I can't find the relevant info in the RRG ...

Pg 6 RRG "Special Situation regarding attacks"

"The keyword abilities Blast and Cleave, and any keyword that causes a condition, all require the target of the attack to suffer one or more damage to trigger."

Stun causes a condition, so yes - you do need one damage to stun.

I think I've found the rule but it doesn't make sense to me ...

Page 5 of the RRG:

Step 5 - spend surges

Step 6 - check accuracy

Step 7 - calculate damage

I think this means that a stun effect from a surge takes effect during step 5 meaning that the target is stunned even if the shot doesn't have sufficient accuracy to hit the target. If this is true, doesn't that mean that you can fire on anyone you have LOS to and as long as you get an uncancelled surge you can stun them?

Ah - thanks for that. Thought that my second post must be wrong.

I think I've found the rule but it doesn't make sense to me ...

Page 5 of the RRG:

Step 5 - spend surges

Step 6 - check accuracy

Step 7 - calculate damage

I think this means that a stun effect from a surge takes effect during step 5 meaning that the target is stunned even if the shot doesn't have sufficient accuracy to hit the target. If this is true, doesn't that mean that you can fire on anyone you have LOS to and as long as you get an uncancelled surge you can stun them?

Pg 9 "Conditions" RRG

"The condition is applied after the attack resolves."

So it actually happens after step 7.

Agreed.

Most keywords and conditions attached to an attack must do damage to be applied after the attack resolves, or after Step 7.
(For example, Bleed, Blast, Cleave, Focus, Recover , Stun).

Whoops, my bad. Recover doesn't rely on the attack doing damage.

1.) So in effect, if you do 2 damage and have one surge spent to stun on an attack, a role of 2 defend cancels the stun as well, even without rolling any evade(s)?

2.) If an attack causes stun by definition (don't have the game in front of me, but I think there are specials or command cards which state "add one damage and stun") does it require net damage, or are we talking about only spending surges to trigger stun?

In order to apply any condition the attack must first result in at least one damage. If the total defense after applying all surges and modifiers is still equal to or greater than the attack, resulting in zero damage, then the condition does not apply.

To speak to tomkat364's examples.

1. If you roll 2 damage to 2 block, there is no reason to spend a surge on stun. It is wasted. Spend a surge on pierce or damage instead if you can. If you have two surges, you could spend one on damage or pierce, and then the second surge could be used to stun

2. Some attacks apply conditions automatically, even without a surge. For example the Elite Nexus has "Bleed" written on its deployment card without a surge cost. As long as the Nexu does at least one damage after the attack resolves, it's target will receive the "Bleed" condition.

Yes, the key here is "causing damage". If you look carefully at the attack structure, since you will always know what the defense dice are prior to spending surges, you will know at that point whether or not spending a surge to apply a keyword effect is worth spending a surge on.

Additionally, if an attack causes a keyword "natively", if the effect is damage-dependent, then you still need to cause damage in order to apply the effect.

One noteable card is the one-use only "Stun Grenade": Based on the wording of the card, since this does not count as an attack, even if you roll no damage on the yellow die, the targets are still stunned.

Recover doesn't rely on the attack doing damage.

was asking where this is specifically stated, then I found the thread where Fizz says exactly this.

Somebody was telling me the opposite of this ruling was listed in a recent FAQ, but they were clearly mistaken.

The rulebooks explicitly state for the harmful conditions, that damage is need to apply them when performing an attack. E.g. command cards can apply stun without damage.

For Recover the rules do not say so. It's hard to give a reference for something, that is NOT written.

The rulebooks explicitly state for the harmful conditions, that damage is need to apply them when performing an attack. E.g. command cards can apply stun without damage.

For Recover the rules do not say so. It's hard to give a reference for something, that is NOT written.

Is Focus dependent on doing damage?

Check RRG "Conditions". Yes.

"harmful" was wrong.

The rulebooks explicitly state for conditions, that damage is need to apply them when performing an attack.