Antigoth said:

Somebody's still bitter I 2-0'd your Air Base deck. Maybe if you listened to Archimedes and RAN A COUNTER TO IRA-SPINTA you wouldn't have had your staging area eaten-up so mercilessly? =/

But hey, you want some reason for banning, even though I've already given it, so let's begin...

1. It has 2 difficulty. For what it does, it should be like, a 4 or 5, and not roll a 5 check.
2. Doesn't the static make the SSS loop even more broken? Or at least potent? The Static, IIRC (because I don't own the card), allows you to play any symbol-specific ability as if they had the symbol, yes? Now, while that isn't broken in and of itself, the potential is there, especially for the SSS Loop, which means any All/Life/Water character can use it due to Path.
3. The R is too easy draw. When you play a symbol-specific ability, you draw 1 card. Now, I know there are very few (2 Zi Mei cards, SSS Loop, Wipe the Floor, etc), but again, free draw? Dude, no. Relentless has somewhat of a cost. Fatherly Love has TOO much of a cost. It should at least require the committing of a foundation.
4. The E Commit is the most broken part of the card, and gives a kill condition TO EVERYBODY! Kills should exist IN THE SYMBOL, not in the Infinite-laden Path of the Master.

As I've said repeatedly, RARELY is committing a card a cost, because you're not LOSING anything. Not momentum, no destroying cards, RFGing anything, you're just temporarily shifting a card from vertical to horizontal, only to be readied next turn.

Still, that doesn't mean any card with the cost of commit is broken or undercosted, but in the case of Path of the Master, just turning a card like that sideways is not nearly enough.

+X damage for each resource symbol in your card pool shared with your character. Why run Curse of the Ancient Mariner when the Powerful isn't even as good as Path of the Master. Ivy's spot in the mid to high tier is almost solely due to Path.

It's a HUGE damage pump that I wouldn't even say "you have to skillfully taylor into your deck." There's hardly any "skillful tayloring" involved.

Like I said, a kill condition should exist SOLELY within the attack. Support cards are exactly that: SUPPORT. Path isn't support; it IS a kill waiting to happen.

Plus, once again, it has Infinite, meaning anybody can run it, and almost everybody does.

...Well, if the pump is the problem, the fix is relatively simple: issue a ruling that caps it to the number of symbols shared with your character (aka +3 as a max, unless you run Siegfried* 's stuff). That should remedy it nicely, and it's still worth running (2/5 asset, has a block, gives out +3 damage, and has some sweet draw? Sign me up).

LordAggro said:

It's not just the damage pump. It's the whole card.

For the People that say that the pump usually doesn't get to high...WHO CARES? Even + 6 is too much. A simple Commit for + 6 damage? Sign me up plz! Why WOULDN'T you run this card? it should be in any and every deck. Yes there are answers. There is always answers. It doesn't make the card any less insane. And the fact that it is an infinity card is the worst part. I know FFG is problably not going to do anything about it not because they don't think anything is wrong with it but because it was an exclusive promo and people will get mad that they went to this event for nothing. I think they should just rotate it to legacy not ban it.

ShadowDragon said:

I'm not picking sides, but adding to this wealtth of information (thanks Shadowdragon), All and Void have acess to Controller of Souls, which doesn't destroy but certainly helps manage PotM's damage pump.

- dut

MarcoPulleaux said:

Funny stuff, I laugh. I'm pretty sure Antigoth had enhance negation in that deck... So unless you want him to run one of the 2 other cards that 'counter's spinta' you aren't really telling him to address anything that he hasn't already.

In any case Shinji, I also read your argument for a ban, and although some of your opinions hold water, the majority of them show a lot of effort on your part, and to paint an asset card that you don't own as a problem. Commit isn't a cost? wtf? This is coming from the guy who told me spinta didn't have a cost... You know nothing about pricing - plain and simple.

Also, giving a damage pump of 1-16 around turn 3/4, and less earlier in the game (barring Ivy and King), isn't a kill condition. If all it took was a strong damage pump to 'kill' then every character would already have countless 'kill' conditions. PotM is still support, not the be all and end all of a game.

- dut

Edit: If anything, and in line with what Failed2k pointed out, we should be looking moreso at King's ability, and perhaps discuss it's need to be an early form or have a control check made...

everyones saying that it will tone down once there is more characters and more support so that symbols will spread out im using 2 different characters support and a reprinted card in seigfried and i still got +10 damage out of path on my second turn just yesterday.....

Yes path is dumb but there are ways around it and its just part of the game if you didnt have to build your decks to play around other cards whats stopping this game from turning into mindless spamming of attacks not actually having to think or do anything else in the game. I want this to be an interactive card game and not whos got the better damage and speed bumps

If you ban path another card will just come up and everyone will scream for it to be banned so why bother let the game be played the way its played and deal thats what id say

Da_ghetto_gamer said:

Well, Path is too degenerate in too many situations. Plus, it has infinity on it. I downright hate infinity. I always have. It needs to go poofs.

