If you're defining "fat" ships as just expensive make sure you tell people the criteria. People looking for a reason to complain will assume fat means Double-droid Han or 60-point Chiraneau.

If you're defining "fat" ships as just expensive make sure you tell people the criteria. People looking for a reason to complain will assume fat means Double-droid Han or 60-point Chiraneau.

Good call, I'm going to track two levels of "Fatness".

1. Super Fat or two ~50 point ships. A mid 50 point YT-1300 I'll count as SuperFat if it has both C-3P0 and MF since it can mitigate so much damage.
2. One medium Fat ship. I.e. 40+ point R2-D2 Corran Horn, or one ~50 point turret.

I don't really like counting non-regenerating small base ships as "fat" unless you have two of them in a list, and the points scored breakpoints are 50/100. Horn is a special case since he can stick around forever.

I still can't see small base ships as fat no matter how expensive

I see them as puffed up little birds, a tiny little frame with a lot of fluff tacked on

Here's 46 point corran:

Heres Fat Han:

Here is how I will be breaking down "SuperFat" vs "Fat" for tracking later. For reference, Top 8 lists are currently 70% "Fat" and 55% "Super Fat".

For future tracking - definition of " Fat " vs " Moderately Obese "

Fat :

• Any 2-ship list
• Any named YT-1300 with at least 2 out of 3 of: Millennium Falcon, C-3P0, and R2-D2 crew*
• Dash + HLC/Mangler + Outrider + Crew (generally 54-58 points with Kyle+EU)

* Note: this means that 50 point Chewbacca + Predator + Recon Specialist + Jan Ors only counts as "Moderately Obese" not "Fat".

Moderately Obese :

• Named YT-1300 with no more than 1 of: Millennium Falcon, C-3P0, or R2-D2 crew
• 40+ point Corran Horn with R2-D2
• 40+ point Whisper
• 40 point Xizor surrounded by bodyguards
• 40+ point Firespray (Scum or Imperial)

The rationale with all of these "Moderately Obese" but not "Fat" lists is that you have a large portion of your points tied up in one ship that is very difficult to kill. I am open to suggestions on changing the labels, I tried to stick with convention so that "Fat" describes what we already had in mind, and "moderately obese" is a newer lesser category.

Seems like it would be preferable to make a distinction between "fat" and "expensive".

Maybe something like:

• "Fat" is a ship that can cancel/regenerate a guaranteed 2+ damage per round
• "Loaded" is a ship that costs 45+ points

Which would mean, for some common builds...

• Han/Chewy with C3P0, R2D2, MF, RecSpec+JanOrs, etc... is both Fat and Loaded
• Han/Chewy with Gunner, Pred, and only 1 damage mitigation option (C3P0 or MF probably) is Loaded, but not Fat
• Dash/Leebo are often Loaded, but not Fat
• Corran can be Fat, and sometimes Loaded
• Brobots are Loaded, not Fat
• Etc...

Edit : Or you, know what MJ just posted above, where his "SuperFat" = my "Fat" and his "Fat" = my "Loaded"

Here's the official scale

Skinny - Academies, Zs

Chubby - 15-30ish point ships

Chunky - small base ships with upgrade slots filled, roughly 30-35ish

Husky - 35-40 range

Fluffy - small ships that cost as much as large ships

Fat -55+ point large ships

****! - fully loaded CR-90

Edit : Or you, know what MJ just posted above, where his "SuperFat" = my "Fat" and his "Fat" = my "Loaded"

.. and I have already since edited it to keep the "Fat" convention the same as before, and label the lower tier "moderately obese". I don't see Corran ever getting the Full Fat Treatment.

The first video from the St. Pete Regional is up, check it out.

https://youtu.be/w1-YOx1vEl0

Those criteria look solid. And I wouldn't call that 50-point Chewie very fat. It's the droids!

Here is how I will be breaking down "SuperFat" vs "Fat" for tracking later. For reference, Top 8 lists are currently 70% "Fat" and 55% "Super Fat".

For future tracking - definition of " Fat " vs " Moderately Obese "

Maybe we should come up with a formula that spits out a single scalar value to measure fatness. Call it a Build Maximization Index, or "BMI" for short.

Here is how I will be breaking down "SuperFat" vs "Fat" for tracking later. For reference, Top 8 lists are currently 70% "Fat" and 55% "Super Fat".

For future tracking - definition of " Fat " vs " Moderately Obese "

Maybe we should come up with a formula that spits out a single scalar value to measure fatness. Call it a Build Maximization Index, or "BMI" for short.

I like this idea!

I will have to think about that one.

Here is how I will be breaking down "SuperFat" vs "Fat" for tracking later. For reference, Top 8 lists are currently 70% "Fat" and 55% "Super Fat".

