ROTBI said:

Fair enough, dude. I still like the card as-is, and i disagree that it is in need of an Errata. It is a POWERFUL card, no doubt, and it can certainly make most decks better at establishing Kill potential. However, PoTM doesn't ensure Kill. And, for the most part (with the exception of the cheesy King builds i've seen) it really DOES encourage playing attacks.

RockStar said:

The card defines the meta at the moment, 1) offering draw to symbols that don't otherwise have it, 2) damage to characters that don't otherwise have it, and 3) reducing the number of attacks needed in decks to win games... *

I'm not saying it needs a ban or errata, I'm just saying that if you don't recognize these 3 facts you are doing yourself a serious disservice.

* It's really obvious why it reduces the number of attacks necessary in decks. For the same reason King can 'abuse' it any other character can 'use' it to the same effect. Play symbol matching foundations, play 1 attack. Have the foundations dedicated to speed pump and that one attack does the damage of 3+ attacks. Toss in cards like Trained Far and Wide and run fewer attacks, all with the combo keyword, you can pretend you are king or Ivy, no progressive difficulty after passing your many foundations that turn. It also makes Zi Mei what she is and allows her to use few attacks, namely Fury, plus whatever else you end up feeling you need to run as a contingency plan. It essentially gives +18 damage to a fully multipled Fury in Zi Mei, that is a crazy damage pump!

Then again you could argue any damage pump on foundations replaces the number of attacks needed in your deck... and you'd probably be right. Which is why the combo keyword and attacks having the playable blocks is really what is seeing more attacks played, not cards like path that obviously DO NOT encourage more attacks be played.

- dut

dutpotd said:

+18 is pretty gnarly, fo sho! But, as Fury IS Zi Mei's "finisher", it should be gnarly!!

I'm not too certain that running fewer attacks is a better idea these days, however, as Control in NewFS is much different than it was a month and a half ago. Complete lockdown decks aren't anywhere to be seen (at the moment). MOst of my games in the new Meta, players start playing attacks T2, and either try and finish it then and there, or they are putting the hurt on ya to finish you off T3 or T4.

I've found that 14 attacks is actually not enough. I want to draw into attacks and play them out on a string. If i'm only throwing one or two attacks a turn, they are most often throws...or Fury with Zi Mei + PotM + All Life Is Prey...

Attacks rule in this Meta!!!

attacks did not completely rule my meta tonight. I played 2 attacks, then I played 2-3 foundations, then I played another attack then POTE E for the kill.

MarcoPulleaux said:

I'm gonna let you finish but Mulg is the biggest troll on the forums ever!

DvON said:

Trollbloods is cheating imho.

Hayamachop said:

Darn you Spinning Demon, darn you to heck!!!

+18 for a Fury? Only if you're not running Autumn's Kiss, which you should if your deck is already built to stall like an idiot.

A single Fury = Multiple:3 + Multiple:2 + Multiple:2 = +24 damage to one of them, not to mention the 24 total damage if unblocked.

Or two Entertainers first for effectively +32 damage and not all your eggs in one basket. Sure you can run both, but I'd rather Entertainer then Path in my ZM deck.

Why not? From the Horse, Endurance will give it +7 speed, making it a 12 speed. And that's just one copy. And I'm not counting any Glanzende Novas or Eisserne Drossels you may have. They can try dealing with the 14M27 then they still have to deal with 7 more 5M3 for all you care.

guitalex2008 said:

- '' Hi! sorry to disturb you, i'm Mark of the Beast, could you point me toward those seven 5M3 that were here a minute ago?''

- '' Sorry i don't know, i'm looking for my friend PotM myself, since that mummy dude over there appeared, cards started vanishing... ''

Cass said:

Kind of silly response, the point that there are answers upon answers for things doesn't really matter in this case, Path is an enabler pure and simple. Used with a card that requires significantly less setup than similar multiple attacks and you see some big damage early with Path + Fury.

Not to mention there is a problem with your dialogue, namely the mummy can't use mark of the beast...

- dut

dutpotd said:

Thank you, my friend. Despite the amount of posts in this thread, it seems this point has been lost. I liked LotM and there were answers to it, but still it was banned because it was an enabler. To the Bone, Kasumi Gaki, Fei Long's Forward Kick (?!?), etc. all gone the way of the dodo bird. To not recognize PotM as an enabler is a bit ridiculous. It easily has the ability to turn almost any attack into a kill card for a simple commit cost.

ROTBI said:

No problem, I think it is silly to call for a ban on this card "at this point in time", but I think it far sillier to ignore the fact that this card is seriously defining in what it possibly provides every character/deck.

Is it an auto-include? Depends on how you define auto, I know that barring Hilde and Astrid it will continue to show its face in all of my competitive decks, lest my deck has a theme that strongly disagrees with assets - becuase, let's face it, every other part of the card is beneficial, infinity, block, 5 check.

I think I posted earlier in this thread that having an additional ability (which is what I take the damage pump to be granted the 'symbol'ic theme of the card) is a-ok, but limiting the additional ability to something strong yet manageable, i.e. +5 damage <available to a card that shares 2 or more symbols>, is the type of errata I'd prefer to see if anything.

- dut

Hayamachop said:

Uhm...but you DID play attacks. And, more than one in a given turn. That's already an upgrade between last block and current.

My point is that UFS should stand for Universal Fighting System, and not Universal Foundation Spamming. PoTM encourages players to playing attacks.