Ivy, with another foundation instead of path can draw an extra 2 cards which can lead into more cards, which over time can equate more damage that Path.

Christie, with another foundation instead of path, can pass more checks on her loop which will already win her the game.

Zimei, with another foundation instead of path, can fully multiple her Fury or support it and has added security against a failed check.

King would seriously be the only character in the game right now that scares me a bit with POTM, and even at that not enough to matter considering almost any character in the game right now can turn 2-3 any other character.

The card should be watched. I'll 100% say that. But the format JUST CHANGED. TEKKEN JUST HAPPENED. Give people time to open their packs.

Protoaddict said:

Honestly, the SSS loop doesn't win the game. The extra foundation would be completely useless (owait I can pass another check... maybe.) I've played it today (yeah, I already have a playset of Samba, so what?) and yeah - the loop is too unreliable as far as a kill condition is concerned. With PotM, you can draw into it from the second S to infinity, provided you can pass checks. Fortunately, you can't tutor for For the Money, or else it would be "I can draw until I have the card I want, or I kill you, whichever occurs first.

Still, SSS loop/PotM, while it doesn't win games, should be watched, because I'm pretty sure that in two sets time, something comes out that completely breaks it. The card draw alone doesn't win it, but you don't really need it, all you need is SSS loop until satisfied, Graceful Style and PotM E.

I've resisted using it in Lu Chen so far. Wrath of Heaven is completely goddamn impossible to block.

Tagrineth said:

Face down cards in card pools everywhere!

Tagrineth said:

You mean your not running ...And When To Fight as anti-tech? I mean, it is an obvious include in any deck, because it counters one power card.

-Tinman

Tinman said:

It's not just Wrath itself. Lu Chen's Palm Strike is also madness when used for the combo, doubly so with his asset and ShadoWar.

dutpotd said:

Dude...why do you ALWAYS feel the need to address MY posts? =/

Ira-Spinta doesn't have a cost.

There's also the fun fact that, excluding one of Hilde's attacks, Gut Drill and maybe some others from Tekken, every Reversal in the game came out of Lu Chen's support and shares 3 symbols. 12M21 om nom nom nom...

Not sure what you're getting at Waffle, but yeah, Reversals aren't a very dominant archetype (unless you're Astrid lol). I really really want to build Lu Chen, but his reversals are rather unwhelming =/.

MarcoPulleaux said:

They're OK imo, Leaping Snap Kick is low-diff and forces some progressive difficulty on them, Chi Disruptor is a free attack after blocking, and Palm Strike is a stupid speed pump.

To the OP...

...

...something breaks Christie!? DECKLIST! All I could figure out was with Ivy things... but I am yet to build a decent Christie as of yet.

I think we will see more asset destruction in the future. I don't see it as much of an issue as I once did. The thing is that this makes disruption characters more valuable and all offense characters will have to slug harder and faster to beat the card.

guitalex2008 said:

Step 1 : Play Path of the Mater

Step 2 : Play SSS loop, R Path of the Master

Step 3 : ????

Step 4 : Way too much card draw.

MarcoPulleaux said:

for the same reason that your always crying for things to be banned, he wants to share his opinion . oh and is someone grumpy that they missed top 8 at worlds by 1 SOS point, or did you do worse with old mc' order point and click?

The only time that I had problems with PotM was against an earth Huitzl and all the symbol abilities that it allowed him, but it was delt with, and in standard theres no problem with PotM. since you were whining about not having any, how about you send me a playset of minuette dance or knight breaker, I'll send you a playset of PotM, then you will have some.

I like the idea of starting off with Evil Sparrow then going to Samba and looping from there, just so you get an extra draw out of it (Samba's combo) without having to make any harder control checks.

I always thought that it was a mistake on giving out Path of the Master ONLY at the Path of the Master event in Minnesota. They really dropped the ball there. Seriously, half of the community is college kids, and many people couldn't go out because it was in the middle of their semester. That's the reason why Tapout couldn't go to POTM. And they didn't even do a redemption event for the people who had patches but couldn't go.

Also, the card having really good abilities doesn't help either. I read the deckbuilding forums all the time and when somebody posts up Ivy or Zi Mei or some other POTM abuser, a lot of people suggest:

"Hey, put in some Path of the Masters. They'd help your deck out a lot."
"Okay! Where do I get them?"
"Oh... you had to be at an event in Minnesota."
"... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ..."

Some UFSers don't even live in the US or the UK.

Poor card accessibility = top reason for failed CCGs

I don't think it should be banned. The card does indeed promote everything the game leans towards. However, it should be circulated more, such as being put in prize support. I don't have much of a problem with cards being event-exclusives, AS LONG as they are reprinted or circulated not too long after the event, or made easier to obtain somehow.

Shaneth said:

In North America Jon Herr and Jeremy Ray have all the remaing copies of the card.

I don't remember off the top of my head who won the UK Event.