Hello All,

Late to the party here, just received my copy of Armada today, even took a day of work to celebrate the unboxing!

Being an X-Wing player, and FFG game player in general, I'm usually quite impressed with their components and miniatures. However, when opening the Armada box, I can understand the debate regarding its 'value' BUT I won't flog that dead horse again.

What I am most unimpressed about though, is the manoeuver tool, specifically:

• It appears to be made of flimsy softer plastic. After touching the ship bases and then picking up the tool, it's quite disappointing.
• The grooves are quite shallow. I understand that if too deep, users may have difficulty clicking the dial, but at some specific angles, they almost don't hold.
• Related to the first point, the manoeuver tool is going to see lots of use in games. The combination of continual friction and soft plastic is not going to bode well for its usefulness and longevity.

Now I know that you can buy more tools in the future, but I don't see them being constantly perishable assets, more like essentials for gameplay. I'd prefer to buy more tools because it will be convenient to have more, as opposed to feeling like I must consistently replace the existing ones.

Thoughts? Opinions?

Cheers

My tool has absolutely zero issue holding position at any click. Yours may actually be a miscast.

My tool has absolutely zero issue holding position at any click. Yours may actually be a miscast.

Same for mine. It hold firmly its position.

Mine has seen ALOT of play, and it is losing its grip some. Not drastically so, but it is happening. As someone who has played click base games extensively, it DOES happen.

That said, it remains to be seen how big of a problem this will be. There are still notched indicators on the top side of the measurement tool.

Probably why they are selling backups outside of the core set, it's all about the green.

I was planning to buy a second movement tool myself to make a speed 2 movement tool for tighter board situations. I figured that will also get me 2 spare tool pieces to replace the first two pieces to wear out.

I'm going to buy enough manauver tools to make a speed 1, speed 2, speed 3 and speed 4 tools.

The extra pieces will be used as spares.

My tool has absolutely zero issue holding position at any click. Yours may actually be a miscast.

Same for mine. It hold firmly its position.

You've been playing the game for only a month maybe two at most.

Give it a year (depending on how much you play ofcource) and I bet you guys will change your opinion.

The soft plastic for the maneuver tool is like the cardboard for the x-wing maneuver templates, they just won't hold up to extensive play.

I picked up a set of acrylic's from cog'o'two and also a custom set from litko for x-wing, totally worth the coin and will never wear out.

As for the armada tool, well that's going to be a tricky one for 3rd party company's to replicate.....

Only time will tell

This is going to be a huge issue in my opinion. I do not feel comfortable using this tool right now and fear that it will break soon enough.

I have been playing the game a lot since it was released. My maneuver tool is already loosing its ability to hold its positioning, especially on Speed 1 and Speed 2, which see the most use.

I pre ordered the new tool, but if it is as sorry as the tool in the core set, then I don't know.

I love the whole maneuver tool movement style of the game, but I see a tool that is flimsy, hence my opinion of it being "Sorry".

Right now, it is fresh and new and works wonderfully... But I would echo Stego's concern for the longevity of the tool... I purchased X-wing templates from Team Covenant ( <3 ) as soon as the cardboard started to feel like it was on its way out. Obviously the difference being that I wouldn't know where to get replacement templates for X-wing beyond 3rd party versus an $8 Armada tool possibly being readily available from the local game shop.

If a third party was able to create a durable movement tool, I think I would purchase it before I have any concern about wear and keep the FFG one in almost-new shape for any potential tournament play.

The tip of my tool can be moved +-2 cm (and stays in that position without any force applied) when it should be completely straight at a tool length of ~31cm. That is slightly more(!) then a single click in the 4th segment would allow me to do. So a single click in the 4th segment is already below the "noise floor" of the tool. That means that the tool doesn`t provide the resolution of clicks used by the game system which is a good reason to call it not suitable for the task.

As an engineer it seems clear to me that a mechanical object for this purpose should definitively not be made out of this material, especially at the parts where friction applies. I guess this didn`t get much attention in the development process of a company who is used to produce tokens and miniatures of cardboard and plastic which eigther do not see mechanical strain or at least theire function doesnt depend on theire exact shape.

Personally i am waiting for a 3rd party to produce the same thing in full or partly in metal similar to the way a folding rule is done. If this doesnt happen i guess i will build my own once this annoys me enought and i find the time. id post the CAD data if i do.

My tool has absolutely zero issue holding position at any click. Yours may actually be a miscast.

Same for mine. It hold firmly its position.

You've been playing the game for only a month maybe two at most.

Give it a year (depending on how much you play ofcource) and I bet you guys will change your opinion.

