That's, uh, quite a detailed distinction for something that was meant to be a very broad idea. That having been said, all ideas are welcome, let's just not derail the thread in an effort to correct each other's nomenclature.

As soon as I've got some free time I'll express some more random thoughts here.

Being that people had discussed Formations for 4 pages but no one had put up and example of a Theme force might look like, I thought it only fair that I provided an example. You might not like the idea or example, and that's fine but now everyone reading this has an idea how Theme forces work.

That is a difference, certainly. But I used the ideas based upon what they have in common: restricting your list options while offering a benefit of some kind in return. Space is already very limited in the 100 point format, so merely requiring the inclusion of certain ships is a de facto restriction. Either way we appreciate your input, and you're right, the mockup in my OP doesn't wholly reflect the potential of a multi-tiered theme force. Do you have any other ideas to add?

Admittedly, this Formation/Tier concept is new to me. Upon reading the OP and first few threads I thought that we would be 'cluttering' the rules of the game and making it unneccessarily complex.

I am now of the opinion that this is a great idea. I would also like to offer my time to this cause. I may have some spare time over the next week or so and would be happy to draft up some cards for playtesting.

If anyone has any 'formations' that they are particularly fond of, please let me now and I will see what I can do.

Rogue Squadron

Must contain 3 members of Rogue Squadron (including non x-wing pilots)

All ships gain +1 to all stats e.g. the x-wing would end up PS+1 with 4/3/4/3 as it's stats before upgrades.

But this way we can Have a flight be Wedge: Rogue 1, Tycho: Rogue 2, Wes: Rogue 3 or any other combination of Rogue pilots. (even Soontir Fel)

that would be a scary list

Soontir title ptl autothrusters hu

Wedge R5-P9 ptl EU

Luke R2-D2 Lone Wolf SU

Rogue Squadron

Must contain 3 members of Rogue Squadron (including non x-wing pilots)

All ships gain +1 to all stats e.g. the x-wing would end up PS+1 with 4/3/4/3 as it's stats before upgrades.

But this way we can Have a flight be Wedge: Rogue 1, Tycho: Rogue 2, Wes: Rogue 3 or any other combination of Rogue pilots. (even Soontir Fel)

that would be a scary list

Soontir title ptl autothrusters hu

Wedge R5-P9 ptl EU

Luke R2-D2 Lone Wolf SU

Ridiculously OP

Also, I've read a tonne of EU books and I'm still not 100% sure who is/was in Rogue Squadron. I recall there being a tonne of aliens though .. and some inter-species romances too .. ewwwww.

Yeah I also want a Wraith Squad card but in order to get it we have to have a Voort "Piggy" SaBinring card as well.

Or the Hawk Bats which requires Lt. Ketch (Yub Yub!! Comander)

As to who was in Rogue Squadron, there are a bunch of named Pilots in other fighters that were members.

There is Ibitsam and Ten in B-wings

Tycho and Gemmer in an A wing

Corran in an E wing

Soontir in an Intercepter

Dash Rendar (ok for only the battle of Hoth but he was a Rogue)

and then there are the ones they have not created yet

Gavin Darklighter (Biggs Cousin)

Ooryl Qrrg

Nawara Ven

Inyri Forge

Aril Nunb

Pash Cracken (Airen Crackens Son)

Jania Solo

Jacen Solo

Pash was a Rogue, but in my opinion he belongs in an A-Wing.

Pash was a Rogue, but in my opinion he belongs in an A-Wing.

Well he was originally in an A-wing as a Squdron Leader but his squad started to feel like he could do no wrong and he was not challenged so he joined the Rogues to prove there was still a challenge.

But so ws Tycho. He was the A-Wing pilot that survived the second Death Star run.

Gold Squad - List must include at least two Y-wings of at least PS 4- Rebel only.

During any shot that requires you to spend a target lock you may add two hits to your roll by gaining a stress.

This would make ordinance more viable on them and be thematic with their purpose during episode IV.

Blue squad - List must include 2 Bwings of at least PS 4.

Your Bwings each gain the sensor upgrades from all other Bwings in the squad at range 1-2

Bwings are almost always used as generic ps 2 meat cannons. This would give some love to the upper and mid range guys.

Rivals - List must include at least one Firespray and one agressor.

As long as the Firespray and the agressor stay outside of range 2 of each other they gain PS 9 and one die to attack and defense. If one of them ends in the other's line of fire they must shoot at the other if no other target is available.

It plays off of the rivalry between the bounty hunters.

