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RRG, Page 11, Ship Movement

To execute a maneuver with a ship, its owner proceeds through the following steps:.... The ship can resolve a NAV command to adjust speed and/or yaw....

2. Move Ship: ...

That is where the speed change takes effect.... When you are doing your Maneuver.

My Flight controller example was just an analogy, and your point about Adar Talon was exactly what I meant. Adars wording prevents him from being used during the command. The icons, however, allow the effect to be used during the command. I was only trying to argue that if the engine tech speed can't be changed, then flight controllers shouldn't be able to add dice to attacks because you'd have to wait until after the command resolved. A squadron command isn't resolved until after the squadrons have been activated.

Edit: spelling

• Effects with a command icon as a header, such as “NAV:,” can be resolved once while the ship is resolving the matching command.

Hang on a Minute.....

So, above. I have a Nav Command. I resolve the command at the appropriate time, which is - during the determine course step of my movement... My Nav Command lets me Change the Yaw/Speed during my Current Maneuver .

It also lets me Activate Engine Techs... However, Engine Techs does not RESOLVE at that time. It has its own Resolution time... Which is After you execute a maneuver

Same as Flight Controllers work, because you don't have to have RESOLVED a Command... It kicks in while you are RESOLVING a command, as per the rulebook statement in effects...

Effects state 'resolving'. Rather than 'resolved'....

I'm not seeing the problem here, now?

Ok, I see now, and I agree. Thank you for the clarification. I also checked "Commands" on page three, and that states that it is resolved during the Determine Course step of movement. So now I understand that a dial and token cannot be used separately on the 1st and 2nd maneuver.

I do suppose that my old FLGS has been playing it wrong. Which is really surprising to me since we've got a guy that is one of those really nitpicky, no take-backs players, and he's the biggest proponent of it (I know my description of him sounds bad, but he's actually really enjoyable to play with, and makes sure that everyone knows and are aware of the rules)

So in light of this, suppose that a player makes no indication that they resolved a navigation command during the first maneuver, and they have already moved their ship. Let's say they had a Nav token on the ship, but they didn't discard it before moving the ship. Since the only time that command can be resolved is during the determine course step, which is before moving the ship, are they now prohibited from spending the dial or token to use ET?

Ok, I see now, and I agree. Thank you for the clarification. I also checked "Commands" on page three, and that states that it is resolved during the Determine Course step of movement. So now I understand that a dial and token cannot be used separately on the 1st and 2nd maneuver.

I do suppose that my old FLGS has been playing it wrong. Which is really surprising to me since we've got a guy that is one of those really nitpicky, no take-backs players, and he's the biggest proponent of it (I know my description of him sounds bad, but he's actually really enjoyable to play with, and makes sure that everyone knows and are aware of the rules)

So in light of this, suppose that a player makes no indication that they resolved a navigation command during the first maneuver, and they have already moved their ship. Let's say they had a Nav token on the ship, but they didn't discard it before moving the ship. Since the only time that command can be resolved is during the determine course step, which is before moving the ship, are they now prohibited from spending the dial or token to use ET?

Correct, they are prohibited, by the rules. Any other interpretation is outside the scope of said rules.

Exactly the same as if someone has measured range and shot - its too late to spend a squadron (or engineering) token, as they happen right after the Dial is revealed.

Thank you for bearing with me and putting up with my mental gymnastics. This actually makes me glad, because now I don't have to worry about Demo potentially moving halfway down the field in one go on an Ozzel List. That makes it much less scary.

No worries, I just struggled at the start to get the gist of what the arguments were for and against, but once I understood it, I could actually say something pertinent

Thank you for bearing with me and putting up with my mental gymnastics. This actually makes me glad, because now I don't have to worry about Demo potentially moving halfway down the field in one go on an Ozzel List. That makes it much less scary.

Demo is still pretty scary, even without those shenanigans.

But if you could Ozzel your ET move up to Speed 3. . .the horror. . .

• Effects with a command icon as a header, such as “NAV:,” can be resolved once while the ship is resolving the matching command.

Hang on a Minute.....

So, above. I have a Nav Command. I resolve the command at the appropriate time, which is - during the determine course step of my movement... My Nav Command lets me Change the Yaw/Speed during my Current Maneuver .

It also lets me Activate Engine Techs... However, Engine Techs does not RESOLVE at that time. It has its own Resolution time... Which is After you execute a maneuver

Same as Flight Controllers work, because you don't have to have RESOLVED a Command... It kicks in while you are RESOLVING a command, as per the rulebook statement in effects...

Effects state 'resolving'. Rather than 'resolved'....

I'm not seeing the problem here, now?

So Engine Techs has its own resolution time after you have resolved a Nav command, so no chance of it being affected by GR-8 then, as we had been looking at "determine course step" wording.

The argument there is that ET movement is a fresh maneuver, and has its own "Determine Course" step. But there's an entire thread devoted to that debate.

Yes, that's not what I'm saying at all, there. And yes, please use the other thread.



You'll notice I've not gotten my hands dirty with it.

I'm resurrecting this thread for a related question:

Can I double-ram with Engine Techs? (Maneuver resulting in an overlap and deal a card to the two ships, then do Engine Techs to overlap again and deal a second card to the two ships.)

Yes, you can.

Its perfect fine to double ram with this.

It's the key of the Rieekan CR90B swarm.

So apparently a flotilla with tractor beams can prevent Demolisher from using engine techs now. I like it.

8 minutes ago, Warlord Zepnick said:

So apparently a flotilla with tractor beams can prevent Demolisher from using engine techs now. I like it.

How's that? What am I missing here?

8 minutes ago, Warlord Zepnick said:

So apparently a flotilla with tractor beams can prevent Demolisher from using engine techs now. I like it.

Unless Demo has a Nav dial. I've been thinking about running anti-Demo/Admo tech in my fleets. Flotilla with Tractor Beams seems to be a good choice.

Tractor Beams only owrk on your size or lower.

Flotillas are Small, as is Demolisher.

So the Phylom Q-7s can remove the oft-needed Navigate Token.


that's all.

If they're throwing a Nav Dial, they can't.

2 minutes ago, Lemmiwinks86 said:

How's that? What am I missing here?

My apologies. It is actually the experimental projector (G-8) that allows you to do this.

Edit: you can find this in the FAQ.

Right. Flotilla with Tractor Beams and a Slicer Tool is great against Demo.

14 minutes ago, Democratus said:

Right. Flotilla with Tractor Beams and a Slicer Tool is great against Demo.

At least until it rolls an ACC

They're doing that more and more these days...

3 minutes ago, Drasnighta said:

At least until it rolls an ACC

They're doing that more and more these days...

This is why i always add Tua and ECM. Nothing is more fun than a Gozanti, standing in front of an ISD, and just laughing about all these dice ending in the scatter.

Just now, Tokra said:

This is why i always add Tua and ECM. Nothing is more fun than a Gozanti, standing in front of an ISD, and just laughing about all these dice ending in the scatter.

Yes, but you're an edge case.

All you have are Gozantis.

Its not like the ECM could go anywhere more important anyway .