when utilizing the critical effect on a card, do you still get the damage on the facing you are firing at and do the two damage to the sides? Or do you lose the damage by spending the critical effect on the die to only do the effect that is stated on the card?

This just happened to me and it really makes me feel like there is no point at playing rebels right now.

I always youth you spent the critical to have the alternate effect instead. Of coarse during the game I couldn't find anything to support my argument. However I'm pretty sure I saw something here that supported my argument.

I mean, the book says you do not spend the critical effect unless the card specifically states to do so. But this makes it to where you can hit the front of a Nebulon and take out all of its shields on the sides, plus what you do to the front. Granted I shouldn't be in a position where I am that close to a VSD, but a 3x3 is only so big.

By chance did you get hit by the front firing arc of the Victory I Star Destroyer? It's a humbling experience even without the concussion missile upgrade. Those black dice are devastating.

But yeah, on the Resolve Damage step for a ship to ship attack, the attacker can resolve one critical effect and then the defender suffers damage equal to the number of damage and crit icons rolled.

If a black crit icon was rolled, the attacker could first use concussion missiles to make the two zones adjacent to the defending hull zone suffer damage. Then, the defending hull zone would suffer damage equal to the sum of damage and crit icons rolled. If hull damage took place, the defender would not put the first card faceup, since the attacker chose the missile crit effect instead of the default crit effect.

when utilizing the critical effect on a card, do you still get the damage on the facing you are firing at and do the two damage to the sides? Or do you lose the damage by spending the critical effect on the die to only do the effect that is stated on the card?

This just happened to me and it really makes me feel like there is no point at playing rebels right now.

I always youth you spent the critical to have the alternate effect instead. Of coarse during the game I couldn't find anything to support my argument. However I'm pretty sure I saw something here that supported my argument.

I mean, the book says you do not spend the critical effect unless the card specifically states to do so. But this makes it to where you can hit the front of a Nebulon and take out all of its shields on the sides, plus what you do to the front. Granted I shouldn't be in a position where I am that close to a VSD, but a 3x3 is only so big.

It seems like you're asking whether a critical does damage AND a critical effect, to which the answer is yes. Damage and critical effects are two separate things resolved in two different steps. A crit dice equals one damage and allows you to resolve one critical effect. Multiple crits equals that many points of damage, but still only one critical effect. It seems you are referencing assault missiles. In that case you total the damage, apply it to the hull facing you targeted, and then apply the critical effect, which does 1 dmg to each adjacent hull, like you said.

I suggest reviewing pg 2, ATTACK , and pg 4, CRITICAL EFFECTS , in the rules reference for more clarification

I would add that if you are getting that close to a vic II in a nebulon, then you're going to have a bad day regardless what upgrades he has.

So at a minimum, the Concussion Missiles does 4 damage. 2 to the side it is facing, plus the two on the adjacent sides. For sevent points, that is ridiculous.

Frustrating to say the least. I can make a point to never get stuck in short range like that again, but that really is just too much for a seven point upgrade.

Are we talking about the Assault Concussion Missile card from the basic set?

I thought you had to -spend- the black crit die in order to resolve this effect, and once spent, that die wouldn't count for damage.

So at a minimum, the Concussion Missiles does 4 damage. 2 to the side it is facing, plus the two on the adjacent sides. For sevent points, that is ridiculous.

Frustrating to say the least. I can make a point to never get stuck in short range like that again, but that really is just too much for a seven point upgrade.

that critical effect ONLY does damage to the adjacent hulls. So say you rolled one crit and nothing else, it would be one damage to the side you hit, then one damage to each adjacent hull, totaling 3 damage. Again, direct damage is resolved first, then you resolve the critical afterwards as an entirely separate step.

Are we talking about the Assault Concussion Missile card from the basic set?

I thought you had to -spend- the black crit die in order to resolve this effect, and once spent, that die wouldn't count for damage.

When you see a critical effect on a card, it just means that if you roll a critical with the color indicated on the card, you can resolve the effect of that card rather than the default critical if you so choose. There is no spending dice involved (unless specifically stated), and the damage dealt is still applied as normal regardless of the critical effect that you choose to apply, if any.

Are we talking about the Assault Concussion Missile card from the basic set?

I thought you had to -spend- the black crit die in order to resolve this effect, and once spent, that die wouldn't count for damage.

When you see a critical effect on a card, it just means that if you roll a critical with the color indicated on the card, you can resolve the effect of that card rather than the default critical if you so choose. There is no spending dice involved (unless specifically stated), and the damage dealt is still applied as normal regardless of the critical effect that you choose to apply, if any.

Oooh, that's awesome. Thanks for the heads up.

Basically, any time you attack, and one of the dice comes up as a critical icon, you are entitled to *one* critical effect. You pick.

