This, plus the fact that the Punisher is coming out makes me think Wave 8 will not contain the XG-1, but rather the TIE Avenger. It looks cool, for one, and has a great name. How to make it different, stats-wise? Don't know.

S-Loops.

Oh right, I'd forgotten about that somehow.

Not totally sure on it as a Bomber sort of setup, but there's really a lot of ways it could be done.

Clawcraft too.

I think the 3 most viable scum candidates for the next wave are:

Cloakshape

Skipray

and Clawcraft

@Evanger: Most people (me included) are sure FFG isn't going to to any Rebels stuff, because they only bought the rights for the OT and the Expanded Universe. And I don't think they wanna mess up the two continueties by putting ships of Disney Canon into a game based on OT and Legends Canon as long as there are plenty of ships in the EU/Legends.

Frankly, I agree in terms of style/aesthetics. I personally much prefer the OT and (now Legends) EU to the Clone Wars, Prequels, or even Rebels.

At the In Flight report last years GenCon, the CEO specifically stated that there is nothing stopping them doing ships from Rebels and that they would do so if there was one they wanted to include. He went on to say that if they included them, it would be in a "realistic" form, not highly stylised like they are in the show.

Oh right, I'd forgotten about that somehow.

Not totally sure on it as a Bomber sort of setup, but there's really a lot of ways it could be done.

Clawcraft too.

I think the 3 most viable scum candidates for the next wave are:

Cloakshape

Skipray

and Clawcraft

Clawcraft is in such a wierd place. Too Imperial design-wise to not be an Imp ship, but the pilots are mostly NewRep.

I think what I could see it as is the first ship with 2-Segnors.

Oh right, I'd forgotten about that somehow.

Not totally sure on it as a Bomber sort of setup, but there's really a lot of ways it could be done.

Clawcraft too.

I think the 3 most viable scum candidates for the next wave are:

Cloakshape

Skipray

and Clawcraft

Clawcraft is in such a wierd place. Too Imperial design-wise to not be an Imp ship, but the pilots are mostly NewRep.

I think what I could see it as is the first ship with 2-Segnors.

It's also way, way outside the timeline for anything else in the game.

Oh right, I'd forgotten about that somehow.

Not totally sure on it as a Bomber sort of setup, but there's really a lot of ways it could be done.

Clawcraft too.

I think the 3 most viable scum candidates for the next wave are:

Cloakshape

Skipray

and Clawcraft

Clawcraft is in such a wierd place. Too Imperial design-wise to not be an Imp ship, but the pilots are mostly NewRep.

I think what I could see it as is the first ship with 2-Segnors.

It's also way, way outside the timeline for anything else in the game.

Strictly-speaking, it's only about a year further forward than the K-wing.

[The clawcraft is] also way, way outside the timeline for anything else in the game.

Strictly-speaking, it's only about a year further forward than the K-wing.

Hmm. Wookieepedia agrees with you. I had pictured it as a strictly Legacy-era ship, but apparently they were already well known when Thrawn was directing the Imperial fleet...

Well, pretty much all the known pilots are Vong-era.

There's essentially two versions of the Clawcraft: the Nsiss—which we all know and love as the prettiest TIE variant in Cosmos—and the "root" Clawcraft, which has roughly the same wings but doesn't have the TIE cockpit.

The Nsiss doesn't really show up until 19ABY (Hand of Thrawn books), the Thrawn-era one is the non-TIE.

Oh right, I'd forgotten about that somehow.

Not totally sure on it as a Bomber sort of setup, but there's really a lot of ways it could be done.

Clawcraft too.

I think the 3 most viable scum candidates for the next wave are:

Cloakshape

Skipray

and Clawcraft

Clawcraft is in such a wierd place. Too Imperial design-wise to not be an Imp ship, but the pilots are mostly NewRep.

I think what I could see it as is the first ship with 2-Segnors.

It's also way, way outside the timeline for anything else in the game.

why do I have to state this all the time. It was made back when Thrawn and Palpatine were still alive.

Clawcraft fighters had been produced for some time before the Empire under the reign of Galactic Emperor Palpatine began sharing technology with the Chiss Ascendancy, an action initiated by the Chiss Imperial Thrawn. Models of Clawcraft began incorporating TIE design cues as part of the joint venture.

It could be a Scum ship, and there are pilots for it, Like the Fels.

I see it as a really slow ship (Y-wing slow), but extremely maneuverable (due to basically having super auto-thrusters). It is essentially a slower but tougher Squint. 3/2/3/1 maybe.

EDIT: I noticed you caught the common timeline mis-conception.

