I am playing around with Oggdude`s fantastic character builder, and I am making a cyborg type character(gank as base).

I am adding cybernetic implants and I see that I can add brain implant more than once and cybernetic ams of the same type more than once and still get the characteristics benefits from them.

The only thing I found in the core book(just a quick glance), is that you can go up to 7 in a characteristic or 6 in a skill with the combination of purchased increases and cyber implants.

I buy a pair of cybernetic arms(mod V) multiple times, are they just upgraded each time until I reach 7 in brawn or hit my max number of implants(brawn + species special ability)

And come to that, does my max number of max implants go up everytime my brawn goes up from a new implant?

And come to that, does my max number of max implants go up everytime my brawn goes up from a new implant?

The CRB isn't clear on that one. If someone wants to ask a dev question about what sources of Brawn contributes to your implant max, I'll make sure the generator works that way.

The book isn't clear, but dev answers do follow a pattern of 'if the book don't say you can, you can't'.

I'd say it depends on the upgrade. If you want two cybernetic cavities, go right ahead. Three cybereyes, not so much. A little common sense goes a long way.

I can't have eyes in the back of my head? A pox on this cyber clinic!

I'd say it depends on the upgrade. If you want two cybernetic cavities, go right ahead. Three cybereyes, not so much. A little common sense goes a long way.

Why? It doesn`t have to be new eyes, it can be addons or upgrades of the ones you already have.

The book isn't clear, but dev answers do follow a pattern of 'if the book don't say you can, you can't'.

What the book says is that you can go up to 7 in a characteristic and that you can`t have more implants than your brawn number. So it kind of says you CAN do it and gives you the limitations

So if I have a human character with 5 in brawn and 2 in intellect and 2 in agility, I would be able to take up to 5 brain implants and get 7 intellect or take cybernetic arms(mod VI) 5 times and get 7 agility.

I reach my max and use up all my implant slots in both cases. The arms would only be physically added once, but in that case they would be improved or upgrated for every time I buy them after that.

I can go either way, but I want to find out if this thread can provide me and my players with some clever answers or interesting thoughts.

I can't have eyes in the back of my head? A pox on this cyber clinic!

Or eyes wherever! A cybrorg or droid should be able to have eyes wherever they want (at least in my eyes...). And some aliens even have more than 2 eyes.

Come to that, some have more than 2 arms and legs!... Hmm... Ok, from now on, characters in my game can become 10-armed human cyborgs

Wasn't the big glowy thingy in a MagnaGuard's chest another photo-receptor?

Where would you put more than one CBI? If you've seen The Empire Strikes Back , you know two things about it. First, it's pretty big. Second, it seems to need access to the brainstem to (in the words of the book) "meld with the brain".

As for taking more than one arm to improve Agility, since the cybernetic arm would have to be tied in to your character's frame in order to have the kind of load support it needs, most species (excepting Besalisks and other creatures with multiple pairs of arms) would only be able to support two, and the book clearly states that, when replacing both arms, modifiers from both arms do not stack.

Wasn't the big glowy thingy in a MagnaGuard's chest another photo-receptor?

Didn`t general Grievous have four arms?

Where would you put more than one CBI? If you've seen The Empire Strikes Back , you know two things about it. First, it's pretty big. Second, it seems to need access to the brainstem to (in the words of the book) "meld with the brain".

As for taking more than one arm to improve Agility, since the cybernetic arm would have to be tied in to your character's frame in order to have the kind of load support it needs, most species (excepting Besalisks and other creatures with multiple pairs of arms) would only be able to support two, and the book clearly states that, when replacing both arms, modifiers from both arms do not stack.

In a galaxy of billions of worlds, don`t you think there can be more than one model? And even if you are going with only the one type, can`t that be upgraded everytime you purchase the implant? This is science fantasy and space opera, it is roleplaying and game fiction, not hard science or even hard science fiction. I`d like to think the game incourages all kinds of creativity and fantastically exaggerated ideas, it only fits the hobby and the genre.

All kidding aside I'm pretty confident the answer will be 'no' in regards to multiple attribute upgrades. I might house rule some side things for reasonable application of multiple cybernetics, like the droid with eyes in the back of their head might get a boost die on Perception checks.

