I just leve this here

Hmm i wonder why it was banned?

Sweet video. You can clearly cheat with six-sided dice, and with two of them. Let's see 3+ dice and eight-sided ones. I have a feeling they are quite a bit harder to control. Though, I think it can be done to statistically improve your odds of rolling the desired values. Personally, if Jigaboo Jones wanted to play X-Wing with me, I'd be happy to let him join me, because that kind of trick dice rolling would be crazy fun to watch in person.

I'd edit that j***boo is a racist term for black people, i know your just repeating the name he says in the video but you never know who's gonna get a stick up their arse over stuff like that.

Sweet video. You can clearly cheat with six-sided dice, and with two of them. Let's see 3+ dice and eight-sided ones. I have a feeling they are quite a bit harder to control. Though, I think it can be done to statistically improve your odds of rolling the desired values. Personally, if Jigaboo Jones wanted to play X-Wing with me, I'd be happy to let him join me, because that kind of trick dice rolling would be crazy fun to watch in person.

I'd edit that j***boo is a racist term for black people, i know your just repeating the name he says in the video but you never know who's gonna get a stick up their arse over stuff like that.

Is it? I'd never heard that before.

Sweet video. You can clearly cheat with six-sided dice, and with two of them. Let's see 3+ dice and eight-sided ones. I have a feeling they are quite a bit harder to control. Though, I think it can be done to statistically improve your odds of rolling the desired values. Personally, if Jigaboo Jones wanted to play X-Wing with me, I'd be happy to let him join me, because that kind of trick dice rolling would be crazy fun to watch in person.

I'd edit that j***boo is a racist term for black people, i know your just repeating the name he says in the video but you never know who's gonna get a stick up their arse over stuff like that.

Is it? I'd never heard that before.

It's an older term.

It's harder, but not impossible, to control a die roll on a d8 than a d6 so let's not pretend that you can't cheat with dice.

Chaos Theory says hi.

Statistics tells it to get lost.

If I can roll my dice in such a way that I can improve their consistency I would have an extreme advantage. For example, on a d6 the 1 face and the 6 face are on opposite ends of the die, so if you roll the die, using your finger as a rail you can mitigate the likelihood of those two results occuring. Doing so increases the chances that your dice behave closer to their expected value and as anyone can tell you: Mediocre and consistent will win more over time than streaks of hot followed by streaks of cold.

I don't remember anyone posting any kind of statistical analysis of a large number of "controlled" die rolls showing a meaningful deviation from the norm?

I've known about the baking technique for fixing dice for years now. It's perhaps not the smartest move to share the link as it leads the more unscrupulous players in the community. Watching the video the man says you can't notice when the dice are baked. This is not true at all. The dice will often bounce in odd directions and if you pick them up they feel off centered.

I've chosen to share this information now as I believe (but have no proof) I witnessed a player using such dice at an event recently. It's not my intention to add to the hysteria of this topic but rather educate. I feel there is room to help prevent such things from creeping into the X-Wing game.

Right now each player is to provide their own set of dice. I truly feel this should (and needs) to change. FFG should make the tournament rules so that both players use the same set of dice. This will cut off the head of this before it becomes and issue.

Sooooo I have a confession to make.. I wash my dice to remove any oils that have built up because I think it gives my dice better movement and randomization than my opponents oily dice is that ok? Also I wear cotton tshirts because I think it keeps me cooler than my opponent and I think it dramatically improves my rolling since I'm not as sweaty. Is this ok too? Just because you think your gaining an advantage by doing something doesn't mean you actually are. The rules do not say that you cannot place the dice in your hand a certain way or that your forced to roll a certain way or that your required to wear only certain types of material to events so I really don't see the problem here. Until ffg makes these mandates then as long as the dice are leaving their hand and bumping and rolling about don't worry about it.

