So does each ship have to have its each version of an upgrade card and why?

Like if I want gunnery team on 2 ships, cant a piece of paper that says gunnery team or a photo copy do the trick.

I have friends who are hesitant to play the game because they fear that if they want to be the most competitive they may have to buy a $40 ship for one or 2 upgrade cards.

I could see at regionals and higher up where proxies may not be allowed but for LGS events I personally don't see an issue with it.

Thoughts?

Official events will not allow proxies. Many local events will also not allow proxies either.

You can always proxy cards in casual matches if your opponent is ok with it. No need to have the physical card.

just seems bad for business. Like i want this one upgrade card....guess i need another core set and 2 of these other ships and now ive spent $600 on wave 1. I can see why people are hesitant to get it especially when they play other games competitively and want to play this one competitively but not for a $600 buy in.

Yeah don't know why they just don't bring out upgrade card packs. I ordered the wave 1 VSD boxset and I did wonder in future would I even field 2 VSD's but knowing there will be the extra upgrade cards and I worked out a deal with my local store owner I went ahead and purchased it.

But seeing as x-wing doesn't have a upgrade card pack i doubt armada will either.

So does each ship have to have its each version of an upgrade card and why?

Like if I want gunnery team on 2 ships, cant a piece of paper that says gunnery team or a photo copy do the trick.

I have friends who are hesitant to play the game because they fear that if they want to be the most competitive they may have to buy a $40 ship for one or 2 upgrade cards.

I could see at regionals and higher up where proxies may not be allowed but for LGS events I personally don't see an issue with it.

Thoughts?

Most people, when playing casually, wouldn't have a problem with it. It also looks like multiple copies of each card will be available through buying expansions.

I've traded a lot for singles in x-wing. Some places also sell singles of cards. I suspect a similar thing will show up for armada.

I've also borrowed cards from a friend for a tournament. I wanted 2 cards, but didn't want to buy the expansions, so I borrowed them temporarily for the day.

In my experience a little creativity has smoothed over lacking specific upgrades.

So does each ship have to have its each version of an upgrade card and why?

Like if I want gunnery team on 2 ships, cant a piece of paper that says gunnery team or a photo copy do the trick.

I have friends who are hesitant to play the game because they fear that if they want to be the most competitive they may have to buy a $40 ship for one or 2 upgrade cards.

I could see at regionals and higher up where proxies may not be allowed but for LGS events I personally don't see an issue with it.

Thoughts?

Most people, when playing casually, wouldn't have a problem with it. It also looks like multiple copies of each card will be available through buying expansions.

maybe a little Doom n Gloom but i hope that for example the gladiator has an upgrade id want on all 3 of my ships. thats 3 gladiators when im only playing 1. I will get 1 of everything for wave 1 and prolly leave it their.

i have friends who are either die hard imp or die hard rebel who dont want to buy imperial ships just for upgrade cards and vice versa.

It's really only an issue if you desire to play in official tournaments. In my experience with XWM, if you show up to a play group a few times and aren't a jerk, you can borrow pretty much any official component you need for a tournament.

Also, how could you ever possibly need to buy another core set and two other ships in order to get one upgrade card?

just seems bad for business. Like i want this one upgrade card....guess i need another core set and 2 of these other ships and now ive spent $600 on wave 1. I can see why people are hesitant to get it especially when they play other games competitively and want to play this one competitively but not for a $600 buy in.

You are just throwing out random numbers.

You don't have any basis for them, nor any basis to conclude that you are going to buy ships solely for upgrade cards.

Yeah don't know why they just don't bring out upgrade card packs. I ordered the wave 1 VSD boxset and I did wonder in future would I even field 2 VSD's but knowing there will be the extra upgrade cards and I worked out a deal with my local store owner I went ahead and purchased it.

But seeing as x-wing doesn't have a upgrade card pack i doubt armada will either.

They aren't going to do it, and honestly you might not like it if they did. It would likely fairly pricey for just a couple of cards.

maybe a little Doom n Gloom but i hope that for example the gladiator has an upgrade id want on all 3 of my ships. thats 3 gladiators when im only playing 1. I will get 1 of everything for wave 1 and prolly leave it their.

i have friends who are either die hard imp or die hard rebel who dont want to buy imperial ships just for upgrade cards and vice versa.

As longs as you're not concerned with playing in tournaments, you're probably ok. Personally, I don't have an issue with it, but I also understand FFG requiring them in tournaments.

this same model of business has been in use for years in X-wing miniatures

the solutions are still the same (proxy in casual play, buy if you want to play at ffg sanctioned events)

in casual play with friendlies, it is a complete non-issue. At competitive events, you ca always borrow from your buddies.

If FFG would make a list building app similar to privateer press's for warmahordes they could just charge a few bucks to unlock each waves card packs.

Yeah don't know why they just don't bring out upgrade card packs. I ordered the wave 1 VSD boxset and I did wonder in future would I even field 2 VSD's but knowing there will be the extra upgrade cards and I worked out a deal with my local store owner I went ahead and purchased it.

But seeing as x-wing doesn't have a upgrade card pack i doubt armada will either.

They aren't going to do it, and honestly you might not like it if they did. It would likely fairly pricey for just a couple of cards.

i doubled the cost of wave 1 and core to get that number. and based on my experience with x-wing i did buy ships just for a select few upgrade cards its part of the reason i got out honestly.