FFG has really been ginger with the 4 arms thing. Xeto are it I think so far with 4 arms, and their benefit is pretty good, but it's also pretty tame.

I am playing around with Oggdude`s fantastic character builder, and I am making a cyborg type character(gank as base).

I am adding cybernetic implants and I see that I can add brain implant more than once and cybernetic ams of the same type more than once and still get the characteristics benefits from them.

There should probably be a fix for that, because the book is pretty clear that the bonuses do not stack.

I am playing around with Oggdude`s fantastic character builder, and I am making a cyborg type character(gank as base).

I am adding cybernetic implants and I see that I can add brain implant more than once and cybernetic ams of the same type more than once and still get the characteristics benefits from them.

There should probably be a fix for that, because the book is pretty clear that the bonuses do not stack.

They are? Ok, cool. Where does it say?

Pg. 173

The Mod V Cyberarm provides + 1 Brawn, while the Mod VI provides + 1 Agility. If a character replaces both arms with cybernetic enhancements, he must use the same model, as they are designed to work in tandem. However, the modifiers from both arms do not stack.

Edit: I would take that to mean that however many Mod V or Mod VI arms you get, you will only get +1 to Agility or +1 to Brawn from the pair (or more) that you purchase, and purchasing multiple Cyberarms is not modding an existing single arm to boost a stat some more.

In a galaxy of billions of worlds, don`t you think there can be more than one model? And even if you are going with only the one type, can`t that be upgraded everytime you purchase the implant? This is science fantasy and space opera, it is roleplaying and game fiction, not hard science or even hard science fiction. I`d like to think the game incourages all kinds of creativity and fantastically exaggerated ideas, it only fits the hobby and the genre.

In a game with a broad spectrum of players, I believe there are some willing to interpret rules their own way in order to skirt around the game's inherent limitations in ways it was never intended to be played. But hey, it's your game… play it the way you want. Just don't insult our intelligence with your responses. You asked the question, RodianClone.

Of course there could be more than one model, but according to the core rules, they all work the same - over the ears and around the base of the skull with, presumably, a cybernetic link to the brain, melding man and machine. Besides, with Cloud City representing a place where no expense was spared, we can only assume LOBOT had the top of the line model. And if it was meant to be upgrades, the developers would have given it hard points.

None of that should stop you from running the game the way you want, of course. Or playing it that way if your GM is inclined to allow it. Just be willing to admit you're taking the rules-as-written out of context and ignoring the rules-as-intended almost entirely on the subject.

It's just stated the arms do not stack, I would say that the brains can't stack also due to the fluff description of it,

p 175

"T he implant fits around the user's ears

and back of the head, melding with the user's brain to
achieve superior reasoning speeds as well as to store information
for later analysis."

I'm sorry this looks a little min/max to me, except for the cost of the cybernetics, 1 eye = +1 vigilance? 2 eyes = +2 and so on?

I would say the book intends +1 vigilance for a 1 eye to a pair and doesn't stack. Same with the other implants.

It's just stated the arms do not stack, I would say that the brains can't stack also due to the fluff description of it,

p 175

"T he implant fits around the user's ears

and back of the head, melding with the user's brain to

achieve superior reasoning speeds as well as to store information

for later analysis."

Nonsense!

(Photoshopped image of Lobot with cyberbrains around his eyes, mouth, neck, head, ect.)

I think I am starting to become confused as to what game I'm playing now. Star Wars, or CP 2020?

In a galaxy of billions of worlds, don`t you think there can be more than one model? And even if you are going with only the one type, can`t that be upgraded everytime you purchase the implant? This is science fantasy and space opera, it is roleplaying and game fiction, not hard science or even hard science fiction. I`d like to think the game incourages all kinds of creativity and fantastically exaggerated ideas, it only fits the hobby and the genre.

In a game with a broad spectrum of players, I believe there are some willing to interpret rules their own way in order to skirt around the game's inherent limitations in ways it was never intended to be played. But hey, it's your game… play it the way you want. Just don't insult our intelligence with your responses. You asked the question, RodianClone.