*you're

Sooooo I have a confession to make.. I wash my dice to remove any oils that have built up because I think it gives my dice better movement and randomization than my opponents oily dice is that ok? Also I wear cotton tshirts because I think it keeps me cooler than my opponent and I think it dramatically improves my rolling since I'm not as sweaty. Is this ok too? Just because you think your gaining an advantage by doing something doesn't mean you actually are. The rules do not say that you cannot place the dice in your hand a certain way or that your forced to roll a certain way or that your required to wear only certain types of material to events so I really don't see the problem here. Until ffg makes these mandates then as long as the dice are leaving their hand and bumping and rolling about don't worry about it.

*you're

Nice catch...anyways the video shows a 6 sided dice not an 8 sided. Also the only dice that would really benefit from "enhanced dice rolling" (if that's what we want to call it) would be green since there are a lot less ways to modify them. Also knowing how to roll green dice would be completely different from the red dice since the sides are different so you would be noticing a big change in how they roll each dice. Even with all of that, the dice landing on the table changes everything. 6 sided dice have a lot more surface area to land on to stabilize whereas 8 sided have significantly less surface area on each side and are triangular vs square. This gives them a lot more variability when landing on a table since as the dice rolls more towards a tip of the triangle the weight of the dice has a greater chance of flipping it vs a square dice with a long straight edge where the force is distributed more evenly along the entire side. You can see the difference by setting a 6 sided flat on a surface and an 8 sided. Press the edge of the 6 sided so as to flip it and see how much force is required. Now do the same with the 8 sided and you should notice a significantly less amount of force is required to flip the 8 sided. This means that you would need to be able to control not only the speed of the spin but also the speed at which the dice are thrown. Also would have to factor in the type of material they are being rolled against or on (hard surface vs soft spongy surface) since each will either slow or speed up the rotation of the dice. I agree 6 sided can be manipulated, 8 sided dice not so much as well as greens are different then reds.

Sooooo I have a confession to make.. I wash my dice to remove any oils that have built up because I think it gives my dice better movement and randomization than my opponents oily dice is that ok? Also I wear cotton tshirts because I think it keeps me cooler than my opponent and I think it dramatically improves my rolling since I'm not as sweaty. Is this ok too? Just because you think your gaining an advantage by doing something doesn't mean you actually are. The rules do not say that you cannot place the dice in your hand a certain way or that your forced to roll a certain way or that your required to wear only certain types of material to events so I really don't see the problem here. Until ffg makes these mandates then as long as the dice are leaving their hand and bumping and rolling about don't worry about it.

*you're

Nice catch...anyways the video shows a 6 sided dice not an 8 sided. Also the only dice that would really benefit from "enhanced dice rolling" (if that's what we want to call it) would be green since there are a lot less ways to modify them. Also knowing how to roll green dice would be completely different from the red dice since the sides are different so you would be noticing a big change in how they roll each dice. Even with all of that, the dice landing on the table changes everything. 6 sided dice have a lot more surface area to land on to stabilize whereas 8 sided have significantly less surface area on each side and are triangular vs square. This gives them a lot more variability when landing on a table since as the dice rolls more towards a tip of the triangle the weight of the dice has a greater chance of flipping it vs a square dice with a long straight edge where the force is distributed more evenly along the entire side. You can see the difference by setting a 6 sided flat on a surface and an 8 sided. Press the edge of the 6 sided so as to flip it and see how much force is required. Now do the same with the 8 sided and you should notice a significantly less amount of force is required to flip the 8 sided. This means that you would need to be able to control not only the speed of the spin but also the speed at which the dice are thrown. Also would have to factor in the type of material they are being rolled against or on (hard surface vs soft spongy surface) since each will either slow or speed up the rotation of the dice. I agree 6 sided can be manipulated, 8 sided dice not so much as well as greens are different then reds.

I'm with you. The idea that somebody could significantly influence the result o their dice rolls, provided they are in fact dropping them, not slamming them down, seems very far fetched to me. If I saw somebody doing something odd with the dice in their hands I'd be amused at their superstitions, rather than annoys by them cheating. And I'm quite easily annoyed.