Uh, Ryther? Gold Squadron is the PS 2 Y-wings. You'd want Grey Squadron for that.

I like the idea and agree with WAAAGH that having the formations on cards would make things simpler.

I'd say printing them on large cards that have slots on them to place your purchased ships would make this easier too. (Similar to stadiums in BBTM if that makes sense to anyone)

Pash was a Rogue, but in my opinion he belongs in an A-Wing.

Well he was originally in an A-wing as a Squdron Leader but his squad started to feel like he could do no wrong and he was not challenged so he joined the Rogues to prove there was still a challenge.

But so ws Tycho. He was the A-Wing pilot that survived the second Death Star run.

True, but after Pash left the Rogues, he went back to A-Wings.

I like the idea and agree with WAAAGH that having the formations on cards would make things simpler.

I'd say printing them on large cards that have slots on them to place your purchased ships would make this easier too. (Similar to stadiums in BBTM if that makes sense to anyone)

Your name .. simultaneously painful and humourous.

Uh, Ryther? Gold Squadron is the PS 2 Y-wings. You'd want Grey Squadron for that.

Oh I know that they are in the game, but I was trying to encompass the theme of the episode IV Ywings. They didn't use turrets like golds usually do in the game. They were ordinance launch platforms. Thematically it works even though the name sake card wouldn't work with it.

If anyone is confused, here is an example of a formation card I mocked up:

Formation: Elite Defender Squadron

Cost: 1 point

Restriction: Your list must include at least two TIE Defenders.

Benefit: All TIE Defenders in your list have an increased pilot skill of 2, and an Elite Talent slot if they do not already have one.

Edit: As an aside, formation cards would have the added benefit of increased potency in epic matches, where some serious TLC is required right now.

One of the problems I can foresee is that these titles, like everything else, have to be carefully balanced in order to keep them from breaking metas or making them auto-includes like C-3PO or ACD. If I tossed this title on a Rexler/Vessery list, they'd have two EPTs and a native PS8 and 10 that can be buffed to 10 and 12 with Veteran Instincts and still have room for things like Predator and Lone Wolf tacked on as well. Is it really that bad? I don't know, but it sure sounds terrifying to be outgunned and out-skilled by a pair of HLC/Mangler Defenders with VI and Pedator, even if its still only two ships.

If I tossed this title on a Rexler/Vessery list, they'd have two EPTs

You misread something.

and an Elite Talent slot if they do not already have one.

If I tossed this title on a Rexler/Vessery list, they'd have two EPTs

You misread something.

and an Elite Talent slot if they do not already have one.

Just realized this.

Either way, it would be a 1 point VI upgrade for Vessery and Rexler, and from there they can stack another VI or Predator to buff them even more.

The idea of formation/theme cards really intrigues me. I absolutely love the possibilities it opens up. Obviously as has been stated this would have to be done VERY carefully so as not to unbalance/force auto include any of them.

Really neat idea with the bounty hunter rivals. At first I was going to say the increase in attack and defense was too powerful but the forcing them to shoot at each other if no other targets in arc is a good balance to that I think as well as a very interesting idea both for thematic purposes as well as implications for in game. It would really force you to play several moves ahead and make blocking your ships even more deadly of the opponent does it right. I would play with this formation in a heartbeat if it was made!

Edit: I think the distinction needs to be made for increasing the primary not just att dice in general. 5 die HLC or 4 die mangler B seems way way too good and it would force a cannon for Bs ability but make it so it's not always the mangler you shoot with at range 3 for the initial shot. I like having the options between 4 dice primary or mangler as the first r3 shot. Oh plus If it's all attack dice then Boba with cluster and glitterstim says hi ;P

If I tossed this title on a Rexler/Vessery list, they'd have two EPTs

You misread something.

and an Elite Talent slot if they do not already have one.

Just realized this.

Either way, it would be a 1 point VI upgrade for Vessery and Rexler, and from there they can stack another VI or Predator to buff them even more.

What?! I just pointed out to you that the formation is not giving them 2 EPTs. They cannot take VI and predator (I would also expect that they couldn't double up the same EPT even if they did have 2 slots, so no double VI)

If I tossed this title on a Rexler/Vessery list, they'd have two EPTs

You misread something.

and an Elite Talent slot if they do not already have one.

Just realized this.

Either way, it would be a 1 point VI upgrade for Vessery and Rexler, and from there they can stack another VI or Predator to buff them even more.