The soft plastic for the maneuver tool is like the cardboard for the x-wing maneuver templates, they just won't hold up to extensive play.

I picked up a set of acrylic's from cog'o'two and also a custom set from litko for x-wing, totally worth the coin and will never wear out.

As for the armada tool, well that's going to be a tricky one for 3rd party company's to replicate.....

Only time will tell

The OP stated that his tool was already not holding position. Not that he feels it will wear out, but that it was out of the box. Hence why I let him know that I do not have the same issue out of the box and he may infact be starting with a defective tool. I said nothing in regards to future wear.

Good thing FFG's customer service is AWESOME. While I was putting my maneuver tool together I screwed up one of the joints, resulting a very loose joint. I contacted FFG's customer service and told them the problem. 2 days later there was a replacement part in my mailbox, at no cost to me. Booyah!

Customer service at FFG is great, but the tool losing its ability to hold positioning after a (short) while would probably be classified as normal use.

I fear that I would probably have to buy several tools as backups, as the often inconsistent availability of FFG products means I may risk long stretches of not being able to play if my only tool breaks.

Customer service at FFG is great, but the tool losing its ability to hold positioning after a (short) while would probably be classified as normal use.

I fear that I would probably have to buy several tools as backups, as the often inconsistent availability of FFG products means I may risk long stretches of not being able to play if my only tool breaks.

Seriously, FFG's customer service isn't good. It really is fan-freaking-tastic! So let's save our complaints for after we have problems getting defective/worn pieces replaced, shall we?

After 4 games my maneuver tool has lost the ability to click on the second joint. The most used joint in my games so far.

When it was initially assembled, all the joints had a solid lock in. So I don't think it's a miscast. Plastic teeth are going to wear with use. Hoepfully a third party will make am ore durable version. Maybe one that uses a thin flexible piece of metal to lock into the teeth.

Are there 3rd party manuver tools?

No third party maneuver tools that I know of yet...

Probably still a touch early before they make an appearance.

No third party maneuver tools that I know of yet...

Probably still a touch early before they make an appearance.

Yeah, I'm sure we'll see them sooner or later, but it is a bit more complicated than the simple acrylic shapes 3rd parties make for X-Wing.

As the joint im currently thinking about a nut and bolt without thread which can freely rotate. Each fixed to the one and other part of the tool.

then for the clicks one could use a 16 teeth gear fixed to the bolt on the one side and a single tooth of the same type of gear guided by a linearbearing which presses the single tooth onto the gear by a spring (same mechanism like the spring pressing the tip of a biro). So the tip of a biro would press into the room between 2 teeth of the gear. when you turn the part with the gear the single tooth would receed (into the biro) and "click" out again between the next teeth.

basically the inverse of what they did in plastic but done with basic parts which you could accuire more easily. still i think it might be hard to get it realy stable. one could also use a spring shaped like a C which presses against the gear from two opposing sides while beeing fixed to the side where the gear is not fixed. the rest could be laser cut from acryl or thin metal based on a scan of the original tools dimensions.

Theese little buggers have 16 theeth so they do the same "click" degree as the original (22.5°).

First prototype :

The whole thing will need some glue. Still a bit to wiggly :/. But i think thats not due to the 16 teeth joins. Those hold a lot better then the original probably due to the 16 instead of 1 tooth interconnecting. The axels dont exactly fit in length so you have to cut it a bit and probably glue it to size. Maybe replace by metal axles. Also the teeth to connect the ships would need to be done. You can not "click" it but have to lift the parts with teeth apart instead which is why a spring between the upper teeth part and the upper stopper (middle picture) would be nice. maybe i have 4 biros of that size. upside is that parts are easily available for an initial frame which could be strengthened by i.e. small metal rods to the 4 sides of each lego axle or by just putting loads more of those "stoppers" over the long axles and quite some glue . Also the axles standing up are probably to long, i dint have shorter ones. notice that the up axles have this stopping lower end so you dont need to pull another stopper over the lower part of the short axles -> things stays flat on the table.

when will wave 1 arrive?

That's awesome

You're like macgyver!

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/MacGyver

And what are these parts??

im not sure about the exact part numbers. you can definitively get them here though.: https://www.bricklink.com/ im quite sure that the 16 teeth part is not in production anymore but you can still definitively get them at bricklink if you know the parts number.

i still would not advice to order this and think of it as an improovement as it is still wiggly. i think the large axles realy have to be replaced with steel rods and glued to those plastic joins which themselves do hold a lot better then the original. still fiddling around with it just for fun