For future tracking - definition of " Fat " vs " Moderately Obese "

Maybe we should come up with a formula that spits out a single scalar value to measure fatness. Call it a Build Maximization Index, or "BMI" for short.

How about Body Fat Build Upgrade Percentage, or "BUP" for short?

BUP = Points spent on upgrades / total squad points

• Top 8: Corran + PTL + Advanced Sensors + R2D2 + Engine Upgrade; Gold + Ion Cannon Turret + BTL-A4 + R3-A2; Gold + Ion Cannon Turret + BTL-A4 + Bomb loadout + Proximity Mine

Hell yes. Y-Wings are coming back, friends.

Took 3 Ys and a hawk to 10th out of 58 in the St. Pete, Fl Regionals. missed 8th by 17 points, but then the #9 player missed 8th by 2 points.

Here is how I will be breaking down "SuperFat" vs "Fat" for tracking later. For reference, Top 8 lists are currently 70% "Fat" and 55% "Super Fat".

For future tracking - definition of " Fat " vs " Moderately Obese "

Fat :

• Any 2-ship list
• Any named YT-1300 with at least 2 out of 3 of: Millennium Falcon, C-3P0, and R2-D2 crew*
• Dash + HLC/Mangler + Outrider + Crew (generally 54-58 points with Kyle+EU)

* Note: this means that 50 point Chewbacca + Predator + Recon Specialist + Jan Ors only counts as "Moderately Obese" not "Fat".

Moderately Obese :

• Named YT-1300 with no more than 1 of: Millennium Falcon, C-3P0, or R2-D2 crew
• 40+ point Corran Horn with R2-D2
• 40+ point Whisper
• 40 point Xizor surrounded by bodyguards
• 40+ point Firespray (Scum or Imperial)

The rationale with all of these "Moderately Obese" but not "Fat" lists is that you have a large portion of your points tied up in one ship that is very difficult to kill. I am open to suggestions on changing the labels, I tried to stick with convention so that "Fat" describes what we already had in mind, and "moderately obese" is a newer lesser category.

Point of order: I flew a Scum Firespray list that included a Mandalorian Mercenary with Predator and Tactician. That falls into the "Moderately Obese" category despite being offensively oriented and noticeably easier to kill than, say, a 37-point Bounty Hunter + Ysanne Isard. So I think it's relevant to ask: do we care about the sensitivity and specificity of this particular test? If so, how do we minimize false positives and/or false negatives?

Point of order: I flew a Scum Firespray list that included a Mandalorian Mercenary with Predator and Tactician. That falls into the "Moderately Obese" category despite being offensively oriented and noticeably easier to kill than, say, a 37-point Bounty Hunter + Ysanne Isard. So I think it's relevant to ask: do we care about the sensitivity and specificity of this particular test? If so, how do we minimize false positives and/or false negatives?

Well, if you flew the Mercenary with a 60 point Boba Fett or Kath...

Then I'd say the 60 point ship is the Fat one, not the 40 point Mandalorian Mercenary.

Same way a 60pt Han with 3 Talas is Fat. It's obviously not the Talas that are Fat

Clearly we need to have it be a function of the square of the individual upgrade point costs, which penalizes gunner, R2-D2, and Isard.

I think the ''Fat'' definition should just be in liaison with the number of upgrades you gave to the ship:

Han: Han + Gunner

Chubby Han: Han +VI + Title + 3P0

Fat Han: Han + Predator + 3P0 + Gunner + Title + Engine Upgrade

Palob: Palob + turret

Chubby Palob: Palob + turret + crew

Fat Palob: Palob + Opportunist + Blaster turret + K4droid + Crow title

Etc.

What we need is to agree on what "Fat" means.

Is it simply an expensive ship?

Is it a ship with a lot of upgrades?

Is it a ship that is built for damage mitigation?

Is it a combination of both?

Is a VI+ACD+SJ+RC Whisper more fat than a VI+ACD+Gunner+FCS Whisper? Both are 44 points, but one is much more defensive and harder to kill.

Is Han fatter with LW+MF+C3P0+R2D2+EU (60pts), or with Pred+Gunner+MF+Lando+EU (62pts)? The cheaper version is much more defensive.

