Gamewise what i see here is tgat it depends on the point cost. And i think FFG can only do it wrong here, it's a lose/lose situation really...

If they make it 19 or 20 points base, well then it could be decent.

It has no mobility and the same poor defensive stats as an X-Wing. But if you could bring 5 then it might be worthwile.

But then i would be really disgusted because if such a ship is worth 19 or 20 then the X-Wing was worth nothing more and badly costed from the start (and i really think that is the case). And we would then have a better version of the most iconic Ship in Scum, while having the Ship that gave the whole game its name still not fixed and utterly inefficient.

If however the base pilot cost is 21, well then unless it has a wonderdial, it's just as bad as the X-Wing. No illicit upgrade can fix this. That would be sad for the ship really and show that FFG is not listening.

I think that Movement after maneuvers are really important, but on cheaper ships it's not quite as important as on the really expensive ones.

aye, I'm in Force's boat

though the X-wing has access to high PS and the immaculate R3-A2, on the whole it is not a well priced ship

I'm not sure about no upgrade being able to fix it, but we're going to need a lot of that glitterspicestim and some crazy PS 6 pilot to compensate for its base capabilities being so poor.

which is sad, because I do think that Cobra (god **** gj joe flashbacks) has a cool ability. It just won't do diddly against the HLCs that already mulch X-wings like wood through a chipper

I would discuss the finer points of why, but you are a man stubborn in his ways and likes to hear himself talk (type in this case) so it would be nothing but a waste of my time.

if you are not interested in backing up your points, how about you just not post instead of making weak excuses at my expense?

I have not insulted you nor given you cause to insult me.

All those ships work, Wedge is a Biggs for 4 points more with a good ability and PS, so before tossing upgrades on Biggs I would rather use Wedge (but depends on the list) Hobbie works like a dream with Dutch flying wingman (oh look he can still focus or do a k-turn/stress bot in the same turn and not have any stress himself), Wes has one of the best abilities to set up his team with opportunist shots, Porkins is a gambling mans dream for stress eating and can be outfitted to counter his weakness. The X-wing works well, with only a shy average (what does the great mathwinger say, of like 1-2?) of durability difference to B but a much more open dial, seriously 3 turns set up some amazing things. If anything I like fighting B-wings more due to there for sure damage tolerance, cause screw that rookie that never dies. People get hung up on stats and don't look past the obvious, even more so the vocal minority on the boards. The X-wings have great synergistic pilots, they work better with wingmen then solo.

With that I shall leave, I shouldnt of posted as is.

X-wings would have been a good ship in a enviroment that doesn't contain a Flacon or a IG-2000 (Because those ships are extremely resistant for their cost with no comprimise to offense or arcs.). Unfortunately naither is the case, thus they have to prove themselves in their pilots and/or cost effecency or be second fiddle forever. It's the same reason why the M3A struggles to be a decent ship, because it dies on a bad roll.

That being said, I'm quite happy for the 9 skill pilot, he looks quite fun and extremely powerful in either extreme range. Glitterstim offers a reasonable alternative to many of scums less hard mini's. The key to surviving a turret is simply being able to take fewer shots while hitting them with more or to be supporting a simliarly tough anvil.

I'll see whether it fits into my lists since I will be buying the Tooth anyways. Just whether the fighter fits within the schemes or whether I'm best just sticking to another frail small ship like the M3A or the Y-Wing.

But then i would be really disgusted because if such a ship is worth 19 or 20 then the X-Wing was worth nothing more and badly costed from the start (and i really think that is the case).

Two wrongs don't make a right. Making this ship be 21 points just because it would make the X-Wing seem worse, is the worst possible reason at all to do something. Why make a ship bad, just so you don't make a different ship look worse?

There's no question in my mind that the X-Wing needs a 2 or so point fix, but there's no reason at all to make this ship more expensive than it should be. If anything the X-Wing is a prime example of just how much this ship should cost, and why the lowest PS generic should be 20 points or perhaps even 19.

X-wings would have been a good ship in a enviroment that doesn't contain a Flacon or a IG-2000 (Because those ships are extremely resistant for their cost with no comprimise to offense or arcs.). Unfortunately naither is the case, thus they have to prove themselves in their pilots and/or cost effecency or be second fiddle forever. It's the same reason why the M3A struggles to be a decent ship, because it dies on a bad roll.

I'm nitpicking here, but the IG-2000s have a pretty big compromise to their offense and its the single arc on a large base which makes maneuvering them quite challenging, especially around/in the midst of obstructions, while trying to get a shot. Fat turrets have no excuses, though apart from their cost (which has been turned into an m.o.v exploit, so meh)

the problem with X-wings against IG-2000s is that they don't have the maneuverability necessary to exploit the Aggressor's weakness (which is sad, because even B-wings can with barrel-roll) and they will get steamrolled by their excellent profile and HLC. It's a lose-lose situation

Luke lasts a bit longer, thankfully, thanks to his ability. You have to be careful with FCS variants though, because while Luke can cheat IG-88B's gunner effect with his ability, he's going to be hurting if he takes fully modified shots. Against sensor variants, he lasts longer.

