Tarnation:

Tarn Mison - R7 and Hull Upgrade

Bandit x6

While I would normally agree, I think now it's time to switch to Jake Ferrall to do the dance to keep Fel (and Phantoms) in arc. VI and PtL/Outmanuver, no Autothrusters so you can get the init bid and make Fel/Phantoms move first.

I think now it's time to switch to Jake... no Autothrusters ...

No Autothrusters = Dead the moment the Admiral so much as looks at him. Bad idea.

I think now it's time to switch to Jake... no Autothrusters ...

No Autothrusters = Dead the moment the Admiral so much as looks at him. Bad idea.

You have 6 Bandits backing him. Not much an issue. Decimators fold like paper at Swarms. Jake deals with Fel/Phantoms and Bandits deal with the Decimator, unless Fel/Phantoms are in a spot that the Bandits can get to him. Granted, I have tested the build against Decimator/Fel yet. But that's the general strategy.

Tarnation:

Tarn Mison - R7 and Hull Upgrade

Bandit x6

That list is going to have a hard time beating Fel and chiraneu. Chiraneu shoots first and will at the very least strip you of your shields on the 1st pass then Fel either finishes you off or puts you in a position where chiraneu will for sure. Then you just boost away from the bandits. If the bandits focus after Fel chiraneu sits back and chips at em. If they go after chiraneu then Fel get behind em and lays the pain. If they split up then they are definitely in trouble.

What is RAC and what is Chirpy?

I think now it's time to switch to Jake... no Autothrusters ...

No Autothrusters = Dead the moment the Admiral so much as looks at him. Bad idea.

You have 6 Bandits backing him. Not much an issue. Decimators fold like paper at Swarms. Jake deals with Fel/Phantoms and Bandits deal with the Decimator, unless Fel/Phantoms are in a spot that the Bandits can get to him. Granted, I have tested the build against Decimator/Fel yet. But that's the general strategy.

Yeah, it kind of is an issue. Jake is your most expensive, most capable ship, and the guy you expect to go 1v1 with Fel (which Fel will win most of the time, anyway, so I'm not quite sure why you're actually planning to get him into that). Once Jake goes down you've got nothing; you'll lose 2-3 Bandits taking down Chirpy and then Soontir will pick off the stragglers at his leisure.

what is chirpy?

I haven't heard this reference yet

It's a nonsensical nickname for Chiraneau that somehow caught on.

What is RAC and what is Chirpy?

They're the same thing -- Chiraneau.

What's the Chirpy/Fel build cost? Fel should be moving before Jake. Jake should at least be a distraction to Fel.

I will now free-associate ten nicknames for Chiraneau that I believe are superior to "Chirpy"

1. Neau-Neau

2. Chiromancer (pref. a VI and EU build)

3. Chir Leader

4. The Chiropractor

5. Rearaneau

6. Chee-T-49

7. Critaneau

8. RACketeer

9. Dr. Neau

10. Stupid Criticalling Moron I HATE YOU

What is RAC and what is Chirpy?

They're the same thing -- Chiraneau.

technically, RAC is Rear Admiral Chiraneau and Chirpy is a sparrow

I don't get the nickman either. Chiri I understand (mon cheri...) but chirpy? that's one fat ******* bird

Fel hates Gunner/Vader turret. It's about as hard a counter as you can have.

Agreed...chirpy? Really? Hes a rear admiral for Emperors sake! He's not a bird or cricket making cute little chirping sounds he's an admiral so maybe try and start treating him with some dignity eh. Chirpy=facepalm. We can come up with a better name than that xwingers.

Numb+Mangler did the trick against Fel in a game I played last weekend.

What's the Chirpy/Fel build cost? Fel should be moving before Jake. Jake should at least be a distraction to Fel.

It costs between 96 and 97 points. No good fel or whisper player is going to take a chance at losing the initiative bid. 98 is risky and 99-100 is suicide...

we taking Jake Farrel as a Soontir counter?

I personally do not recommend it. 2 dice offense is going to **** the bed before its been made and a combination of prockets + initiative bids is a literally dicey prospect.

