Apart from the timing rules dictate the order you resolve effects, not the order of the components within the effect.

If you gain 3 tokens simultaneously they all arrive at the same time.

There is a president for multiple assignments with damage cards and damage clicks on squadrons where by they are assigned one at a time, but nothing that says the same about command tokens. Unless I've not seen it in The RRG.

Does it specifically say anywhere in the RRG how multiple command tokens would be gained/assigned?

Well, then they all get discarded.

Because if they happens all at the same time, when you check if you already have a token of this type, the answer is yes.

When a ship is assigned a command token, if it already has a copy of that command token, it must immediately discard that command token.

Apart from the timing rules dictate the order you resolve effects, not the order of the components within the effect.

If you gain 3 tokens simultaneously they all arrive at the same time.

There is a president for multiple assignments with damage cards and damage clicks on squadrons where by they are assigned one at a time, but nothing that says the same about command tokens. Unless I've not seen it in The RRG.

Does it specifically say anywhere in the RRG how multiple command tokens would be gained/assigned?

Well, then they all get discarded.

Because if they happens all at the same time, when you check if you already have a token of this type, the answer is yes.

When a ship is assigned a command token, if it already has a copy of that command token, it must immediately discard that command token.

But it doesn't already have a token, they all appeared at the same time.

Having one already means prior to gaining it. If you get all 3 tokens simultaneously, there is no prior token already being owned.

While I don't think this is what was intended and I have no basis for such a thought, when read as written, there is nothing in the RRG or the card that precludes getting all 3 of the same type of token at the same time.

Apart from the timing rules dictate the order you resolve effects, not the order of the components within the effect.

If you gain 3 tokens simultaneously they all arrive at the same time.

There is a president for multiple assignments with damage cards and damage clicks on squadrons where by they are assigned one at a time, but nothing that says the same about command tokens. Unless I've not seen it in The RRG.

Does it specifically say anywhere in the RRG how multiple command tokens would be gained/assigned?

Well, then they all get discarded.

Because if they happens all at the same time, when you check if you already have a token of this type, the answer is yes.

When a ship is assigned a command token, if it already has a copy of that command token, it must immediately discard that command token.

But it doesn't already have a token, they all appeared at the same time.

Having one already means prior to gaining it. If you get all 3 tokens simultaneously, there is no prior token already being owned.

While I don't think this is what was intended and I have no basis for such a thought, when read as written, there is nothing in the RRG or the card that precludes getting all 3 of the same type of token at the same time.

This.

You compare tokens gained with tokens already owned. Tokens about to be gained, by their very nature, cannot be owned already by a ship.

1. You are gaining command tokens.
2. You check how many of the same type are already owned (the tokens you are gaining are not owned yet!).
3. Zero tokens are owned.
4. Effect resolves.
5. You now have 3 tokens.

We just assume this wasnt intended. what if it was? I feel like it makes GBI very powerful.

Turn 5 I would agree if you have a Navigate token and you gain 3 more, you would discard all 3. Turn 1, its at the start of the turn not the command phase, your empty.

Side note how do you send it to FFG? I would hope they check the rules forums for their games and when things like this come up they step in and give an answer (I am newer to how FFG interacts with the community).

For the record I think this is all bunkum and you should only be allowed one of each type on a ship. But that doesn't appear to be how the rules are operating.

You gain them simultaneously, which means you gain 3x one token (in our example) and according to Effect and Timing, allow you to choose the order in which you will gain these tokens, which will make you discard previous tokens and will leave you with just one (if you choose the same token 3 times).

Actually, under effects and timing, you would not choose the order in which you gain these tokens. You can them all simultaneously as the card assigns all 3. It doesn't say get one token, then, get another token, then get one more if you have a command value of 3.

You resolve the card as a whole based on what it says. The card says at the start of round 1 and round 5. It doesn't say at the start of round 1 you may gain 1 token and then after resolving this card, if you have more command points resolve this card again.

The timing is specific, "At the start of the first round and the fifth round...."

The RRG under timing says,

A “when” effect occurs at the moment that the specified

event occurs and cannot occur again for that instance of

the event.

So it can't occur again. It's a one shot deal. In all cases in effects and timing, the RRG says that such timings are a one shot deal (cannot occur again for that instance of the event).

Turn 5 I would agree if you have a Navigate token and you gain 3 more, you would discard all 3. Turn 1, its at the start of the turn not the command phase, your empty.

You would discard the existing token, and then gain the new ones. So lose 1 and gain 3.

We just assume this wasnt intended. what if it was? I feel like it makes GBI very powerful.