VanorDM (very much intentionally) keeps conflating "belief" with "intent."

What someone believes doesn't matter: lucky coin, socks worn since the Redsox won the series, dice placed to the side with all good faces up.

What someone intends matters, when it has to do with the tools of the game, and when there is any doubt at all as to the efficacy of the actions taken with that intent.

Slamming the dice down after placing them just so in the hand is cheating. Rolling the dice laterally from 18" such that they bounce and truly roll, even after placing them just so in the hand is not cheating.

But somewhere between those extremes there is the possibility of influencing the dice roll, and taking actions to do so, with intent, is cheating. It is just plain stupid -- there is no other word for it -- to say that the non-rolling player bears the burden of proof at precisely locating the degree of height and oomph required for a roll to hit the cheating/not-cheating line. It's impossible, and therefore to expect it is stupid.

Since the burden cannot fall to the player who is not intending and attempting to influence the dice, the burden fall on the other player ... the one who is intending and attempting to influence the dice. That burden is exactly this: "stop cheating."

And, again, VanorDM is going to come back with examples of "belief" and "superstition" to purposefully muddy the requirement of intent to influence the dice combined with the inability to know at what point it might work. But that's okay with him, because he really, really wants to win this argument: just be aware of what he's doing.

Except if I bring my lucky socks with the intent that they will make me roll better?

I've known about the baking technique for fixing dice for years now. It's perhaps not the smartest move to share the link as it leads the more unscrupulous players in the community. Watching the video the man says you can't notice when the dice are baked. This is not true at all. The dice will often bounce in odd directions and if you pick them up they feel off centered.

I've chosen to share this information now as I believe (but have no proof) I witnessed a player using such dice at an event recently. It's not my intention to add to the hysteria of this topic but rather educate. I feel there is room to help prevent such things from creeping into the X-Wing game.

Right now each player is to provide their own set of dice. I truly feel this should (and needs) to change. FFG should make the tournament rules so that both players use the same set of dice. This will cut off the head of this before it becomes and issue.

i must have huge hands, I can shake 5 dice in one hand,

the dice gods are fickle beings. if you attempt to cheat them, they will find away to show their wrath.

I have even know them to bend your visual perception and as a result you hit a lot of asteroids.

do not try to cheat the dice gods of their glory, and remember, on the first full moon of the year, you must roll 1D20 and smash that many dice as an offering for their favor in the coming year.

I also do this before tournaments to appease them.

is that cheating???????

i must have huge hands, I can shake 5 dice in one hand,

the dice gods are fickle beings. if you attempt to cheat them, they will find away to show their wrath.

I have even know them to bend your visual perception and as a result you hit a lot of asteroids.

do not try to cheat the dice gods of their glory, and remember, on the first full moon of the year, you must roll 1D20 and smash that many dice as an offering for their favor in the coming year.

I also do this before tournaments to appease them.

is that cheating???????

Ney brother it is mealy giving the gods their due.

VanorDM (very much intentionally) keeps conflating "belief" with "intent."

What someone believes doesn't matter: lucky coin, socks worn since the Redsox won the series, dice placed to the side with all good faces up.

What someone intends matters, when it has to do with the tools of the game, and when there is any doubt at all as to the efficacy of the actions taken with that intent.

Slamming the dice down after placing them just so in the hand is cheating. Rolling the dice laterally from 18" such that they bounce and truly roll, even after placing them just so in the hand is not cheating.

But somewhere between those extremes there is the possibility of influencing the dice roll, and taking actions to do so, with intent, is cheating. It is just plain stupid -- there is no other word for it -- to say that the non-rolling player bears the burden of proof at precisely locating the degree of height and oomph required for a roll to hit the cheating/not-cheating line. It's impossible, and therefore to expect it is stupid.