Of course there could be more than one model, but according to the core rules, they all work the same - over the ears and around the base of the skull with, presumably, a cybernetic link to the brain, melding man and machine. Besides, with Cloud City representing a place where no expense was spared, we can only assume LOBOT had the top of the line model. And if it was meant to be upgrades, the developers would have given it hard points.

None of that should stop you from running the game the way you want, of course. Or playing it that way if your GM is inclined to allow it. Just be willing to admit you're taking the rules-as-written out of context and ignoring the rules-as-intended almost entirely on the subject.

I didn`t intend to insult anyone or anyone`s intelligence. Sorry if it seemed like that. I am asking these questions to the community in general as much as I`m asking myself.

As when it comes to playing the game "as intended" I really can`t say I agree with you. It is stated very early on in the core book that the story and the fun comes before the rules and the narrative thrumps the mechanics when it fits the story and the game.

But I wasn`t actually thinking of that at all or didn`t think I was breaking or bending rules at all! When cybernetic limbs are first described in the core book it reads "some cybernetic enhancements are visible, either because the wearer cares little about what others might think of his mechanical prostheses or because he can not afford better. others are near-perfect duplicates of lost limbs or are hidden within the body..."

And I think I remember that the equipment chapter is very clear that you can choose any kind of model or version as there likely are very many. For example it says that blasters "come in a seemingly infinite array of shapes and sizes"

I don`t think it is fair at all to say that I`m not playing the game as intended, I believe the game intends for you to be creative and tell interesting and fun stories and use the mechanics only as a tool or aid in telling that story.

It even seems like this narrative system incourages it a lot of times and I like that.

I can agree with how you interpret the rules and that you might not be able to have more benefits from the same implant, but my question was legit, I didn`t see anything about stacking, only the max limitation. I can of course be very wrong and the text clearly states that you can`t stack, bbut I didn`t see it.

I am sorry if you feel I was insulting you, I was thinking out loud(in reading:p) more than anything and asking questions for the sake of the arguement.

In a galaxy of billions of worlds, don`t you think there can be more than one model? And even if you are going with only the one type, can`t that be upgraded everytime you purchase the implant? This is science fantasy and space opera, it is roleplaying and game fiction, not hard science or even hard science fiction. I`d like to think the game incourages all kinds of creativity and fantastically exaggerated ideas, it only fits the hobby and the genre.

In a game with a broad spectrum of players, I believe there are some willing to interpret rules their own way in order to skirt around the game's inherent limitations in ways it was never intended to be played. But hey, it's your game… play it the way you want. Just don't insult our intelligence with your responses. You asked the question, RodianClone.

Of course there could be more than one model, but according to the core rules, they all work the same - over the ears and around the base of the skull with, presumably, a cybernetic link to the brain, melding man and machine. Besides, with Cloud City representing a place where no expense was spared, we can only assume LOBOT had the top of the line model. And if it was meant to be upgrades, the developers would have given it hard points.

None of that should stop you from running the game the way you want, of course. Or playing it that way if your GM is inclined to allow it. Just be willing to admit you're taking the rules-as-written out of context and ignoring the rules-as-intended almost entirely on the subject.

I didn`t intend to insult anyone or anyone`s intelligence. Sorry if it seemed like that. I am asking these questions to the community in general as much as I`m asking myself.

As when it comes to playing the game "as intended" I really can`t say I agree with you. It is stated very early on in the core book that the story and the fun comes before the rules and the narrative thrumps the mechanics when it fits the story and the game.

But I wasn`t actually thinking of that at all or didn`t think I was breaking or bending rules at all! When cybernetic limbs are first described in the core book it reads "some cybernetic enhancements are visible, either because the wearer cares little about what others might think of his mechanical prostheses or because he can not afford better. others are near-perfect duplicates of lost limbs or are hidden within the body..."

And I think I remember that the equipment chapter is very clear that you can choose any kind of model or version as there likely are very many. For example it says that blasters "come in a seemingly infinite array of shapes and sizes"

I don`t think it is fair at all to say that I`m not playing the game as intended, I believe the game intends for you to be creative and tell interesting and fun stories and use the mechanics only as a tool or aid in telling that story.

It even seems like this narrative system incourages it a lot of times and I like that.