Turn 5 I would agree if you have a Navigate token and you gain 3 more, you would discard all 3. Turn 1, its at the start of the turn not the command phase, your empty.

Side note how do you send it to FFG? I would hope they check the rules forums for their games and when things like this come up they step in and give an answer (I am newer to how FFG interacts with the community).

Send an email to customer service.... they respond pretty quickly to rules questions for imperial assault.

Turn 5 I would agree if you have a Navigate token and you gain 3 more, you would discard all 3. Turn 1, its at the start of the turn not the command phase, your empty.

You would discard the existing token, and then gain the new ones. So lose 1 and gain 3.

Actually, I would disagree with this.

Since the gaining of tokens happens at the beginning of the turn, ie prior to being able to discard a token, then I see no way to discard that already owned token in order to gain 3 of the same.

I would see it like this:

Before turn starts, gain command value of tokens (3 for this example)

You already have a token of the same type, you would discard each matching token.

Under tokens we read:

When a ship is assigned a command token, if it already

has a copy of that command token, it must immediately

discard that command token.

The token is already there, thus the discard is immediate. Nothing on garms card changes or allows the existing token to be spent or removed. Thus the newly acquired token(s) are the ones that are discarded per the rule quoted above. This would leave you with that copy you already owned.

To play Devil's Advocate...

Are the tokens gained and then compared to the tokens that were already owned.

The rules don't use After they use When.

"When a ship is assigned a command token"

When makes me think you compare them at the point they are becoming owned. But is that before or after?

Anyway, it's all just mental masturbation really.

Turn 5 I would agree if you have a Navigate token and you gain 3 more, you would discard all 3. Turn 1, its at the start of the turn not the command phase, your empty.

You would discard the existing token, and then gain the new ones. So lose 1 and gain 3.

Actually, I would disagree with this.

Since the gaining of tokens happens at the beginning of the turn, ie prior to being able to discard a token, then I see no way to discard that already owned token in order to gain 3 of the same.

I would see it like this:

Before turn starts, gain command value of tokens (3 for this example)

You already have a token of the same type, you would discard each matching token.

Under tokens we read:

When a ship is assigned a command token, if it already

has a copy of that command token, it must immediately

discard that command token.

The token is already there, thus the discard is immediate. Nothing on garms card changes or allows the existing token to be spent or removed. Thus the newly acquired token(s) are the ones that are discarded per the rule quoted above. This would leave you with that copy you already owned.

Quite correct, I misread which token "that" token was.

Well, when you gain all 3, there is none on the ship already which I think is the crux of the timing.

The only time you see them being on the ship already is after you get the 3 tokens, not when you get them.

But I still think this isn't what was intended and was an oversight.... no basis for that thought though.

Apart from the timing rules dictate the order you resolve effects, not the order of the components within the effect.

If you gain 3 tokens simultaneously they all arrive at the same time.

There is a president for multiple assignments with damage cards and damage clicks on squadrons where by they are assigned one at a time, but nothing that says the same about command tokens. Unless I've not seen it in The RRG.

Does it specifically say anywhere in the RRG how multiple command tokens would be gained/assigned?

Well, then they all get discarded.

Because if they happens all at the same time, when you check if you already have a token of this type, the answer is yes.

When a ship is assigned a command token, if it already has a copy of that command token, it must immediately discard that command token.

But it doesn't already have a token, they all appeared at the same time.

Having one already means prior to gaining it. If you get all 3 tokens simultaneously, there is no prior token already being owned.

While I don't think this is what was intended and I have no basis for such a thought, when read as written, there is nothing in the RRG or the card that precludes getting all 3 of the same type of token at the same time.

This.

You compare tokens gained with tokens already owned. Tokens about to be gained, by their very nature, cannot be owned already by a ship.

1. You are gaining command tokens.
2. You check how many of the same type are already owned (the tokens you are gaining are not owned yet!).
3. Zero tokens are owned.
4. Effect resolves.
5. You now have 3 tokens.

Sorry but you have the order wrong.

1. You are gaining command tokens.
2. Effect resolve.
3. You have 3 tokens.

   3.1 For each token you check if you have a token of the same type.

   3.2 You discard the matching token.

Discarding tokens is not part of the effect. It is another effect that trigger when you receive a token.

Well, when you gain all 3, there is none on the ship already which I think is the crux of the timing.

The only time you see them being on the ship already is after you get the 3 tokens, not when you get them.

But I still think this isn't what was intended and was an oversight.... no basis for that thought though.

It is because you alt the token assignation to check if you already have a token, but it doesnt work like this.