My first thought is that the Kihraxz is the first Scum ship without a title. I also note the distinct lack of face down cards in the spread, so I think it's actually possible we'll see a title for this ship. Call it a 25% chance.

Without a title, the Kihraxz is just too much of a straight ahead fighter for the Scum. At least, for my tastes.

Second thought: if the dial is similar to an X-Wing, I'd want to see the PS2 version clock in at 19-20 points.

I rate the odds of this next thing as ~0.01%, but: I'd be very interested in seeing a 20-21 point PS2 Kihraxz with an EPT slot.

At least they recognised that you kinda needed to have a generic with and EPT (presumably) at PS5, but it makes it all the more striking that we don't have a 24pt Rogue Squadron Pilot at PS6 with an EPT.

Apparently second tier Scum fighters are better than the guys who blew up the Deathstar and would go on to become the most renown squadron in the galaxy (far far away). But then again game balance and fluff don't always have to match.

The more I think about it, the more I think they will just have hard 1 turns on the dial. That is enough for me. Though hopefully not at the expense of the 3 hard turn which is woefully lacking from a lot of Scum ships.

I would have much preferred Talonbane to be PS8, and this from someone who will play him a lot. It just feels wrong (and also unnecessary).

I do have an issue with trying to make this ship so much like the X-wing. Why not make it slightly different and essentially prevent us from having to make this silly comparisons across two nigh identical ships. But that being said I like it and can see it being used because it does fill a much needed niche for Scum.

Theres no way you can say the x-wing was overcosted from the beginning, that's utterly ridiculous, the x-wing was the begging, all over ships should use the x-wing as a baseline for cost. If anything has the wrong cost it's everything else being too cheap.

Quick x-wing "fix" though could just be a -1 point astro?

At least they recognised that you kinda needed to have a generic with and EPT (presumably) at PS5, but it makes it all the more striking that we don't have a 24pt Rogue Squadron Pilot at PS6 with an EPT.

Apparently second tier Scum fighters are better than the guys who blew up the Deathstar and would go on to become the most renown squadron in the galaxy (far far away). But then again game balance and fluff don't always have to match.

to be fair, the faceless scum fighters don't have a better PS than either Luke or Wedge

Cobra matches Wedge's PS, but after keeping his butt kicked so frequently on a Saturday morning cartoon show, you'd bet he'd be richer for the experience

Theres no way you can say the x-wing was overcosted from the beginning, that's utterly ridiculous, the x-wing was the begging, all over ships should use the x-wing as a baseline for cost. If anything has the wrong cost it's everything else being too cheap.

Quick x-wing "fix" though could just be a -1 point astro?

It was overcosted as compared to the Tie Fighter. And unfortunately, a -1 point astromech would remove a lot of utility from the X-Wing, while also effectively increasing the cost of every other 'mech in the game.

Theres no way you can say the x-wing was overcosted from the beginning, that's utterly ridiculous, the x-wing was the begging, all over ships should use the x-wing as a baseline for cost. If anything has the wrong cost it's everything else being too cheap.

Quick x-wing "fix" though could just be a -1 point astro?

No, the astromech is one of the few things the X-wing has going for it.

Also, the general consensus is that the X-wing has always been overcosted, because it compares unfavorably with the Tie Fighter. It still showed up in Rebel lists until wave III because A-wings were overpriced and Ion turret Y-wings aren't effective on their own. (Granted, the Tie advanced was even worse)

ehh....one adult ticket for the Doom Train

I generally like to wait until I have more info, but the fighter is basically a crappier X-wing. That is not a ship you even want to be compared evenly to. Unless the other pilots have amazing, jaw-dropping abilities, its going to be collecting dust.

A boost or roll would've made it far more palatable

There are no adult tickets for the Doom Train. The Doom Train is one of those little electric jobs at the mall, going around a small oval track very slowly.

The adults are the ones waiting to see what the ship actually looks like beyond--and I can't stress this enough--the one pilot card FFG has spoiled.

could do without the condescending attitude, thanks

you really don't have to wait long to see how the fighter is going to turn out, it's has the actions of and is stated almost exactly to a Wave 0 ship and its PS 9 aced is priced in almost exactly to a Wave 1 ace. The similarities are glaring enough to allow for a decent prediction, rather than the above nonsense.

I was going for funny, and I'm sorry I missed the mark there.

But the fact is that we do have to wait. Part of the X-wing's problem is a 1-2 point cost issue, part of it is the lack of repositioning actions, and part of it is a very joust-oriented dial. We all know one of those things will also affect the Kirahxz, but the other two are not yet public.

I don't think the X-wing is over costed relative to the TIE fighter, one X-wing versus 2 TIE fighters is still a pretty even match.

The X-wing was on some accounts was considered overpowered during wave 1 when it was the only 3 attack dice ship. The X-wings durability only becomes a massive concern when 3 and 4 dice attacks become prevalent.

Unfortunately as more ships appeared that had 3 dice the relative efficiency of the X-wing dropped (not helped by the X and the B being so similar in price).

