There's a lot of lament regarding a certain ship's inability to complete a helical roll around a straight flightpath (thanks Wikipedia) but there's a larger issue here. In a zero-g environment, ALL ships should be able to do it. Hell, even if you reintroduce gravity AND aerodynamics, pretty much every airborne craft that flys can do it...even the lumbering 747.

So why not let every ship do it? You can let the Space Superiority fighters still do it without penalty, and impose a stress or roll for damage penalty if the ship has too much junk in its trunk to pull the maneuver off gracefully in a fight. That's the key here. The ship should be able to comfortably execute the move dynamically without stress to the pilot or the craft. We've all seen that .gif of the Xwing pulling a barrel roll off in combat, so FFG goofed there...unless they're thinking that the ship couldn't do it without incurring stress (as they do when using Expert Handling).

Yeah, it steps on the toes of EH, but so what. If all ships could barrel roll, EH can now make the BR stress free for everyone.

Is this one just too whacky?

Gameplay>physics

As of now only the Lambda Class shuttle is incapable of a barrel roll.

Everyone else can take Expert Handling (even Y-wings if they have R2-D6 or flying Scum Kavil)

and the wave 7 heavy bombers when they come out.

As of now only the Lambda Class shuttle is incapable of a barrel roll.

Everyone else can take Expert Handling (even Y-wings if they have R2-D6 or flying Scum Kavil)

Poor, unlucky cow.

Hell, even if you reintroduce gravity AND aerodynamics, pretty much every airborne craft that flys can do it...even the lumbering 747.

That's a 707, not a 747. Pretty big difference.

It's like opening a can of worms, because the exact same argument can be made for the evade action.

Hell, even if you reintroduce gravity AND aerodynamics, pretty much every airborne craft that flys can do it...even the lumbering 747.

That's a 707, not a 747. Pretty big difference.

Fine, I'll raise you an Airbus a380,

It's like opening a can of worms, because the exact same argument can be made for the evade action.

Like nikk whyte mentioned "gameplay>physics" or reality

It's like opening a can of worms, because the exact same argument can be made for the evade action.

As bad as green dice have been to me, I think a 1 die evade mod should be available for 4 points.

It's like opening a can of worms, because the exact same argument can be made for the evade action.

As bad as green dice have been to me, I think a 1 die evade mod should be available for 4 points.

It's like opening a can of worms, because the exact same argument can be made for the evade action.

Exactly kinda like how the xwing should be a 4 attack since it has 4 lasers, as well as the interceptor.

Like nikk whyte mentioned "gameplay>physics" or reality

Oooooh man it's time to go there!

The Falcon should be able to shoot twice per turn because two turrets.

Same for the Outrider and Decimator.

X-Wings should be able to survive longer.

All ships should be able to do a 180 and maintain the same speed and direction of motion.

There is no sound in space. Or opera music. Just the deep void of nothingness.

There's really no reason why every small base ship can't evade. Barrel roll I can understand a bit, I suppose its a timing thing, an X Wing can execute the maneuver but not in the space of time for it to be classified as an action.

To be honest, I would prefer that certain skills only pertain to certain ships .. keeping them somewhat unique. I'm happy that the X-Wing can't boost or barrel roll without a cost. It seems every ship now can boost/barrel roll.

Because.

Another answer in the on-going series of Short Answers to Long Questions.

There's really no reason why every small base ship can't evade. Barrel roll I can understand a bit, I suppose its a timing thing, an X Wing can execute the maneuver but not in the space of time for it to be classified as an action.

Not every small based ship can evade every other small based ship to the same efficacy. They can all evade large ships better than large ships can evade large/small ships. Point of reference matters. Agility dice compensate. A-wings and Interceptors dodge another attack.

It's like opening a can of worms, because the exact same argument can be made for the evade action.

Exactly kinda like how the xwing should be a 4 attack since it has 4 lasers, as well as the interceptor.

Like nikk whyte mentioned "gameplay>physics" or reality

Oooooh man it's time to go there!

The Falcon should be able to shoot twice per turn because two turrets.

Same for the Outrider and Decimator.

X-Wings should be able to survive longer.

All ships should be able to do a 180 and maintain the same speed and direction of motion.

There is no sound in space. Or opera music. Just the deep void of nothingness.

Dont forget, if you watch EpIV you can distintly see Vader's Adv oneshot a Y.

I don't want the Xwing to boost or Barrel Roll without the existing upgrades. I like that they have to joust more and k-turn. I think, if anything, some way to manage the stress after the K might get them more competitive, perhaps an evade token or a focus, maybe it takes two stress tokens to lock them out of red maneuvers, though one still costs their action. Every ship having the barrel roll would be not fun for me.

Barrel rolling in space is different in space and requires more than just tilting your flaps and letting air resistance rotate your ship. Also, there's still forces that act on the frame that could prevent it from barrel rolling.

When you spin a top, it's not gravity that keeps it spinning.

Really short answer. If everything could do everything how boring do you think this gam would be?

Really short answer. If everything could do everything how boring do you think this gam would be?

Fair point, yet not all actions are created equal, Target lock is probably the most underused ability that comes standard on any ship that has it , Im sure anyone who flies the X-wing on a regular basis would most happily forgo the TL action for a BR action, or boost, or evade.

As has been mentioned many times by now the original ships and the original abilities were made without the forethought of newer abilities.

Im sure if the X-wing were to be released now with all of the current abilities and upgrades available the X-wing might have a few more bells and whistles (possibly boost or BR and maybe a sensor slot)

I see it like this: In reality (as far as science-fiction goes), every ship would be capable of performing a barrel roll to some degree. Some can do it quickly, and as such their in-game counterparts have the action icon, and the others are just too slow to consider it worthy of the action icon.

The BARREL ROLL is not only a ROLL, it is a difficult maneuver to fly.

If the maneuver (and action) planning tool where a set of cards - and each fighter had its own standard deck of maneuver and action cards, as well as restrictions, and each pilot had special maneuvers to expand the standard deck,

it would be possible that, say the experienced generic pilots could execute the Barrel Roll, while the beginner generics cannot.

But this is not the case in X-Wing. In fact, this would be a completely different game.

Play Sid Meier's Ace Patrol to see how this works

It's like opening a can of worms, because the exact same argument can be made for the evade action.

Exactly kinda like how the xwing should be a 4 attack since it has 4 lasers, as well as the interceptor.

Like nikk whyte mentioned "gameplay>physics" or reality

Oooooh man it's time to go there!

The Falcon should be able to shoot twice per turn because two turrets.

Same for the Outrider and Decimator.

X-Wings should be able to survive longer.

All ships should be able to do a 180 and maintain the same speed and direction of motion.

There is no sound in space. Or opera music. Just the deep void of nothingness.

Dont forget, if you watch EpIV you can distintly see Vader's Adv oneshot a Y.

"I Have You Now"

5 pt EPT

Darth Vader only

When performing an attack at range 1 roll a number of attack dice equal to the combined value of the defending ship's hull and shield values.

There, canon has been maintained.

Then again it would also be pretty hilarious to see him one shot the falcon or a CR 90, you may need to borrow some of the other player's dice.

13 dice! GO.

expected hits: (13 x 6/8) + (13- 13x6/8)x6/8