It could be a Scum ship, and there are pilots for it, Like the Fels.

I see it as a really slow ship (Y-wing slow), but extremely maneuverable (due to basically having super auto-thrusters). It is essentially a slower but tougher Squint. 3/2/3/1 maybe.

My rough WIP had something like 3/3/3/1, Focus/BR/Evade, slow dial (maybe white 4, no hard 3s, no hard 2s, 2segnors, 1banks but no 1straight).

EDIT: I noticed you caught the common timeline mis-conception.

I AM the SenateWookieepedia

It could be a Scum ship, and there are pilots for it, Like the Fels.

I see it as a really slow ship (Y-wing slow), but extremely maneuverable (due to basically having super auto-thrusters). It is essentially a slower but tougher Squint. 3/2/3/1 maybe.

My rough WIP had something like 3/3/3/1, Focus/BR/Evade, slow dial (maybe white 4, no hard 3s, no hard 2s, 2segnors, 1banks but no 1straight).

EDIT: I noticed you caught the common timeline mis-conception.

I AM the SenateWookieepedia

Yea I was thinking it's slow but hyper maneuvers. 3/2/3/1 with Focus/Evade/BR and new action that is performing a 1 fwd and changing facing 90 degrees (like a forward BR)

Dial roughly:

1: Green fwd, banks, White turn

2: Green fwd, White banks, turn, Red, k-turn (or segnor's)

3: White fwd, banks, Red, k-turn (or segnor's)

4: Red fwd

Possibly system upgrade, some new mods; cost TBD though I think anywhere from 21-23 is good.

It occurs to me that we have not seen any Imp small based ships that aren't TIE variants. 7 for 7. This, plus the fact that the Punisher is coming out makes me think Wave 8 will not contain the XG-1, but rather the TIE Avenger. It looks cool, for one, and has a great name. How to make it different, stats-wise? Don't know.

Well, it's funny that in the game where it was introduced, it is called all the time TIE Advanced, and only mentioned the 'Avenger' nick name once or twice.

It's clearly not the same ship as "our" TIE Advanced. The panels are different, the cockpit isn't spherical, it has 4 laser cannons and a tractor beam weapon hardpoint.

But following FFG's logarithmic scale for atack values, that should be roughly 3 attack dice, that is what the X1 TIE Advanced now have. I don't know how will they introduce the tractor beam, or if they ever will, but other than that, statwise the TIE Avenger is our TIE Advanced x1.

I don't think the TIE Advanced X1 model was so prevalent in the Imperial Navy, but more like a prototype of which Vader made use as his personal fighter.

But the flavor text of the Imperial Raider makes it sound like it was, since it says that it was usual to deploy a Raider along with some TIE Advanced for hit-and-fade operations. The TIE Avenger was the mass-produced TIE Advanced, so I guess FFG are here combining the two ships into one. The stats of the Avenger with the looks of the Avanced X1.

But following FFG's logarithmic scale for atack values, that should be roughly 3 attack dice, that is what the X1 TIE Advanced now have. I don't know how will they introduce the tractor beam, or if they ever will, but other than that, statwise the TIE Avenger is our TIE Advanced x1.

Yeah, but non-statwise, it isn't.

It's still not distinct enough to be a separate ship, ever.

But following FFG's logarithmic scale for atack values, that should be roughly 3 attack dice, that is what the X1 TIE Advanced now have. I don't know how will they introduce the tractor beam, or if they ever will, but other than that, statwise the TIE Avenger is our TIE Advanced x1.

Yeah, but non-statwise, it isn't.

Because?

T/A X1 with AC or ATC is roughly 2 hits per attack roll, average.

That is statistically close to a 3 dice roll with a single modification (either F or TL). The TIE Avenger would probably have an Attack rating of 3, like the X-W, T/I and T/D, plus one action to modify it. That takes us close to the T/A X1.

It's an agile ship, so 3 agility seems right.

The Avenger remaining two stats, Hull and Shields, are quite debatable because FFG seems to alter them from the original sources for the sake of game balance. From the TIE Fighter game configuration file:

Name			Shields	Hull	Length	Speed	LIMGTW	Special
A-wing			50	16	10	120	2 2
Assault Gunboat		100	30	15	90	222
B-wing			100	62	15	90	332
Combat Utility Vehicle		7	15	35	22	repair/rearm
Missile Boat		120	20	15	125	1 4
R-41 Starchaser		30	15	15	100	22
T-wing			20	15	10	110	2
Tie Advanced		50	15	10	145	4 2
Tie Bomber			30	10	80	2 2
Tie Defender		100	15	10	155	422
Tie Fighter			10	10	100	2
Tie Interceptor			17	10	110	4
Transport		80	40	20	55	22	repair/rearm
Tug				5	5	10		repair/rearm
Tyderian Shuttle	100	25	20	65	4
X-wing			50	21	15	100	4 2
Y-wing			75	42	20	80	222
Z-95 Headhunter		20	15	15	95	2 2

The X-Wing had 21 hull and 50 shield units, that translated to 3 hull 2 shields here. The Avenger had 15 hull and 50 shield units, not much different from the X-Wing. I don't see the 3 hull and 2 shield translation that FFG made with the T/A too far from that.