Further, my experience with this block is that if you don't start throwing attacks T2, even if it damage wouldn't kill your opponent, then you will be outpaced in the overall match, and therefore most likely lose. This is a "for the most part" statement, and not entirely gospel truth.

So, for my $$$, i want to pack enough attacks that i can throw out 1 or 2 of them by T2 and then play a couple more foundations at the end of that (if i don't have enough mojo to have killed them by T2). This means, i want more than 10 attacks in my deck so that i have a better chance of drawing them by T2.

Again, PotM only encourages and, yes, enables this to occurr. I will certainly take this over 3 full turns of playing nothing BUT foundations before i establish Control Lock and kill you.

RockStar said:

I don't think you are looking at this right. PotM encourages 3 turns of build followed by one big bang. i.e. PotM is an asset and in no way assists with playing more attacks earlier, quite the opposite it makes your later attacks stronger.

This point is highlighted by the fact that PotM requires 'many' cards in the card pool to work, when do you get 'many' cards in the card pool? Later in the game more oft than earlier, i.e. not turn 2/3 when you are claiming to always attack. You will probably find a more agressive card, like Enraged Golem or Azure Knight, to promote early attacking.

It also doesn't necessarily encourage attacks to be played, i.e. you can still spam foundations and use their symbols to pump your '1' attack. In fact, maybe that is the errata Path needs, one that gives +x damage based on symbols on 'attacks' in the card pool. This wouldn't really impact Zi Mei, and only have a slight impact on Ivy, but it would likely reign in King... I wonder. I would then agree that the card encourages more 'attack' cards to be played.

As to your experience with this block, some decks throw out attacks turn 2, some don't. In many cases the turn where the kill happens is one after PotM has been played, whether this is turn 2/3/4/5, path becomes a serious damage pump - one that can catch up any sort of outpacing if used on an unblocked attack, and one that can replace the sheer volume of attacks some decks would otherwise need to play with to win.

- dut

dutpotd said:

You make good points, man.

I can only comment based upon my own experience with this card, and within my own Meta. I would hate to say that this is coming down to a difference in Meta, but it looks like it might.

For my own part, in my play group (of which there are anywhere between 4 - 8 players a time) we play quite aggressively (apparently), as T2 kills are the goal, and T3 kills more likely. Anything that goes beyond T4 is an "accident". So, those decks that take 2 full turns before throwing out an attack are running a very real risk of losing, PotM or not.

PotM runs incredibly well in my Christie deck and in my Zi Mei (Fury + All Life is Prey + PotM is SICK!!). Both decks try to end the game T2.

My friend, Smazzurco, has a Paul Phoenix deck and **Hata** deck that start throwing BIG attacks T2. And, this is without PoTM.

I guess i'm trying to say 2 things based upon my experience thus far in NewFS, as far as PotM is concerned:

1) It's a powerhouse of a card that helps decks establish kill potential. It doesn't ensure kill, however, and that is why i don't think it's brokesauce. Maybe if there are other cards that help ensure kill released in later sets, then this card might be a potential problem. As-is, right now, however...i just don't think so.

2) Most decks i've seen like to come right out of the gates swinging. And, not just with tiny poke attacks, but with 5 to 9+ damage/attack. It is more than likely that a well designed deck that does this would KO a deck that is trying to stall to later rounds. Stall isn't nearly as powerful as it was 6 weeks ago. Control just isn't as powerful as it was 6 weeks ago. NewFS is all about playing attacks early, and often...at least it is at this moment, imho.

The former Scout who taught me how to play this game 2 years ago likened the UFS Aggro vs Temp vs Control themes to a Pendulum. Right now, it appears that we're in an era of Aggro (which makes me verrry happy, btw). The Pendulum, which was fully on the side of LockDown Control only 6 weeks ago, has swung to Aggro. It will probably stay like this for a spell before starting it's inevitable swing back toward Control. In the median time, hitting an area where Tempo-style decks will be real contenders.

Where does PotM fit into all this, and in the long run? I honestly don't know...If, PoTM does encourage one to play more foundations, as you've suggested, Dut, then it is a very wise thing indeed that some of the more powerful Control tech is now being printed on attacks, which is as it really should be, imho! My hope is that this trend of Control Tech on attacks will continue, lest we get into Gray Wars II.

ROTBI said:

Yup, but as usual, FFG has overzealous faith in their game. I mean, come on, THERE ARE ANSWERS!

Here's another thing about Path: what about those who never got em? Like me, who has 4 patches =/

MarcoPulleaux said:

I offered to trade you a playset of path for either a playset of knight breaker or minutte dance during some other thread that you were crying about not having any...

That was some other crybaby.

Now eat my scrotum.

kiit said:

Wow who wouldn't tell you no? a playset of 30-40 dollar URs for some promo that people got for free?

Paths go for like 10 bux on Ebay. Unfortunatly those of us who don't have access to ebay have todeal with rip off traders like you -__-

Apparently Jeremy Ray has some super shipment of Path of the Masters.

I'm considering getting them from him, but I remain resolute:

Path of the Master will get banned. I'm telling you. Yeah, it took Rejection a year and a half to get banned, but I always knew since day 1 that it would get banned.

MarcoPulleaux said:

Kinda like BRT, right?

Ugh, ******* Christ BRT.

You know what I loved most about BRT?

During Worlds, everbody thought Evil and Order were dead.

Dude...do you have any idea how many people I pissed off with my Bloods?

...=D

MarcoPulleaux said:

No one thought order was dead yo