't you think so?

I've previously passed over the Scyk for the already stated reasons... point cost and low hp.

BUT... after my experiences in the regional at FFG last weekend, I'm really not liking Z-95's in the current meta.

The Z's work as a screen but against things like dual Aggressors (high agility dice + high durability); Z's just couldn't do damage consistently enough.

Not consistently enough to justify more than 1 in a list and I ran 4. Against dual aggressors 4 out of my 5 ships felt useless.

I blocked but couldn't capitalize enough with 2 attack ships.

Anyway... until wave 7 comes out and we see how the Kihraxz comes out I'm looking for a 3 dice, 20ish point stopgap for scum.

So... I'm looking at Cartel Spacers with Flechette Cannons and maybe hull upgrades.

The idea is I need a ship that can do 1 damage more often than a Z-95 and a 18 or 21 point M3-A looks to be my best option so far...

Even if they'll only ever do 1 damage at range 2 & 3, that's better than my Z's are doing against the ships I'm struggling against.

And I don't think the Manglers do enough extra damage over the Flechettes to justify the cost.

And I don't think the Manglers do enough extra damage over the Flechettes to justify the cost.

Sounds better to me

And I don't think the Manglers do enough extra damage over the Flechettes to justify the cost.

I'm afraid I'd disagree. 1-0 damage and maybe a stress token vs 3-0 damage and maybe 1 or more crits with only a 2 points difference.

Sounds better to me

I'm talking in regards to use against 3 agility dice ships, often with auto-thrusters. Situations where I only need 1 damage but I need it consistently.

Against other targets, 2 dice primaries have done well enough in practice.

Also those 2 points would force me to either drop defensive upgrades (hull) or an entire ship...

Which from my experience last weekend means I'll lose far more than I gain.

Anyone tried them with Autoblasters?

Anyone else bought 4 of them?

I have a swarm of 6 going to a casual tournament tomorrow.