Does anyone have a good source for determining titles for ecclesiarchal and miliatary roles in the Imperium. Sure I could look at the church and military in our own time, but I wanted something more 40k sounding and I am terrible at coming up with titles. So, any suggestions/ideas?

No help here?

Well the Imperial Infantrymans Uplifting Primer do provide us with some ranks:

(from highest to lowest)

Warmaster

Lord General

Marshal

Lieutenant General

Major General

Colonel

Lieutenant Colonel

Major

Captain

Lieutenant

Sergeant

Corporal

Trooper

And of course, below trooper you'll probably find "Conscript".

Then there's special ranks and title like Techpriest Enginseer, Commissar, Sanctioned Psyker, Confessors/Priest (not "Chaplain" though, that is an exclusive title for Atartes) etc. etc.

I wonder if Sergent is a catch-all for all high ranking enlisted Guardsman. This makes me curious seeing as my own military background (okay, so I'm in the Navy...>_> still all the same to a fair degree).

And on that note, the Imperial Navy doesn't go into much depth about it's own ranking system and, considering the divide between the Guard and Navy, they wouldn't share the same ranking system either. Would it be out of canon to use some of the real-world rankings in regard to the Imperial Navy? like calling the low in guys like Novice, Seaman, Petty Officers?

Ignayus said:

Well according to the codex, it works like this: Sergeants act as squad leaders of ten man squads, with corporals being their second-in-commands. Some regiments use the doctrine of dividing their ten man squads into two fireteams, and when that is the case the Corporals will act as the second fire-team leader and the sergeant will works as the first fire-team leader.

But yes, I'd assume that the rank of Sergeant is the highest attainable rank outside officers ranks. I don't believe they have distinctions between sergeants really (like Sergeant 1st class or Sergeant 2nd class or something similar). Mainly because few sergeants tend to live that long. Being in the guard as a grunt isn't a career really, but being an officer in the guard can be. Hence the many distinctions between officer ranks and lack of distinctions for the grunts.

Not quite- there are mentions within the current Codex:Imperial Guard of Colour Sergeants, Sergeants-Major and Staff Sergeants. Background novels include references to 1st Sergeants, Master Sergeants and Platoon Sergeants, along with different grades of Sergeant-Major: CSM and RSM (Company Sergeant-Major and Regimental Sergeant-Major). Essentially, it depends on the IG regiment in question.

As for the IN question- no, not that far out of canon, although I'd recommend using the Napoleonic-era RN ranks rather than modern naval ranks (from USN, RN or any other you may be familiar with), as the published stuff which fills in the IN background fluff (particularly Richard Williams' Relentless ) tends to use those (or a variation thereupon).

As for the questions raised in the OP- in all honesty, I'd say the best bet is to look at the early Christian church for religious titles- particularly the Byzantine Empire (the Roman Empire in the East) and its' priests and so forth. I know, you asked for an in-universe source, but there hasn't really been a coherent structure, so I figure the best bet is to borrow from early Christianity (for the simple reason that it should be different enough that players won't accuse you of hitting them with the Catholic Church IN SPACE!, but familiar enough (to at least 70% of Europeans and Americans) to get a pass and kudos for verisimilitude).

Mainly because few sergeants tend to live that long. Being in the guard as a grunt isn't a career really, but being an officer in the guard can be. Hence the many distinctions between officer ranks and lack of distinctions for the grunts.

That depends mainly on the kind of regiment and the war you get sent to - beating a poorly organized rebellion on some important ressource planet into submission is a lot nicer than taking back a world overrun by Chaos.

Cifer said:

Of course. But beating back poorly organized rebellion is usually the job for PDF forces and not the Imperial Guard. If the IG have to get called in, then obiously the rebellion wasn't so poorly organized after all. Don't you agree?

But yes, it depends on the regiment. Ciaphas Cain for instance had this in mind when he opted to be assigned to an artillery regiment, usually situated far away from the front lines chucking ordnance at the enemy from a safe distance. In comparison to a spear head regiment or storm trooper regiment it's safe to say that some regiments see a lot more action than others.