Since the burden cannot fall to the player who is not intending and attempting to influence the dice, the burden fall on the other player ... the one who is intending and attempting to influence the dice. That burden is exactly this: "stop cheating."

And, again, VanorDM is going to come back with examples of "belief" and "superstition" to purposefully muddy the requirement of intent to influence the dice combined with the inability to know at what point it might work. But that's okay with him, because he really, really wants to win this argument: just be aware of what he's doing.

Except if I bring my lucky socks with the intent that they will make me roll better?

Oh no! Not the lucky socks! Our dice can't repel luckiness of that magnitude!!!!

Oh no! Not the lucky socks! Our dice can't repel luckiness of that magnitude!!!!

Depending on how long you've been wearing them and if you can take off your shoes, they may be more than lucky... They may qualify as chemical/biological warfare.

Oh no! Not the lucky socks! Our dice can't repel luckiness of that magnitude!!!!

Depending on how long you've been wearing them and if you can take off your shoes, they may be more than lucky... They may qualify as chemical/biological warfare.

Well that's definitely OP! That's infringing on c3po status right there! How am I ever supposed to win?!

It's harder, but not impossible, to control a die roll on a d8 than a d6 so let's not pretend that you can't cheat with dice.

Chaos Theory says hi.

Statistics tells it to get lost.

If I can roll my dice in such a way that I can improve their consistency I would have an extreme advantage. For example, on a d6 the 1 face and the 6 face are on opposite ends of the die, so if you roll the die, using your finger as a rail you can mitigate the likelihood of those two results occuring. Doing so increases the chances that your dice behave closer to their expected value and as anyone can tell you: Mediocre and consistent will win more over time than streaks of hot followed by streaks of cold.

Again, Chaos Theory says it's impossible to throw them in such a way, therefore your Statistics can take a hike.

You can pretend all you want that your "mad throwing skilz" can net you an advantage, but clearly you're ignorant about basic quantum and molecular physics if you think that it actually works in the real world.

Here's a challenge: post a video of you throwing the dice twenty times the normal way and twenty times the "speshul" way and compare the two. I guarantee it will be a negligible difference, if any.

Wow, they even fooled the cat!

Also, I can't believe this topic is still going.

While I do agree that it is theoretically possible to increase the odds of favorable dice results I also believe that this behavior is EXTREMELY rare within the X-wing player base. I have never observed it (regular tournament goer) and I have never heard of it outside of this forum. I think we have to weigh the cost/benefit ratio of regulating dice as a community. Should FFG implement rules that assume everyone is cheating all of the time just to drive out the very few fringe cases? How much will this compromise the fun friendly atmosphere of the tournament scene? I would really pity someone who feels compelled to cheat in order to win at a game that involves pushing cool plastic ships around and making pew pew noises. Especially when there really isn't anything of consequence at stake.

If I did have reason to believe that there was something fishy going on (and it would take a lot of evidence) I would tell the TO and let him/her sort it out. If its a consistent pattern of behavior the offending player will probably be banned from events at that location.

Well you can't assume everyone is innocent either as we know from hundreds of years of playing games there's always a small minority that will cheat if they think they can get away with it.

Some people are cheating scumbags and you have to watch out for them.

If your opponent looks to be doing something shady and you get a bad vibe off of him, I see no reason why you can't quietly ask the TO to just keep one eye open. It doesn't have to be a loud "I ACCUSE THIS FELLOW OF CHEATING", just let the TO know something doesn't feel right, and let him use his judgement based on his observations.

I have 9 dice thanks to me wanting enough for two players to have 4 dice each. So in a tournament I have a large pile of dice which I usually burn through quickly, this is because when I roll, I usually pull them next to my cards and don't return them to on top of the dice bag, so the next time I use the dice, I get some 'fresh' dice. I roll them...and then notice I already had retrieved dice.