The rules are clear, WHEN (not BEFORE) you assign the token, which means when the 3 tokens land on your ship card, you check if you already have one. In that case, yes you already have 2 others tokens of the same type, which make those 2 tokens to be discarded. But you do this for the 3 tokens which make all of them to be discarded in the end.

Apart from the timing rules dictate the order you resolve effects, not the order of the components within the effect.

If you gain 3 tokens simultaneously they all arrive at the same time.

There is a president for multiple assignments with damage cards and damage clicks on squadrons where by they are assigned one at a time, but nothing that says the same about command tokens. Unless I've not seen it in The RRG.

Does it specifically say anywhere in the RRG how multiple command tokens would be gained/assigned?

Well, then they all get discarded.

Because if they happens all at the same time, when you check if you already have a token of this type, the answer is yes.

When a ship is assigned a command token, if it already has a copy of that command token, it must immediately discard that command token.

But it doesn't already have a token, they all appeared at the same time.

Having one already means prior to gaining it. If you get all 3 tokens simultaneously, there is no prior token already being owned.

While I don't think this is what was intended and I have no basis for such a thought, when read as written, there is nothing in the RRG or the card that precludes getting all 3 of the same type of token at the same time.

This.

You compare tokens gained with tokens already owned. Tokens about to be gained, by their very nature, cannot be owned already by a ship.

1. You are gaining command tokens.
2. You check how many of the same type are already owned (the tokens you are gaining are not owned yet!).
3. Zero tokens are owned.
4. Effect resolves.
5. You now have 3 tokens.

Sorry but you have the order wrong.

1. You are gaining command tokens.
2. Effect resolve.
3. You have 3 tokens.

   3.1 For each token you check if you have a token of the same type.

   3.2 You discard the matching token.

Discarding tokens is not part of the effect. It is another effect that trigger when you receive a token.

Sorry, but you have the rule wrong as written.

There is no check for seeing if you have the same token after you have it. It's checking when you gain the token.

All 3 tokens are gotten simultaneously, thus when you check, you don't already have one of the same type when you gain it. It's after the tokens are gained, that you have a duplicate, but nothing in the RRG says to check for duplicate tokens after the gain, it only says to check to see if you have the token already.

Well, when you gain all 3, there is none on the ship already which I think is the crux of the timing.

The only time you see them being on the ship already is after you get the 3 tokens, not when you get them.

But I still think this isn't what was intended and was an oversight.... no basis for that thought though.

It is because you alt the token assignation to check if you already have a token, but it doesnt work like this.

The rules are clear, WHEN (not BEFORE) you assign the token, which means when the 3 tokens land on your ship card, you check if you already have one. In that case, yes you already have 2 others tokens of the same type, which make those 2 tokens to be discarded. But you do this for the 3 tokens which make all of them to be discarded in the end.

Actually the rules are clear, you see if you have it already.

The card says to get command tokens up to what your command allows.

Let's check what the word already means:

already

Close Style: MLA APA Chicago

adverb al · ready \ ȯ l- ˈ re-dē, ˈ ȯ l- ˌ \

: before this time : before now : before that time

: so soon : so early

—used to describe a situation that exists now and that will continue to exist

I have emailed FFG Customer Service. I know the Intent of people may not be personal attacks but the posts are starting to feel that way. I agree the intent is that you can probably not assign 3 of the same. If the intent was that you can though, I love what he does for Fleet design.

Wildhorn:

First I agree with you, that the intent of the rules is to never allow a ship to have more then one of any command token type.

However, the RRG > LTP, so all you have really shown is there is an inconsistency in the wording, which is exactly with the OP is questioning.

Now, one could argue that since the RRG and LTP are referencing the same action and using different words to describe how to complete the action that the words "gain" and "assign" are used interchangeably in this regard.

Honestly, I think it is more that there needs to be clarity on how the upgrade card should read, if it is to stay consistent with the RRG, then it should say "assign", and then would fall into play with the command token rules, and would close the rules lawyering loop hole.

Sorry but the rules says that I am right.

1. You assign by placing the 3 tokens next to the ship.
2. Now, each tokens trigger the 2nd quote.

3. You are left with no tokens.

​Everything I quote comes from the RRG.

A command token is assigned to a ship by placing it next to the ship in the play area.

When a ship is assigned a command token, if it already has a copy of that command token, it must immediately discard that command token.

A “when” effect occurs at the moment that the specified event occurs and cannot occur again for that instance of the event.

Sorry but the rules says that I am right.

1. You assign by placing the 3 tokens next to the ship.

2. Now, each tokens trigger the 2nd quote.

3. You are left with no tokens.

Sorry, but no...

