Sure, the profit margin on each individual piece will go down, but ultimately you should see more sales and won't be sitting on stock.

For X-Wing at least, that's the biggest problem. Most stores aren't sitting on stock, they can't get enough in to have any sitting around.

My LGS owner has complained more than once about how hard it is to keep anything from FFG in stock. Makes it hard to do much to attract new players when you can't even offer them a core set.

But in general I think most LGS don't have a high enough volume of business to lower their prices by much, at least not for miniature games.

Also, without games stores, FFG isn't a company. The fact is the vast majority of gamers first became gamers because of games stores. If there were no more games stores, your gaming groups aren't going to sustain the industry like games stores do. So there is no armada, or most any other games for that matter. So what exactly do online stores, and people who only play in their friends basements provide for the continuation of the community?

Sorry but that is not true. For MTG and minis players maybe, but not for boardgame players.

We organize our X-Wing gaming session at the FLGS just because we outgrown the capacity of our houses and we needed a central hub to meet. But it started not in shop, but in our house and online (it is on BGG that I heard about X-Wing first time).

If by board games you mean candy land and monopoly... Sure...

No he means boardgames, like most of this companies offerings. Don't be a ****.

Sure, the profit margin on each individual piece will go down, but ultimately you should see more sales and won't be sitting on stock.

.But in general I think most LGS don't have a high enough volume of business to lower their prices by much, at least not for miniature games.

Exactly, and if more people bought from their LGS the store would see that they can do more volume, and might be more willing to offer some type of discount. Mine has a loyalty program.

Sure, the profit margin on each individual piece will go down, but ultimately you should see more sales and won't be sitting on stock.

For X-Wing at least, that's the biggest problem. Most stores aren't sitting on stock, they can't get enough in to have any sitting around.

My LGS owner has complained more than once about how hard it is to keep anything from FFG in stock. Makes it hard to do much to attract new players when you can't even offer them a core set.

But in general I think most LGS don't have a high enough volume of business to lower their prices by much, at least not for miniature games.

I'm glad to hear they are moving so well X-wing is one of the few things that seems to be moving (as you said), especially when the online supplies are also hard to find (like when the Falcon and Firespray were sold out just about anywhere you looked).

But I still see tons of board games, and STAW and such not sitting on the shelves at the various FLGS' I visit over the course of each month.

I also see things like the Epic ships sitting. Yes, that is a more limited market, but that limited market is also more apt to save $15-30 by buying those ships online and then buy 2 smaller ships at the FLGS. In my opinion of course.

I love all the game shops I visit, but only a few of them seem to be doing really well. I would think that something like a minor 10-15% could draw in more $$ for all their games (not just X-Wing). Once again, my opinion.

I have heard the argument about selling at online prices won't meet the rent.

But, if they are selling at online prices, more people will buy at their FLGS first (I would think), so the volume of sales should go up. Sure, the profit margin on each individual piece will go down, but ultimately you should see more sales and won't be sitting on stock.

Ok, ok, so maybe they don't want to take the risk.

But what about offering things like pre-paid pre-order discounts? Then they have the product paid for prior to even ordering stock, and are basically giving the customer a call once it comes in. It isn't even like that is a risk (unless the distributor doesn't deliver).

But, I am not a small business game store owner. Just someone who would spend more of my $$ at their shops if they offered even a 10-15% discount. As it stands, I make a purchase every time I visit the shops, but I make my large orders on line.

What it really comes down to is this. Them taking your money isn't a bad thing. They aren't doing anything wrong trying to make a living like normal people. There's always this vague feeling hidden in threads like this that game store owners are ripping us off.

Would it be nice to get a discount? Yes(in fact my FLGS has one and I love them for it.)

But they operate in a city with low property values. And they have no employees. And they work all the time.

But just because online businesses can afford to sell us bulk orders for cheaper doesn't mean the local stores are doing anything wrong by trying to make a living anymore than we're ripping our employers off by getting paid to work.

Buying online isn't wrong. But if you buy online exclusively and walk into that game store like you own the place you're probably being shady.

In fact I have issues(with myself) over attending tournaments at stores other than my favorite local store because I don't split my purchases between the three at hand.(I like the owners of one much more than the others. They're nice people, always smiling, and remember my name.)

So I rarely go to the others. Welcome to Midwest Shame.

Sure, the profit margin on each individual piece will go down, but ultimately you should see more sales and won't be sitting on stock.