Edit: Maybe we should define "Fat" in some other thread

Here is how I will be breaking down "SuperFat" vs "Fat" for tracking later. For reference, Top 8 lists are currently 70% "Fat" and 55% "Super Fat". For future tracking - definition of " Fat " vs " Moderately Obese " Fat :

• Any 2-ship list
• Any named YT-1300 with at least 2 out of 3 of: Millennium Falcon, C-3P0, and R2-D2 crew*
• Dash + HLC/Mangler + Outrider + Crew (generally 54-58 points with Kyle+EU)

* Note: this means that 50 point Chewbacca + Predator + Recon Specialist + Jan Ors only counts as "Moderately Obese" not "Fat". Moderately Obese :

• Named YT-1300 with no more than 1 of: Millennium Falcon, C-3P0, or R2-D2 crew
• 40+ point Corran Horn with R2-D2
• 40+ point Whisper
• 40 point Xizor surrounded by bodyguards
• 40+ point Firespray (Scum or Imperial)

The rationale with all of these "Moderately Obese" but not "Fat" lists is that you have a large portion of your points tied up in one ship that is very difficult to kill. I am open to suggestions on changing the labels, I tried to stick with convention so that "Fat" describes what we already had in mind, and "moderately obese" is a newer lesser category.

Point of order: I flew a Scum Firespray list that included a Mandalorian Mercenary with Predator and Tactician. That falls into the "Moderately Obese" category despite being offensively oriented and noticeably easier to kill than, say, a 37-point Bounty Hunter + Ysanne Isard. So I think it's relevant to ask: do we care about the sensitivity and specificity of this particular test? If so, how do we minimize false positives and/or false negatives?

I think this is getting too far down into the weeds, where there are many factors involved to create a simple assessment of "fat", and it isn't truly that critical because the information sought is to answer the question "is it grossly advantageous to fly a ship that ties up a lot of points, especially if that ship has the ability to run?" It doesn't matter a lot if the ship is defensively or offensively built, so long as it is able to run.

In your example, your Merc might be just as survivable through alternate means. Presumably Predator allows you to remove threats more quickly and saving you damage in the long term. It also allows actions to be used defensively with more freedom. Tactician can deny actions, saving you damage. With all the factors involved, including what squad you are facing, who can say which ship is truly fatter?

To me at least, only the points matter. I don't think we should confuse "fat" in this context with inherently defensive. But that makes the baseline assumption that everyone fields useful upgrades that helps them reach the end goal, and not junk just to pad points.

Remember when this was a Regionals results thread? I miss those days...

This discussion is about regional results. I don't think it's possible to define moderately obese in a way that everyone can agree. I think Fat is pretty easy though.

About the St. Pete Regional:Carlos Rodriguez (spelling?) won with:Han SoloPredatorEngine Upgrade3POGunnerFalcon Title3 Bandit Squadron PilotsTravis Cooper came in second with:Dash RendarPush The LimitEngine UpgradeKyle KatarnOutriderHeady Laser CannonCorran HornVeteran InstinctsR2 D2Fire control systemWe are currently editing the footage and doing commentary. Should be up on the Less Than Geek YouTube channel by Wednesday at the latest. (Likely tomorrow)

Carlos Ramirez*

St. Petersburg, FL, US

May 9, 2015

Critical Hit Games

Attendance: 58

Videos:

Winner's battle report: https://community.fantasyflightgames.com/index.php?/topic/176335-never-tell-me-the-odds-how-i-went-from-last-to-first-at-the-st-pete-fl-regionals/

List Juggler: N/A

• Winner: Han + Predator + Gunner + C-3P0 + MF + EU; 3x Bandits
• 2nd place: Dash Rendar + HLC + Outrider + PtL + Kyle + EU; Corran Horn + R2-D2 + FCS + VI( ? )
• Top 4: 4x Blue + Accuracy Corrector
• Top 4: Corran Horn; Jake Farrel; Bandits ( unknown? )
• Top 8: Gold Squadron + BTL-A4 + Ion Cannon Turret + R3-A2; Gold Squadron + BTL-A4 + Ion Cannon Turret + R2; Blue Squadron + B-wing/E2 + Tactician; Blue Squadron + Advanced Sensors
• Top 8: Soontir + PtL + AutoThrusters + Hull Upgrade + Royal Gaurd title; Turr + Veteran Instincts + AutoThrusters + Hull Upgrade + Autothrusters + Hull Upgrade + Royal Guard title; Bounty Hunter + Intelligence Agent
• Top 8: YT-1300; YT-2400 ( Chewbacca & Leebo? )
• Top 8: IG88B&C with VI + AT + HLC + Feedback Array + FCS + Title

2nd Place: VI is correct

Top 4: Corran Horn (PTL, R2D2, EU, FCS), Jake Farrell (VI, A-Wing Test Pilot, PTL, Autothrusters, Chardaan Refit), 2x Bandits

Top 8: Chewie (Determination, Recon Specialist, Jan Ors, Anti-Pursuit Laser), Leebo (Determination, Mangler Cannon, Hull Upgrade, Recon Specialist, Outrider)

^

The video has the details for the Chewie Leebo card.

Though I'm not in the video I feel famous cause that's my mangler cannon card!!!!!

^

The video has the details for the Chewie Leebo card.

Though I'm not in the video I feel famous cause that's my mangler cannon card!!!!!

I hope you got a share of the prizes!