Dude. You brought up Sauron, Bolg, Predator and X-Men in the simple conversation about Smeagol, the grey character from LotR who wasn't even on the side of "evil", unlike Grima. Nothing you say matters now. Nothing

I accept your concession.

Nice try. I bet you accept this kind of "concessions" all the time

I think the magic idea is awesome as long as done with the subtlety that most have already suggested (including op).

So yup would be awesome.

I even had a daft idea for thematics in the books. This wont work btw as there wouldnt be enough deck variance for proper deck building.

But a new galdalf hero with gandalf-sphere. Cards would hav effects alowing you to use cards specific from other spheres that fit gandalf, like the tactics eagles, so you could mix spheres but the cards would be written so as not to be all encompasing from those spheres. So using allies specific from the books as example.

Also with lots of knowledge based cards and the nice sprinkling of magic and spells.

Maybe even has a one-hero rule, so you recreate the effecf of gandalf alone going through the world.

As i say, dont think it could have the variance to work, but i still kinda like the idea in basic principle

Nice try. I bet you accept this kind of "concessions" all the time

Bit pressed for time but here goes:

Well based on the fact that you say (paraphrasing but still correct) "this is not canon so anything goes" (emphasis added) and when I set up a scenario following the anything-goes principle (however outlandish) and your response is "Nuhuu of course I didn´t mean that and you are thus wrong" then you haven´t made a counter-argument.

Sounds like your line for what is appropiate to change in the LCG goes somewhere between making Smeagol a hero and mutants fighting alien invaders, even if you did argue that no such line exists, because of the non-canon argument.

My opinion is that a Smeagol hero is too much.

short answer: we've already seen some magic in the game and i'm indifferent to the concept in general.

Ha! You know a thread is magical when you can summon Dain into it. I think his position is more or less what most players think. They like magic, but don't really care about it. Totally understandable, but there are players who really like it, and in my case, that think it should get more love.

Dain nails it.

As for this game not being canon, it seems well within reason to affirm that we don't have to choose between the extremes of either sticking to only official canon or bringin in the X-men. That is such a ridiculous overstatement that no "counter-argument" is required.

Ha! You know a thread is magical when you can summon Dain into it. I think his position is more or less what most players think. They like magic, but don't really care about it. Totally understandable, but there are players who really like it, and in my case, that think it should get more love.

slightly longer answer: i love magic in other games (video or board or card or rpg) - but in LOTR, magic never felt like a large/important part of the setting, so it's not something i'm itching to see in any game incarnation of the source material. it was very much in the background (similiar to what i know of AGOT) - it's average men (or dwarves or elves) doing above-average deeds without being super human.

As for this game not being canon, it seems well within reason to affirm that we don't have to choose between the extremes of either sticking to only official canon or bringin in the X-men. That is such a ridiculous overstatement that no "counter-argument" is required.

I'm not sure to whose statement you're replying here, if any, but I agree. Hopefully I didn't come out as a "bring the X-men" guy. I mean, when Trololo made his Orc custom hero, I was one of the people who said that this is pretty much impossible to ever see in the game. I also have my doubts of a Gollum hero or ally. But when the very first release of this game includes stuff like Beravor and a "Shadow Key" (both created from pretty much nothing), I don't think making a Lesser Ring of the Elves (which are canon) would be too much of a stretch.

I would love to see more Wizards, that's for sure. As far as real magic goes, meh. Magic in LotR-universe is mostly 'between the lines'. A great example for what magic is in Tolkien, can be found in the Silmarillion. The battle between Finrod Felagund and Sauron is a magical one, but they just sing songs. Not to say that that's a bad thing or something, but the only examples of what most people deems magic are: The secret gate in Moria where you have to speak friend, Gandalf putting a Spell on the door and the Balrog doing a Counter-Spell, Gandalf blowing the Bridge, the One Ring of course and the Palantir.

The Three Elven Rings of Power are not even something most people deem magic. They are of course magivcal, but their power is very subtle.

Cards representing the Rings of Power (the Seven, the Nine, lesser Rings) would be really cool. I also would like more Palantiri, not just one generic. Spells would be riskier imo, because there are not that much.

I would love to see more Wizards, that's for sure. As far as real magic goes, meh. Magic in LotR-universe is mostly 'between the lines'. A great example for what magic is in Tolkien, can be found in the Silmarillion. The battle between Finrod Felagund and Sauron is a magical one, but they just sing songs. Not to say that that's a bad thing or something, but the only examples of what most people deems magic are: The secret gate in Moria where you have to speak friend, Gandalf putting a Spell on the door and the Balrog doing a Counter-Spell, Gandalf blowing the Bridge, the One Ring of course and the Palantir.

The Three Elven Rings of Power are not even something most people deem magic. They are of course magivcal, but their power is very subtle.

Cards representing the Rings of Power (the Seven, the Nine, lesser Rings) would be really cool. I also would like more Palantiri, not just one generic. Spells would be riskier imo, because there are not that much.

And also, you're certainly not calling for 'The X-Men'. That would be like asking for Ainur-cards.

Wait a second. Do you all think that I'm essentially asking for telekinesis, lightning from the fingertips and waterbending? Of course not! What I'm asking for is precisely subtler magic, stuff like secret runes (cirth ithil), song-spells (good versions of the barrow-wight spell), stuff like intelligence or courage-enhancing rings, far-seeing Palantiri, etc. I'm not asking at all for MTG-like magic.

Well, I wasn't gettoing that vibe from you, but more from others, so I wanted to be more clear about that.

no matter what you say - once you introduce radioactive superheroes fighting against invading aliens it´s just not LotR anymore, regardless of how many times you say "it´s not canon".

Dain nails it.

As for this game not being canon, it seems well within reason to affirm that we don't have to choose between the extremes of either sticking to only official canon or bringin in the X-men. That is such a ridiculous overstatement that no "counter-argument" is required.

I am well aware that it was an overstatement. The whole point I was trying to make was that everyone has a boundary, they will not accept being crossed; I tried first to argue from the idea of making Sauron and Bolg into heroes but that didn´t seem to get the point across so I deliberately took it one step further. However outlandish and overstated you think it is, it is still within the basic premise set forth. I could as well use the argument that "making Gollum into a hero is a ridiculous overinterpretation of the non-canonic approach to this game"... it is all a matter of where our individual said boundaries lie.