.But in general I think most LGS don't have a high enough volume of business to lower their prices by much, at least not for miniature games.

Exactly, and if more people bought from their LGS the store would see that they can do more volume, and might be more willing to offer some type of discount. Mine has a loyalty program.

^

This

I'd be fine with a loyalty card, or even a discount based on $ spent per purchase.

Heck, I get a free pretzel for every 10 that I buy at Auntie Anne's...

Also, without games stores, FFG isn't a company. The fact is the vast majority of gamers first became gamers because of games stores. If there were no more games stores, your gaming groups aren't going to sustain the industry like games stores do. So there is no armada, or most any other games for that matter. So what exactly do online stores, and people who only play in their friends basements provide for the continuation of the community?

Played plenty of board games when there wasn't a single game store in the area I grew up. Oddly enough, we had plenty of games to play.... Panzer blitz, squad leader, empires in arms, axis and allies, third reich, etc.

The "community" did and continues to do fine, with or without a local game store.

So do people who demand and expect others to support game shops feel that others exist to provide them with a place to play?

What it really comes down to is this. Them taking your money isn't a bad thing. They aren't doing anything wrong trying to make a living like normal people. There's always this vague feeling hidden in threads like this that game store owners are ripping us off.

Would it be nice to get a discount? Yes(in fact my FLGS has one and I love them for it.)

But they operate in a city with low property values. And they have no employees. And they work all the time.

But just because online businesses can afford to sell us bulk orders for cheaper doesn't mean the local stores are doing anything wrong by trying to make a living anymore than we're ripping our employers off by getting paid to work.

Buying online isn't wrong. But if you buy online exclusively and walk into that game store like you own the place you're probably being shady.

In fact I have issues(with myself) over attending tournaments at stores other than my favorite local store because I don't split my purchases between the three at hand.(I like the owners of one much more than the others. They're nice people, always smiling, and remember my name.)

So I rarely go to the others. Welcome to Midwest Shame.

Speaking just for myself, I don't feel that they are ripping us off, and most of the store owners I've met over the past 3 decades have been really nice and enthusiastic people (with the occasional less than savory soul).

I am just of the opinion that with the change in times, you have to evolve or you become extinct.

I have already seen many game stores close, and many more that are struggling.

Though there are a few that are quite successful (usually in the low rent areas - surrounded by warehouse and furniture shops).

I am just thinking that more incentives get people to spend more at the brick and mortar shops.

This past weekend for free comic book day and May the 4th, our local comic shop had sales. Discounts on games and Star Wars related product. I've never seen the store more packed, and their Imperial Assault Ally/Villain packs were all but sold out (stuff that had been sitting for weeks prior).

Also, without games stores, FFG isn't a company. The fact is the vast majority of gamers first became gamers because of games stores. If there were no more games stores, your gaming groups aren't going to sustain the industry like games stores do. So there is no armada, or most any other games for that matter. So what exactly do online stores, and people who only play in their friends basements provide for the continuation of the community?

Played plenty of board games when there wasn't a single game store in the area I grew up. Oddly enough, we had plenty of games to play.... Panzer blitz, squad leader, empires in arms, axis and allies, third reich, etc.

The "community" did and continues to do fine, with or without a local game store.

So do people who demand and expect others to support game shops feel that others exist to provide them with a place to play?

Also, without games stores, FFG isn't a company. The fact is the vast majority of gamers first became gamers because of games stores. If there were no more games stores, your gaming groups aren't going to sustain the industry like games stores do. So there is no armada, or most any other games for that matter. So what exactly do online stores, and people who only play in their friends basements provide for the continuation of the community?

Sorry but that is not true. For MTG and minis players maybe, but not for boardgame players.

We organize our X-Wing gaming session at the FLGS just because we outgrown the capacity of our houses and we needed a central hub to meet. But it started not in shop, but in our house and online (it is on BGG that I heard about X-Wing first time).

If by board games you mean candy land and monopoly... Sure...

Sorry, I don't live in 70's. I am talking about modern boardgames.

And what you still don't understand is that without game stores, the "modern" board game industry doesn't exist...

Can I prove that without the stores that first sold their products (before the Internet), that nonmainstream board game companies would or wouldn't exist? Let me think about that real hard... /eyeroll

Also, without games stores, FFG isn't a company. The fact is the vast majority of gamers first became gamers because of games stores. If there were no more games stores, your gaming groups aren't going to sustain the industry like games stores do. So there is no armada, or most any other games for that matter. So what exactly do online stores, and people who only play in their friends basements provide for the continuation of the community?