I once had someone call me out on modified dice, however it was a simple case of luck that day and he apologise after the TO had cleared my dice AND I had spent the remainder of the game using his (and getting lucky rolls with them). I have never ever seen evade dice be so kind to me, definitely going to fly my A-Wings again!

It's harder, but not impossible, to control a die roll on a d8 than a d6 so let's not pretend that you can't cheat with dice.

Chaos Theory says hi.

Statistics tells it to get lost.

If I can roll my dice in such a way that I can improve their consistency I would have an extreme advantage. For example, on a d6 the 1 face and the 6 face are on opposite ends of the die, so if you roll the die, using your finger as a rail you can mitigate the likelihood of those two results occuring. Doing so increases the chances that your dice behave closer to their expected value and as anyone can tell you: Mediocre and consistent will win more over time than streaks of hot followed by streaks of cold.

Again, Chaos Theory says it's impossible to throw them in such a way, therefore your Statistics can take a hike.

You can pretend all you want that your "mad throwing skilz" can net you an advantage, but clearly you're ignorant about basic quantum and molecular physics if you think that it actually works in the real world.

Here's a challenge: post a video of you throwing the dice twenty times the normal way and twenty times the "speshul" way and compare the two. I guarantee it will be a negligible difference, if any.

Sooooo I have a confession to make.. I wash my dice to remove any oils that have built up because I think it gives my dice better movement and randomization than my opponents oily dice is that ok? Also I wear cotton tshirts because I think it keeps me cooler than my opponent and I think it dramatically improves my rolling since I'm not as sweaty. Is this ok too? Just because you think your gaining an advantage by doing something doesn't mean you actually are. The rules do not say that you cannot place the dice in your hand a certain way or that your forced to roll a certain way or that your required to wear only certain types of material to events so I really don't see the problem here. Until ffg makes these mandates then as long as the dice are leaving their hand and bumping and rolling about don't worry about it.

*you're

Nice catch...anyways the video shows a 6 sided dice not an 8 sided. Also the only dice that would really benefit from "enhanced dice rolling" (if that's what we want to call it) would be green since there are a lot less ways to modify them. Also knowing how to roll green dice would be completely different from the red dice since the sides are different so you would be noticing a big change in how they roll each dice. Even with all of that, the dice landing on the table changes everything. 6 sided dice have a lot more surface area to land on to stabilize whereas 8 sided have significantly less surface area on each side and are triangular vs square. This gives them a lot more variability when landing on a table since as the dice rolls more towards a tip of the triangle the weight of the dice has a greater chance of flipping it vs a square dice with a long straight edge where the force is distributed more evenly along the entire side. You can see the difference by setting a 6 sided flat on a surface and an 8 sided. Press the edge of the 6 sided so as to flip it and see how much force is required. Now do the same with the 8 sided and you should notice a significantly less amount of force is required to flip the 8 sided. This means that you would need to be able to control not only the speed of the spin but also the speed at which the dice are thrown. Also would have to factor in the type of material they are being rolled against or on (hard surface vs soft spongy surface) since each will either slow or speed up the rotation of the dice. I agree 6 sided can be manipulated, 8 sided dice not so much as well as greens are different then reds.

Sweet video. You can clearly cheat with six-sided dice, and with two of them. Let's see 3+ dice and eight-sided ones. I have a feeling they are quite a bit harder to control. Though, I think it can be done to statistically improve your odds of rolling the desired values. Personally, if Jigaboo Jones wanted to play X-Wing with me, I'd be happy to let him join me, because that kind of trick dice rolling would be crazy fun to watch in person.

I'd edit that j***boo is a racist term for black people, i know your just repeating the name he says in the video but you never know who's gonna get a stick up their arse over stuff like that.

It's a problem with PC backlash: The one using slurs gets to flip the situation. It is not that they have dropped a slur that is the issue, but the fault of the other party for being offended by it. Racism is wrong, and being offended by racism doesn't mean you have a "stick up your arse."