I see everyones point. I do plan to play semi-competitively and support the local meta and LGSs in growing the community in the North East. So it is a bit of a money thing if X upgrade is an "auto-include"

This is probably more of an issue for wave 2 and beyond honestly, and wave 2 is all new stuff so your getting 2 of everything anyway if your quassi-competitive.

People have already started selling the single cards for cheap.

I think your solution would be bad for business. I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but FFG is out for profit...since, you know, they are a business. Which is not a bad thing at all! It just so happens that we get to benefit from their pursuit of profit because the product they bring to market is so desireable for our hobbies. I'll never understand the "us vs them" price war mentality. As it stands, FFG is one of the few game companies out there that have a good business model (a model which maximizes customer satisfaction and profit growth! although, I'm not aware of what their margins are, hopefully something like 60%).

I know that FFG isn't going to publish decks for X-Wing but I hope this isn't the case here. The models are so much more expensive and purchasing them for a card like Engineering Team is kind of rough.

One thing that hasn't been mentioned is that cards that are particularly popular, as demonstrated in X-wing, often have more than one copy included in a given expansion pack, even if the included ship can only use one of them. That's not the case for all of them, to be sure, but non-unique cards have a better chance of being duplicated. Granted, you still need to by the expansion to get even one of them.

I think your solution would be bad for business. I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but FFG is out for profit...since, you know, they are a business. Which is not a bad thing at all! It just so happens that we get to benefit from their pursuit of profit because the product they bring to market is so desireable for our hobbies. I'll never understand the "us vs them" price war mentality. As it stands, FFG is one of the few game companies out there that have a good business model (a model which maximizes customer satisfaction and profit growth! although, I'm not aware of what their margins are, hopefully something like 60%).

Without crunching numbers I am not sure its bad for business. Like if 3 people decide not to get the game due to how the expacs work with upgrades thats potentially a lot of money per year lost. Wave 1 + core is $290 (guess i am number crunching). I would bet most people get 2 gladiators, 2 squadron packs, and 2 assault frigates. Core and wave 1 just went to $410 investment. Wave 2 is $160 at one of each. If you get 2 of everything buy the scum squadrons you are talking $300. Thats $710 full retail per person by end of wave 2. If they only buy 1 faction its easy to say it will roughly be (710 - 100 (core) then divide by 2 (factions), add 10 (half of scum pack assuming they dont split it) is still $415.

Is losing out on $415 full retail worth not making an upgrade deck you could sell for $25 (easy) and that prolly has more profit margin than a $25 ship blister?

I guess thats my arguement.

One thing that hasn't been mentioned is that cards that are particularly popular, as demonstrated in X-wing, often have more than one copy included in a given expansion pack, even if the included ship can only use one of them. That's not the case for all of them, to be sure, but non-unique cards have a better chance of being duplicated. Granted, you still need to by the expansion to get even one of them.

this more specifically seems to be applied to "fix" cards rather than "popular" onces

imperial aces came with multiples PTLs to fix the fact that they weren't in the Base Tie/in pack

most wanted came out with multiple refits, titles, and b/e mods

not sure why the transport came with 3 flechettes...maybe cause the astros were all unique?

the raider's coming with four Tie/x1s

all to accommodate for your pre-existing ships

the only other popular double is the Yt-1300's two engine upgrades (Still currently the only way to get those things)

Of course, those packs you named are all the ones that I remember ending up with a fistful of cards in we will have a better sense when people start cracking open their expansion packs. My standard with my FLGS is I'm signed up for "one of everything" and then I'll decide on which extras to get.

Well except the mc30... I'll want more of those...

One thing that hasn't been mentioned is that cards that are particularly popular, as demonstrated in X-wing, often have more than one copy included in a given expansion pack, even if the included ship can only use one of them. That's not the case for all of them, to be sure, but non-unique cards have a better chance of being duplicated. Granted, you still need to by the expansion to get even one of them.

this more specifically seems to be applied to "fix" cards rather than "popular" onces

imperial aces came with multiples PTLs to fix the fact that they weren't in the Base Tie/in pack

most wanted came out with multiple refits, titles, and b/e mods

not sure why the transport came with 3 flechettes...maybe cause the astros were all unique?

the raider's coming with four Tie/x1s

all to accommodate for your pre-existing ships

the only other popular double is the Yt-1300's two engine upgrades (Still currently the only way to get those things)

I don't know if using a $100 expansion like the Raider is a good example. Don't get me wrong I like the Raider and want an Imperial Epic. But for people that have two TIE Advanced fighters and a small collection for 100 point X-Wing games the Raider is a little hard to swallow just to make the TIE Advanced a better play.

Telling someone to go to Third Party markets or print/proxy the cards at home is by its very definition is going around a system which you would only do if it isn't working well or efficiently enough for you.

P.S. I still think the Raider is cool.

P.S. What is wrong with a system that sells all of the necessary components and cards to go along with it separately; then you purchase the ship models you wish to field. How is that not profitable?

P.S. What is wrong with a system that sells all of the necessary components and cards to go along with it separately; then you purchase the ship models you wish to field. How is that not profitable?

Because FFG would be competing with themselves.