The already part means the tokens would have been on the ship card prior to placing all 3.

You are looking at this from the intent point of view, not the rules as written point of view.

I don't think this is what ffg wanted, but it's how the rules are currently written.

​Everything I quote comes from the RRG.

A command token is assigned to a ship by placing it next to the ship in the play area.

When a ship is assigned a command token, if it already has a copy of that command token, it must immediately discard that command token.

A “when” effect occurs at the moment that the specified event occurs and cannot occur again for that instance of the event.

Sorry but the rules says that I am right.

1. You assign by placing the 3 tokens next to the ship.
2. Now, each tokens trigger the 2nd quote.

3. You are left with no tokens.

Sorry, but no...

The already part means the tokens would have been on the ship card prior to placing all 3.

You are looking at this from the intent point of view, not the rules as written point of view.

I don't think this is what ffg wanted, but it's how the rules are currently written.

Sorry but yes.

Else the 2nd quote would have been:

" Before a ship is assigned a command token, if it already has a copy of that command token, it must immediately discard that command token."

​Everything I quote comes from the RRG.

A command token is assigned to a ship by placing it next to the ship in the play area.

When a ship is assigned a command token, if it already has a copy of that command token, it must immediately discard that command token.

A “when” effect occurs at the moment that the specified event occurs and cannot occur again for that instance of the event.

Sorry but the rules says that I am right.

1. You assign by placing the 3 tokens next to the ship.

2. Now, each tokens trigger the 2nd quote.

3. You are left with no tokens.

Sorry, but no...

The already part means the tokens would have been on the ship card prior to placing all 3.

You are looking at this from the intent point of view, not the rules as written point of view.

I don't think this is what ffg wanted, but it's how the rules are currently written.

Sorry but yes.

Else the 2nd quote would have been:

" Before a ship is assigned a command token, if it already has a copy of that command token, it must immediately discard that command token."

That is what it is saying. You have ignored the already component. Already is the state of being prior to gaining the tokens, not after gaining the tokens. It's not do you have a copy after placement, it's do you have a copy already (prior to placement) there when you place.

The token was already there, thus the second copy effect is already there.

Grabbing your rule quote from above:

When a ship is assigned a command token, if it already has a copy of that command token, it must immediately discard that command token.

Now look at the definition of already I provided. It means prior to that instance of assigning/gaining.

So you gain your 3 tokens and put them down. You look at ship card, was there a token there of the same type before you put them down? ie one already there? If not, then all 3 stay. If there was one there when placing, then begin the removal process.

Gonna drop the quote pyramid...

Now look at the definition of already I provided. It means prior to that instance of assigning/gaining.

Yeah... what is the time frame now with that? "prior" is not an official Timing keyword. Does this means that if at any giving time "prior" now you had a token you can't gain any more of them? or by "prior" you meant right "before"?

If FFG meant before they would have used the keyword "before", not "when".

So, since they used "when" this means when you put down the tokens next to the ship.

Gonna drop the quote pyramid...

Now look at the definition of already I provided. It means prior to that instance of assigning/gaining.

Yeah... what is the time frame now with that? "prior" is not an official Timing keyword. Does this means that if at any giving time "prior" now you had a token you can't gain any more of them? or by "prior" you meant right "before"?

If FFG meant before they would have used the keyword "before", not "when".

So, since they used "when" this means when you put down the tokens next to the ship.

Agreed on the use of when.

So when you put down the tokens, were tokens already there?

They did use the word already in the rule. The word already means prior to.

So when you put down tokens (the when key word) was something already (prior to) there? if yes and matching, then remove tokens, if no, then keep the token(s).

What you're arguing is that the word already doesn't have meaning.

Gonna drop the quote pyramid...

Now look at the definition of already I provided. It means prior to that instance of assigning/gaining.

Yeah... what is the time frame now with that? "prior" is not an official Timing keyword. Does this means that if at any giving time "prior" now you had a token you can't gain any more of them? or by "prior" you meant right "before"?

If FFG meant before they would have used the keyword "before", not "when".

So, since they used "when" this means when you put down the tokens next to the ship.

Agreed on the use of when.

So when you put down the tokens, were tokens already there?

They did use the word already in the rule. The word already means prior to.

So when you put down tokens (the when key word) was something already (prior to) there ? if yes and matching, then remove tokens, if no, then keep the token(s).

What you're arguing is that the word already doesn't have meaning.

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/already

Second definition: "Already" can also means "Now".

So if you check "now" if there are tokens, the answer is yes.