Played plenty of board games when there wasn't a single game store in the area I grew up. Oddly enough, we had plenty of games to play.... Panzer blitz, squad leader, empires in arms, axis and allies, third reich, etc.

The "community" did and continues to do fine, with or without a local game store.

So do people who demand and expect others to support game shops feel that others exist to provide them with a place to play?

This is the kind of close minded response I would expect from someone who doesn't understand we're all part of a larger communit. You think there weren't game stores/comic shops anywhere while you were growing up??? If you want to shop online, that's fine, but don't pretend like it has no effect on the community/industry. Because you're wrog, but you're free to be as selfish as you like.

This is the kind of close minded response I would expect from someone who doesn't understand that there different ways in which to build and maintain a gaming community. A game store isn't necessary nor do people exist to make sure you have a game store to go too.

As for your straw man, I never said there weren't game or comics stores, I said there weren't any where I grew up and yet games were still purchased (through the mail in the case of Avalon hill and spi games) and played. People still do purchase and play them back home and guess what? A game store wasn't required,

Can you tell me where they would have sold them otherwise? In quantity enough to make it a viable business venture? I don't remember Walmart selling panzer blitz or squad leader.

It all depends on what they can make work. I've yet to meet a rich game store owner. Many that make a decent living.

What it really comes down to is this. Them taking your money isn't a bad thing. They aren't doing anything wrong trying to make a living like normal people. There's always this vague feeling hidden in threads like this that game store owners are ripping us off.

I would argue just the opposite: that there is an atmosphere of moral panic directed at those who don't buy all their stuff from the F?LGS. I'm all for spending money where you play, if you happen to play at a game store. I don't, although I will buy something if and when I do go in. I just don't think that the gaming industry is facing imminent collapse from people buying online.

Can I prove that without the stores that first sold their products (before the Internet), that nonmainstream board game companies would or wouldn't exist? Let me think about that real hard... /eyeroll

Just prove your statement. "Without game stores, modern game industry doesn't exist"

Shouldn't be too hard to do, right?

Can you provide proof, not an, "everybody knows where I live that this is true" statement to back up your assertion?

No he can't, because such a thing is impossible to prove. You can't prove that something wouldn't of happened if something else hadn't.

We can however prove that the modern board game came along without much in the way of stores to support it. Can also prove that RPG's did just fine without game stores either. But neither of those really require the kind of space that a tabletop game does.

It all depends on what they can make work. I've yet to meet a rich game store owner. Many that make a decent living.

What it really comes down to is this. Them taking your money isn't a bad thing. They aren't doing anything wrong trying to make a living like normal people. There's always this vague feeling hidden in threads like this that game store owners are ripping us off.

I would argue just the opposite: that there is an atmosphere of moral panic directed at those who don't buy all their stuff from the F?LGS. I'm all for spending money where you play, if you happen to play at a game store. I don't, although I will buy something if and when I do go in. I just don't think that the gaming industry is facing imminent collapse from people buying online.

Also, without games stores, FFG isn't a company. The fact is the vast majority of gamers first became gamers because of games stores. If there were no more games stores, your gaming groups aren't going to sustain the industry like games stores do. So there is no armada, or most any other games for that matter. So what exactly do online stores, and people who only play in their friends basements provide for the continuation of the community?

Played plenty of board games when there wasn't a single game store in the area I grew up. Oddly enough, we had plenty of games to play.... Panzer blitz, squad leader, empires in arms, axis and allies, third reich, etc.

The "community" did and continues to do fine, with or without a local game store.

So do people who demand and expect others to support game shops feel that others exist to provide them with a place to play?

This is the kind of close minded response I would expect from someone who doesn't understand we're all part of a larger communit. You think there weren't game stores/comic shops anywhere while you were growing up??? If you want to shop online, that's fine, but don't pretend like it has no effect on the community/industry. Because you're wrog, but you're free to be as selfish as you like.

This is the kind of close minded response I would expect from someone who doesn't understand that there different ways in which to build and maintain a gaming community. A game store isn't necessary nor do people exist to make sure you have a game store to go too.