I can agree with how you interpret the rules and that you might not be able to have more benefits from the same implant, but my question was legit, I didn`t see anything about stacking, only the max limitation. I can of course be very wrong and the text clearly states that you can`t stack, bbut I didn`t see it.

I am sorry if you feel I was insulting you, I was thinking out loud(in reading:p) more than anything.

I didn't see an insult, I see a discussion with questions happening, different GMs run things differently, it's when you and your friends come to my table or I to theirs the problems with rules interpretation causes problems. Statements like "it was never like that before", "no one enforces that rule" and so on.

When you post here people are going to look at the rules and take them at face value.

As far as different models being able to different things with weapons, equipment, and implants; some items have multiple models in the book and some only have one. What this means is a player needs to come up with a good excuse for a different implant not to work or look the way a manufacturer states something works or looks. All the implants in the EotE has one model listed.

No that doesn't mean that you can't come up with other models and design your own, heck to me that looks like a perfect opportunity to role play your Scientist, Doctor, Engineer, Architect, Mechanic and Entrepreneur. Make your characters earn the stacks and bonuses for the implants. The Entrepreneur could make some money for the group after the items are created. Now you can have your cake and eat it to. Just don't hand wave unless you absolutely have to, make them earn it.

Ultimately, yes, you can do what you asked with GM approval, but make them be creative.

I didn't see an insult, I see a discussion with questions happening, different GMs run things differently, it's when you and your friends come to my table or I to theirs the problems with rules interpretation causes problems. Statements like "it was never like that before", "no one enforces that rule" and so on.

When you post here people are going to look at the rules and take them at face value.

Yes, I agree, but the rules didn`t seem to cover it. I don`t feel any yes or no answer to the question contradicted the rules as written, that`s why I asked:)

As far as different models being able to different things with weapons, equipment, and implants; some items have multiple models in the book and some only have one. What this means is a player in mind needs to come up with a good excuse for a different implant not to work or look the way a manufacturer states something works or looks. All the implants in the EotE has one model listed.

I was only talking about cosmetics and how models looked, not what they are supposed to do. I was refering to the brain implant being able to look like anything beside what is in the movies, maybe even inside the head. That was how I interpreted the intro text for cybernetics at least. "some cybernetic enhancements are visible, either because the wearer cares little about what others might think of his mechanical prostheses or because he can not afford better. others are near-perfect duplicates of lost limbs or are hidden within the body..."

It wasn`t supposed to doo something different, it was only cosmetics and flavour, not mechanics. Of course, you can come up with your own equipment and gear, including cybernetics, in your own game that do their own mechanical thing of course.

Arms, hands, and legs would have to be covered up with synthetic skin or you have a Luke/Ani type deal, eye implant would also have to be handled the same way, the brain description has one model listed in the book and is what Lobot was wearing, immune implant is under the skin, Cybernetic weapon is retractable, implant armor can be seen under the skin as deformities, It is all in the books.

Want a different model that lends the illussion that the item is smaller or hidden? Have the PCs get together and create something better.

Want to house rule it, house rule it.

There will be different opinions on all of this, I like when members ask questions due to it giving me ideas or coming up with my own to present to my GM.

Arms, hands, and legs would have to be covered up with synthetic skin or you have a Luke/Ani type deal, eye implant would also have to be handled the same way, the brain description has one model listed in the book and is what Lobot was wearing, immune implant is under the skin, Cybernetic weapon is retractable, implant armor can be seen under the skin as deformities, It is all in the books.

Want a different model that lends the illussion that the item is smaller or hidden? Have the PCs get together and create something better.

Want to house rule it, house rule it.

There will be different opinions on all of this, I like when members ask questions due to it giving me ideas or coming up with my own to present to my GM.

I don`t see reskinning and flavouring as house-ruling, houseruling would be to change the mechanics of the game system. And from what I read in the core book they incourage you to come up with your own models and cosmetic looks for equipment and gear, as for example saying that if you play a droid, why not flavour the gear as being part of them. The included models only seems to to be suggestions, not "this is what it has to look like". If that was the case, why would they write that blasters come in a seemingly infinite number of models and that some cosmetics are made to look real, while others are not, depending on if the wearer cares or what he can afford?

I think I sound more eager than I really am:p