So the default one is that the first damage card from that salvo that is drawn due to hull damage is done face up. BUT, if you have upgrade cards with critical icons and a description, that is an alternate critical effect you may choose to use. Another great example is Dodonna's Pride which allows you discard all damage from the attack in exchange for giving the target a single face up damage card that bypasses shields. It's why Dodonna's pride is so nasty .. all you need is a single critical on a blue die to cause a face up damage card, regardless of how many shields on that target hull facing.

So at a minimum, the Concussion Missiles does 4 damage. 2 to the side it is facing, plus the two on the adjacent sides. For sevent points, that is ridiculous.

Frustrating to say the least. I can make a point to never get stuck in short range like that again, but that really is just too much for a seven point upgrade.

that critical effect ONLY does damage to the adjacent hulls. So say you rolled one crit and nothing else, it would be one damage to the side you hit, then one damage to each adjacent hull, totaling 3 damage. Again, direct damage is resolved first, then you resolve the critical afterwards as an entirely separate step.

I almost said the same exact thing, but IIRC the black crit faces are all crit + damage, so if you rolled one black crit you are doing 2 damage from the die, plus the additional two from the missiles.

That's right Wonderpug. the black die only does a crit on a dying that also has a hit.

Just wanted to add this from the RRG, step 5 of the Attack Resolution:

The attacker can resolve one critical effect. Then the defender suffers damage equal to the number of [hit] icons. If the both the attacker and defender are ships, the number of [crit] icons is added to the damage total.

Allso under "Critical Effects":

Critical effects resolve at the beginning of the “Resolve Damage” step of an attack

So contrary to what several people have said here, critical effect is resolved before the you suffer damage based on hit and crit icons.

So at a minimum, the Concussion Missiles does 4 damage. 2 to the side it is facing, plus the two on the adjacent sides. For sevent points, that is ridiculous.

Frustrating to say the least. I can make a point to never get stuck in short range like that again, but that really is just too much for a seven point upgrade.

They've basically traded a possibility of two damage for 2 damage. In addition it is a crit that can only happen at the closest range. So it's a ton of incentive to stay away. If it were more than just black crits I'd agree. It'd be too good. But as it is, it's only good. Not too good.

As Aminar said. The basic critical effect is that one of the points of damage on the hull causes a crippling effect. Whereas the Concussion Missiles critical effect is that one extra point of damage is applied to each adjacent hull facing.

You'll generally notice this type of thing frequently on black dice upgrade cards. While the generic critical effect is a cross between damage and control by keeping the same damage, but including a face up damage card if it gets through to the hull, black dice generally forego precision in favor of just raw damage. You'll even notice that on the black dice themselves ... lots of damage and crit, but no accuracy.

Blue critical effects are the opposite ... all control and precision, but less damage. For example, Dodonna's Pride gives a single shield bypassing face up damage card, but otherwise cancels the rest of the damage. Or another example being Overload Pulse, which trades one of the face up damage cards for the ability to exhaust all the defense tokens.

So if you're wondering how it is that Concussion Missiles can dish out that much damage, it's because it's meant to. It foregoes precision and crippling effects in exchange for two additional points of damage spread out across the ship. But all damage cards that strike the hull are dealt face down.

It's all strategy based on how you the player wants to play. If you want to get in close and just wildly pound something into submission, black dice and ordnance upgrade cards are what you want. If you prefer to hang back and just control the fight and frustrate your opponent, blue dice and ion cannon upgrades are what you want. And if neither extreme tempts you, just stick to the basic middle ground critical effect.

So at a minimum, the Concussion Missiles does 4 damage. 2 to the side it is facing, plus the two on the adjacent sides. For sevent points, that is ridiculous.

Frustrating to say the least. I can make a point to never get stuck in short range like that again, but that really is just too much for a seven point upgrade.

that critical effect ONLY does damage to the adjacent hulls. So say you rolled one crit and nothing else, it would be one damage to the side you hit, then one damage to each adjacent hull, totaling 3 damage. Again, direct damage is resolved first, then you resolve the critical afterwards as an entirely separate step.

I almost said the same exact thing, but IIRC the black crit faces are all crit + damage, so if you rolled one black crit you are doing 2 damage from the die, plus the additional two from the missiles.

Whoops, you're right. Forgot the black dice have the double icons. So yes, 4 dmg was right.

So...

When you roll a black crit, you can choose to resolve it normally, or you can deal 1 additional damage to each adjacent hull zone, while still dealing one normal damage to the target hull zone?

This would be in addition to any other hits rolled on other dice or the same black die.

Is that how it works?

Well, to be precise, if that critical hit die didn't get cancelled out by Evade in Step 4, you automatically do one point of damage to the two hull zones that are adjacent to your targeted hull zone, which cannot be defended against.

Then you count all the damage summed from the number of hit and criticals totalled on all your dice, including that one, divide by two rounded up if the defender used Brace in Step 4, and then either apply it all to your targeted hull zone, or spread it across two hull zones as dictated by the defender if he used Redirect in Step 4.

In other words, you got it right, but just make sure to take into account what happened during Step 4, especially in regards to Evade.