As for your straw man, I never said there weren't game or comics stores, I said there weren't any where I grew up and yet games were still purchased (through the mail in the case of Avalon hill and spi games) and played. People still do purchase and play them back home and guess what? A game store wasn't required,

I get it now, you still don't get it. Yes those companies could still sell stuff through magazines in such. What you don't understand is that without distributors to sell to, (in case you don't know what those are, they sell to retailers, those stores you think arent needed) they would never create the games in the first place (not even to sell in magazines) because it's not a viable business model. Just like pretty much every other industry in the entire world.

Can I prove that without the stores that first sold their products (before the Internet), that nonmainstream board game companies would or wouldn't exist? Let me think about that real hard... /eyeroll

Just prove your statement. "Without game stores, modern game industry doesn't exist"

Shouldn't be too hard to do, right?

Also, without games stores, FFG isn't a company. The fact is the vast majority of gamers first became gamers because of games stores. If there were no more games stores, your gaming groups aren't going to sustain the industry like games stores do. So there is no armada, or most any other games for that matter. So what exactly do online stores, and people who only play in their friends basements provide for the continuation of the community?

Played plenty of board games when there wasn't a single game store in the area I grew up. Oddly enough, we had plenty of games to play.... Panzer blitz, squad leader, empires in arms, axis and allies, third reich, etc.

The "community" did and continues to do fine, with or without a local game store.

So do people who demand and expect others to support game shops feel that others exist to provide them with a place to play?

This is the kind of close minded response I would expect from someone who doesn't understand we're all part of a larger communit. You think there weren't game stores/comic shops anywhere while you were growing up??? If you want to shop online, that's fine, but don't pretend like it has no effect on the community/industry. Because you're wrog, but you're free to be as selfish as you like.

I am pretty sure online shopping was not existing when he was growing up. So using an analogy of when he was growing up is pretty mooth. The thing with BM shops is that they do not want to evolve with their world. They still want to have monopol of a niche market to set the price they want to charge.market. We live in a numeric world. You either adapt or die. We call this evolution.

I just don't think that the gaming industry is facing imminent collapse from people buying online.

There is an inherent value in having people play at your store, even if they didn't buy everything they're playing with at your store.

I could go to a store and spend $250 on stuff, but without anyone to play with... How often am I going to come back there? It's a bit like the F2P system in MMO's, sure the F2P people aren't paying anything, but they're still providing a service of a sort, namely someone for those who do pay someone to play with.

So again, if you play at the store, you should buy stuff there. I again think of it as a rental fee for table space. But it's not like you should feel like the only stuff you can use is stuff you bought there.

Can you provide proof, not an, "everybody knows where I live that this is true" statement to back up your assertion?

No he can't, because such a thing is impossible to prove. You can't prove that something wouldn't of happened if something else hadn't.We can however prove that the modern board game came along without much in the way of stores to support it. Can also prove that RPG's did just fine without game stores either. But neither of those really require the kind of space that a tabletop game does.

That is actually the exact opposite of true... I guess it was just a coincidence that when comic book stores became popular, the popularity of RPGs also increased right?

Also, without games stores, FFG isn't a company. The fact is the vast majority of gamers first became gamers because of games stores. If there were no more games stores, your gaming groups aren't going to sustain the industry like games stores do. So there is no armada, or most any other games for that matter. So what exactly do online stores, and people who only play in their friends basements provide for the continuation of the community?

Played plenty of board games when there wasn't a single game store in the area I grew up. Oddly enough, we had plenty of games to play.... Panzer blitz, squad leader, empires in arms, axis and allies, third reich, etc.

The "community" did and continues to do fine, with or without a local game store.

So do people who demand and expect others to support game shops feel that others exist to provide them with a place to play?

This is the kind of close minded response I would expect from someone who doesn't understand we're all part of a larger communit. You think there weren't game stores/comic shops anywhere while you were growing up??? If you want to shop online, that's fine, but don't pretend like it has no effect on the community/industry. Because you're wrog, but you're free to be as selfish as you like.

I am pretty sure online shopping was not existing when he was growing up. So using an analogy of when he was growing up is pretty mooth. The thing with BM shops is that they do not want to evolve with their world. They still want to have monopol of a niche market to set the price they want to charge.market. We live in a numeric world. You either adapt or die. We call this evolution.

Im am gonna buy ALL the gladiators! Muahaha!

Will you put them under the seat chairs of the audience and have them "Check under their chairs" Oprah style? If so you'll be my best friend

oh, this thread started so well



just shut her down, boys