So in the end we would have a 3/3/3/2 ship, that is basically what the T/A X1 is with an Accuracy Corrector or an Advanced Targetting Computer.

It occurs to me that we have not seen any Imp small based ships that aren't TIE variants. 7 for 7. This, plus the fact that the Punisher is coming out makes me think Wave 8 will not contain the XG-1, but rather the TIE Avenger. It looks cool, for one, and has a great name. How to make it different, stats-wise? Don't know.

Which is exactly WHY I'm hoping for the XG-1 myself. It would be good to have a small base option for the Imperials which ISN'T a TIE series ship - especially since most of the immediately recognisable ones have already been done. There's more to the Imperial Navy than the TIE series.

That said, I'm not averse to the idea of a TIE Avenger, but considering the Raider has just reintroduced the TIE Advanced to the masses, I think we may have to wait for that one.

If they were going to bring in the Avenger, it feels like they would have done so with the Raider.

If they were going to bring in the Avenger, it feels like they would have done so with the Raider.

Hmmm... but that would not make much business sense ... if the Avenger was a new, distinct model, surely you'd sell more as a standalone expansion where players are apt to buy multiples.

Would many people buy 2, 3 or even 4 raiders to get their multiples of the Avenger?

Hmmm... unless you had it as an individual pack as well and the Avenger that came with the Raider was a repaint with more awesome pilots/cards for the Avenger...

If they were going to bring in the Avenger, it feels like they would have done so with the Raider.

What? That would be the worst possible way to release the ship. Ever.

Look at it like this: all potential Avenger pilots were already on the Advanced.

Adding the Advanced to the Raider ate up any remaining candidates.

So far the only case of multiple pilot cards with same name has been crossfaction.

This is effectively the final nail in the coffin.

I kind of get that Tipperary is saying there though - the Advanced and Avenger seem very similar - I know they're not, but the do kind of step all over each other's design space. Having just buffed the Advanced and re-released with the Raider, it doesn't feel like they'll release a ship which would potentially compete with it's role.

They're literally just different 3D models of THE SAME THING, is what I'm saying.

Some people just have the unfortunate taste to think that the Avenger looks good.

It occurs to me that we have not seen any Imp small based ships that aren't TIE variants. 7 for 7. This, plus the fact that the Punisher is coming out makes me think Wave 8 will not contain the XG-1, but rather the TIE Avenger. It looks cool, for one, and has a great name. How to make it different, stats-wise? Don't know.

Which is exactly WHY I'm hoping for the XG-1 myself. It would be good to have a small base option for the Imperials which ISN'T a TIE series ship - especially since most of the immediately recognisable ones have already been done. There's more to the Imperial Navy than the TIE series.

Reminds me of yokel group from wraith squadron"I honestly thought everyone in the imperial navy was a tie pilot.

Because?

T/A X1 with AC or ATC is roughly 2 hits per attack roll, average.

That is statistically close to a 3 dice roll with a single modification (either F or TL). The TIE Avenger would probably have an Attack rating of 3, like the X-W, T/I and T/D, plus one action to modify it. That takes us close to the T/A X1.

It's an agile ship, so 3 agility seems right.

So, I say "non-statwise, it isn't". And your response is to quote a bunch of game stats?

Besides, all those stats neglect the most important difference the two ships would have. And that's the maneuver dial. The Advanced's dial is actually WORSE that the basic TIE Fighter's. The Avenger's dial would potentially be an upgrade over even the Interceptor's.

At their core, despite sharing a prototype designation, the TIE Advance x1 is a TIE Fighter with shields and missiles. The TIE Avenger is a TIE Interceptor with shield and missiles. That makes the Advanced x1 and Avenger as different as the Fighter and Interceptor themselves.

Guys your forgetting about one thing:

Wave VIII is roughly set to hit by the end of the year.

Episode VII hits in december.

My guess we will see this new Xwing from Force Awakens along with long due fix to normal Xwing.

Its only way they can release fixes for xwing (besides some rebel aces2) that makes sense.