That being said Scum don't currently have a ship that fits the B-wing mold, well they do in the Starviper, but the cost difference is sufficient to not supersede the Kihraxz entirely. Y-wings are slightly more expensive and Scyk's of similar cost (mangler) fall more into the glass cannon interceptor mold. That being said I still think it would be more functional at 20 points, because 3 plus a 40 point Starviper would be a reasonable list. For example just try fitting Scyk's with Autoblaster (21) into a list compared with mangos at 20.

I was going for funny, and I'm sorry I missed the mark there.

But the fact is that we do have to wait. Part of the X-wing's problem is a 1-2 point cost issue, part of it is the lack of repositioning actions, and part of it is a very joust-oriented dial. We all know one of those things will also affect the Kirahxz, but the other two are not yet public.

ah, fair enough

the internet is such a difficult place to distinguish when someone's being serious or not

Anyway, yes we do have to wait to get a perfect picture, but we can at least forecast the fighter's chances given the profile and its perilous closeness to a currently under-performing ship. To offset the problems that we know are coming, it's going to need either a very convincing price tag, a dial to shame interceptors, or some ridiculous unique upgrade that has gone unspoiled.

Apart from the price tag (which, in the case of cobra, fails to impressive), I don't think we'll be seeing any of those things. Final judgement will of course be reserved for when the entity of Wave 7 is available for scrutiny both on and off the table, but I am not holding out much hope for the fighter given how a similar it seems to a currently existing ship.

The punisher and k-wings are complete wild cards, though, and the Hound's Tooth seems to be very potent just from the cost and upgrade slots spoiled

You know how much I love Scum, Joe. They've been my favorite faction for a while. But the Scum X-wing should have been the Dunelizard or the Vaksai. I'd have bought at least 4 Vaksais. There is no telling how many Dunelizards I'd have bought. Maybe all of them? But this thing...meh...not worth 15 dollars.

The Vaksai is an improved version of the Khiraxz and the Dunelizard a heavier version of the Scyk.

So since the Vaksai is probably a more advanced version i would say the Khiraxz is a better choice because we are looking for something simple and rugged like the X-Wing. I mean the Vaksai looks cool and all, but so does the Khiraxz

The Dunelizard would have been a nice choice but a little boring since the stern section looks pretty much like a Scyk. So sonething new is better here.

But then i think you are just a bit obsessed with the two other ships.

All Dat. I love the Khiraxz!

But then i would be really disgusted because if such a ship is worth 19 or 20 then the X-Wing was worth nothing more and badly costed from the start (and i really think that is the case).

Two wrongs don't make a right. Making this ship be 21 points just because it would make the X-Wing seem worse, is the worst possible reason at all to do something. Why make a ship bad, just so you don't make a different ship look worse?There's no question in my mind that the X-Wing needs a 2 or so point fix, but there's no reason at all to make this ship more expensive than it should be. If anything the X-Wing is a prime example of just how much this ship should cost, and why the lowest PS generic should be 20 points or perhaps even 19.

But that's what i have been saying in my post... You just ripped this out of context!

Stats alone is not enough to judge performance. Sure it seems to fit that role as with good firepower average agility and decent hit points for the 20s point range, however it could have a slower dial or one closer to the headhunter instead of the X-wing.

Stats alone is not enough to judge performance. Sure it seems to fit that role as with good firepower average agility and decent hit points for the 20s point range, however it could have a slower dial or one closer to the headhunter instead of the X-wing.

True but with that lackluster of a dial Cobra would be hideously overpriced.

Honestly i feel the Kihraxz was a golden opportunity for FFG to say to hell with the lore and put a Scavenged Astromech slot on it. Seriously why is there only one ship that can take them?

On the flip side the Kihraxz does get bonus points for having a missle slot instead of the nigh useless torpedo slot which means right out of the gate they get access to the only good kind of ordinance out currently.

Stats alone is not enough to judge performance. Sure it seems to fit that role as with good firepower average agility and decent hit points for the 20s point range, however it could have a slower dial or one closer to the headhunter instead of the X-wing.

True but with that lackluster of a dial Cobra would be hideously overpriced.

Honestly i feel the Kihraxz was a golden opportunity for FFG to say to hell with the lore and put a Scavenged Astromech slot on it. Seriously why is there only one ship that can take them?

On the flip side the Kihraxz does get bonus points for having a missle slot instead of the nigh useless torpedo slot which means right out of the gate they get access to the only good kind of ordinance out currently.

Noticed that right out of the gate too. When I was drooling over these first images posted and I saw that it had the stats of an X-Wing (more or less... be real gang!) and it could take missile too, I was like; "Yeah this is a pretty good new ship!"

I like it plenty, and while I was a tiny bit disappointed that FFG did not do the style 1B ship pictured on the HWK-290 card... I am over that too now. Style 4B rocks!

This might be a thing too... dunno

iam going to buy atleast 3 of them. more predator cards for meh hahahha i have a total of 5 then paired with the predator cards from my 2 defenders. and hell yeah finnaly a medium fighter ship for the scum. the PS9 is kinda meh... but yeah lets see what they really can do.

can it use an astro mech??

No, but elicit are on the top guys.

Could be on all of them?

scum does need more astromech ships!!