I like Jake and I think he does a lot of work as a mini-soontir (ptl, outmanuever, refit, done) but he's not really a high agility counter (no A-wing really is)

Soontir (unlike pre-errata phantom) has two big counters:

1.) "**** your agility"

Darth "The man" Vader (crew)

Prox Mines

Guaranteed Damage of any sort

2.) "**** your actions:

Stress (yeah yeah, his ability. It doesn't matter. He's turning into a tie fighter next turn)

Obstructions

Blocking

You can technically beat him with any list as long as you have enough or big enough ships. He's a late game monster, but definitely not moreso than a fat turret that you can no longer hope to out-roll.

I read advice here on going after the Decimator first, instead of Soontir.

Do you all not really fear Soontir in the endgame?

If Soontir doesn't have a Targeting Computer, his damage output is that of your average ship. Chiraneu or however you spell his dumb name with Predator essentially has a focus and a TL every time he shoots. Oh yeah, also turret. The RAC can also be burned down kind of quickly by a swarm if you manage to not get boost shenaniganed.

Soontir is invincible but he's not Phantom or Rear Admiral level 15 actions a turn obnoxious broken crap. You bump him and he dies, he relies on PtL so if you stack more stress on him he dies. Shut down his action economy and you've got him. Get him in arc and eventually he'll be dead, since he can't candy cane his options in a close in dogfight are limited.

What's the Chirpy/Fel build cost? Fel should be moving before Jake. Jake should at least be a distraction to Fel.

It costs between 96 and 97 points. No good fel or whisper player is going to take a chance at losing the initiative bid. 98 is risky and 99-100 is suicide...

I always have a hard time taking that much of a bid. That is literally a whole upgrade worth of points, and the upgrade can determine how well the list performs, whether it is a stress mechanic, vader crew, or Predator vs VI for the rerolls. The init bid also ONLY helps when you are mirror matched. Some tournaments it can be completely wasted points. I've played 8 round tournaments with no PS 9 mirror match when I played Whisper, and having the extra upgrade made more difference than anything.

I also think the init bid only affects HOW you play, with the exception being Whisper/Fel vs Han Solo, since Han cares minimally if he is blocked, and can be used to block Fel. Heck, even for Han the Init choice is a tossup. Using your Soontir Fel to block an enemy Soontir Fel is just as useful as having your Soontir Fel arc dodge the opponent's Soontir Fel, as long as your support is alive to fire, that is . Init choice just has different uses during different points of the game.

Even in matches like PS1 Tie Swarm vs PS1 Tie Swarm, where one might thinking having init is a great option for blocking up an entire swarm, the tie swarm without init can counter play by placing ships to prevent K turns the next round, etc etc.

Or PS6 Dual Aggressor mirror matches, I don't think the choice for init is cut and dry, and depends a lot on how you PLAN to win, rather than one choice being better than the other.

What's the Chirpy/Fel build cost? Fel should be moving before Jake. Jake should at least be a distraction to Fel.

It costs between 96 and 97 points. No good fel or whisper player is going to take a chance at losing the initiative bid. 98 is risky and 99-100 is suicide...

Do you have any specific situations in mind, also outside of a mirror match?

Because personally speaking, I've never had any issues with my 99 point RAC/Fel list.

If init is taken, I rejoice and arc-dodge. If it is given to me, I usually slow-play on the approach or try to block.

Bombers with Jonas and clusters will tear down any decimator in a single turn.

Then go on bombing runs against the interceptor.

What's the Chirpy/Fel build cost? Fel should be moving before Jake. Jake should at least be a distraction to Fel.

It costs between 96 and 97 points. No good fel or whisper player is going to take a chance at losing the initiative bid. 98 is risky and 99-100 is suicide...

Do you have any specific situations in mind, also outside of a mirror match?

Because personally speaking, I've never had any issues with my 99 point RAC/Fel list.

If init is taken, I rejoice and arc-dodge. If it is given to me, I usually slow-play on the approach or try to block.

97 points is all you need on Chiraneu and Fel.