What?! I just pointed out to you that the formation is not giving them 2 EPTs. They cannot take VI and predator (I would also expect that they couldn't double up the same EPT even if they did have 2 slots, so no double VI)

Right, but the first part of the formation upgrade that you excluded is increasing their PS by 2, which is equivalent to giving them VI except it would be for one point for both ships' PS. From there, Rex and Vessery still have an EPT slot so they can equip VI or Predator as well as the formation, so it would be like double VI if they chose to take VI or VI + Predator.

Just a random idea, you could, for epic play, have formations cost epic points. That way you could bring more than one of them but they would cut into your large ship deployment.

For those of you who play 40k or Warmachine, you should already understand the concept. While there are certainly no end to the legitimate gripes concerning the former game, formations are one of the few things they've managed to get right in recent years. For those who don't know what I'm talking about, a formation is an element of design space that uses list building considerations outside the normal upgrade paths to balance out possible benefits. Consider some of the current ships that require "fixes": the design space for implementing those fixes is becoming narrower and narrower, with the possibility of becoming redundant with preexisting fixes. To wit, there are only so many combinations of titles and modifications that can be implemented to reverse the bloated point cost or lack of value of current ships. So, what I'm advocating is a new kind of card that is attached to the list as a whole, rather than independent ships. Restrictions would be list based ("must take X number of Y ships," for example), and would provide a benefit to any and all ships in that list that match the given criteria.

If anyone is confused, here is an example of a formation card I mocked up:

Formation: Elite Defender Squadron

Cost: 1 point

Restriction: Your list must include at least two TIE Defenders.

Benefit: All TIE Defenders in your list have an increased pilot skill of 2, and an Elite Talent slot if they do not already have one.

Edit: As an aside, formation cards would have the added benefit of increased potency in epic matches, where some serious TLC is required right now.

Yes, I really like this idea. Something that boosts an entire Squadron even if they might not normally be able to have certain types of upgrades or abilities.

Rogue Squadron

Entire Squad must be X-Wing only

At least one Ship must be PS 6 or higher.

8pts (Assigned to the ship with the highest Pilot Skill for purposes of determining margin of victory)

All ships in your squad gain the Evade and Barrel Roll actions to their action bar.

Reduce the Cost of all equiped upgrades by 1 to a minimum or 0

Standardized Combat Training

8pts

At the beginning of the game, choose one pilot in your squad as a Flight Leader.

For the duration of the game, treat all of your ships as if they had the pilot ability of the Flight Leader, instead of their own.

This one is probably way overpowered, (think of Luke, Han, Vader, and Dark Curse, to name a small few) especially since, as worded, you could have a couple aces and choose which ability to use at the start of the game based on your opponent's list.

But oh what fun.

I think that'd be a great idea if done properly. I am definetely a fluffy person and I love when my army actually makes sense, be it in 40k, WFB, WarZone, Warmachine or... well, you get the idea.

But it has to be done carefully to avoid things like, as you may recall, the Cygnar trencher tier lists that are utterly rubbish or Khador eButcher doom reaver spam that makes very good unit pretty much overpowered by letting it charge and slaughter you at turn two.

Or formations from 40k like skyblight that dominate that faction's lists for a year to come (although that was reasonable because tyranids were terrible back then).

All in all I would support such idea because it adds another layer of fun for people who like to get a bit more personal with their favourite list just like they make it personal with ship colour (red/striped interceptors for example) or even repaints.

That would open lots of nice opportunities to field existing forces like Kath's Binayre folks or, say, Black Squadron that doesn't penalize you for choosing special characters/more expensive generics because 8 ties are more efficient, figuratively making you shoot yourself in the foot. Not to mention the Rogues that people are so looking forward to!

We Don't Need Their Scum
0 points
Rebels or Empire Only

May take one Scum & Villainy ship with HV2+ with any S&V upgrades at normal (maybe reduced?) cost. Once reduced HV is reduced to 1, the S&V ship must move as rapidly as possible towards the nearest table edge and exit the battlefield, and may take no offensive action (dropping bombs are considered a "defensive" action as it dissuades pursuers).

Just a thought....

Advanced Intel

4 Pts

Immediately before the first planning phase of the game begins, each of your ships may acquire a free target lock on any enemy ship in the play area.

Then discard this card.

Try it on:

4X Gold with a mix of Flechettes, Protons or Ion Torps and astromechs

4X Scimitar with Extra Mun, Flechettes, Clusters or 3 of them flanking a naked Jonus with Squad Leader.

5-6X Binayre with varied Missiles and/or illicit upgrades