Then again, things didn't quite go according to poor Ciaphas' plans, but that's beside the point...

the Imperial Navy use many know if not morden used (not excatly use whch ranks are used in the navy nowadays) of those I know in descending order

Lord Solar or Warmaster (having control over both the Guard and the Navy) (Segmentum Command)

Lord Admiral (Sector Command)

Admiral (Navy qroup command)

Comodore (Battle qroup or Flotilla command)

Captain (Individual Ship command)

Flak-Leiutenant (second in command on a ship)

various officers (master or this and that)

petty officers

armsmen

I am well aware that there might be some holes (i am especially unsure about Flak-Leiutenant to armsman)

In the Ecclisiarchy (or how the hell you spell it) the are the ranks mentioned in the Rulebook under Cleric going all the way from Novice to Hierophant which is the highest "rank" on a single planet then there is Deacon and Cardinal and Ecclisiarch which is the heighest you can be in the Ecclisiarchy and is synonymous with High Lord of Terra of the Ecclisiarchy. there are likely more between Heirophant and Ecclisiarch but I do not know them.

Lord Admiral commands a strike force or Tactical Battle Force. Maybe a Fleet

Solar Admiral ranks between Lord Admiral and Fleet Admiral. No clue what his job is. Maybe Command a seperate force of a strike force to help out a Lord Admiral.

Fleet Admiral commands a local planetary fleet or may be given slightly more command like (all the Lathe world's System defense ships are probably lead by one Fleet Admiral of Mechanius employ not Imperial Navy)

Then there are the standard Admiral (Various forms of course) controls a flotillia of Ships but not a whole fleet worth.

Rear Admirals are apart of the whole Admiral series. Maybe Controls a Squadron

Captains control one ship

1st LTs who the Captain relays orders to as he decides.

the Masters (Guild Heads)

Guilds are pretty much where you start to lose defined ranks. like Engineer Primarius of the Holy Engine Housing.

The Petty Officers (Keep the unruly in line *get hits with a shock maul* ... Those Friendly enforcers of the Holy Emperor)

freemen (See Space Wolf fleet structure)

The prisoners who are chained to their machines and won't move more then 3 feet during their whole prison term.

Sergeant tends to be the first rank anyone thinks of when they think of someone who has a leadership role but is still an enlisted man, so it tends to be a popular rank for NPCs. The rank establishes the character as someone who was respected and capable, but not an officer- at least in the minds of civilians whose only knowledge of military ranks comes from movies and so forth.

Bear in mind that there are literally millions of regiments in the Imperial guard, and that they all come from their own distinct cultures. So a sergeant in one regiment might be called a Bashar in another, or a Hetman in a third.

There's no single unified IG ranking system up to the regimental level, and at the higher (staff) levels one would imagine there's probably a lot of variation too. The IG isn't really a single military, it's more like a collection of militaries all using the same (or similar) weapons systems. I was going to say it's a bit like NATO, but the comparison isn't really that apt because NATO tend to use similar ranking systems.

I think if you want to get into detail about the IG chain of command, create your own IG regiment, and invent whatever rules/background suits you best!

Lightbringer said:

That's not entirely accurate. Regiments of the Imperial guard are formed by agents of the departemento munitorium (commissars mainly), which means that they are bound to follow some sort of standard. While some Commissars might be (but are not obligated to be) lenient enough to let the men adress eachother with their world's own ranking system and honorary titles, they are still going to be refered to standard departemento munitorium titles for administrative purposes.

So while the grunts might refer to their sergeant as "Bashar" or "Hetman", the Commissar will write "Sgt" in front of their names in all his regimental reports, and all literate officers in the regiment will be expected to use the same titles for their reports as well. Also during joint operations with other regiments, where the chain of command will be necessary, all involved soldiers will be expected to use a standardized set of titles in order for everyone involved to understand who outranks who...