I would say that was a good fix, I found you got too many skills too quickly and became over specialized. Anywho, as for past 5k mark I imagine RT crew still have an advantage as long as they are never alone. Seeing as each character assists the group with his or her special buff. So group on grop I would place favor on RT despite having fewer skills.

DocIII said:

DocIII said:

You've got to bear in mind the recommended XP per session in RT is 500, while its 100 or 200 in DH (I forget which). That balances a lot of the costs.

This being said, I don't think they're terribly compatible. A Dark Heresy character will peak in effectiveness before a Rogue Trader character, but will also run out of worthwhile things to buy much sooner too. Without Ascension, I don't know if I would cross them over.

RocketPropelledGrenade said:

I would agree with that sentiment, but I also assume FFG was looking ahead to Ascension when they designed the compatibility.

aethel said:

Of course. I was in no way saying I think it won't be possible to make it work. Just that it might not right now.

Huh... makes me wonder if there is going to be a sort of conversion system between the two games.

There are already a couple of sidebars in RT discussing just that, conversion between the two and using DH characters in RT and vice versa. The base party line seems to be: "they're perfectly compatible just plug and play." None of which addresses the concern about scaling due to the same talents/skills having drastically different costs.

TS Luikart said:

Any progress or movement on this TS? I'd really like to know as I'll be mixing a group of current DHers with RTers.

Thanks,

-Smaggs

The answer to the exp queation might be that you give the DH characters the amount you should have given a DH group and then give the RT characters a little more for the same bit, if the talents and skills are more expensive for them then that could be a solution, or let the RT characters start out with the advantage and then have the DH ones catch up?

There are a couple of issues when using a DH character in a RT game.

One- it roughly costs 4,100-4,300 xp to reach the same level of skills and abilities as a starting RT. However, with that your DH character will have reached several second and third ranked skills and talents. Those same skills and talents are not accessible to your RT until rank two (or three).

Two- Remember, your RT starts off with Universal training in weapon classes. A DH character will spend alot of xp and time to be fully trained in say, all basic weapons.

Three- the RT character gets a free advance, and still can get four more. At maximum xp, he will always have +5% on a DH character. A DH character will need to spend nearly 2,500 xp just to equal in stats of the starting RT character. As was mentioned before, the peak of the DH character will come much sooner because of this. The RT character will start on a higher level, then peak with better numbers... though the same skills/talents.

Four- As always consult your local friend GM for advice. I think that as the RT book become widely available, the issue of joining to the characters will become less and less, as older DH character will retire from service, to be replaced by fresher models.

I dont want to create an extra post for this little question almost fits into this topic : Are the Forsaken bounty characters "high-rolled" or "normal" regarding their stats and equipment. They just seem to be quite imbalanced :/ While the Arch-militant kills lots of baddies with her sacred boltgun, the guy with the crappy shotgun simply sux My question is if the preview chars are realistic RT characters of are they better/worse than normal lvl1 guys. Thx

Well, if one of those design diaries has any truth, I can't understand why all of the characters aren't just armed with, say, a bolt/plasma gun/pistol, power sword/glove and power armour if Profit is so effective!?

...because, sadly, I reckon thats what my players will end up doing as soon as is humanly possible, and then where's the challenge when Orks (who look to be one of the main protagonists in RT) can't even hurt you if they're not Mega Armoured Nobs with Powerclaws!

Space Monkey said:

Because exotic weapons aren't just expensive, they're hard to find and operating a huge ship is expensive. You're not going to find plasma guns on Backwoodia VI and you have only so much time to spend on Hivemaxia V and a lot of that will be mission related. Also shotguns+explosive ammo=nasty.

Bah humbug!

It's not as if you have to wait for the next Transport to come along. You OWN your own ship, just fly to Imperial Space, tool up and fly back! Yes it may take months, but what's stopping them when, firstly, humans live almost twice as long in the future, and also, being an RP game, those months can pass in the blink of an eye in real time.

Space Monkey said:

But those are months during which you're spending money, rather than making it... running a ship is expensive, even if you own it. There are hundreds of thousands of menials to feed, tithes and shares of profit to the Adeptus Mechanicus (without whom your ship would not be maintained), Adeptus Astra Telepathica (without whom you cannot communicate over long distances), and the particular House of the Navis Nobilite with whom you deal (without whom you would not be able to travel between the stars freely). The Administratum and local authorities have their taxes, there are munitionsmiths to pay to stock your weapons batteries and replace the barrels of your lances, stevedores to hire to unload thousands of tonnes of cargo...

Owning a starship that displaces millions or billions of tonnes is not a cheap matter.

Beyond that, many potent and expensive items in the Imperium cannot simply be bought 'off the shelf', even for such mighty and powerful beings as Inquisitors and Rogue Traders - items like power armour are custom-made for individuals or handed down through generations of Imperial servants and altered with every one of those generations, and while a power sword may not inherently have quite the same uniqueness about it, they're still not commonplace and are often earmarked for specific individuals, bearing as they do a particular cultural significance as symbols of office. As powerful as an individual Rogue Trader may be, he cannot waltz around the Imperium taking whatever he pleases, whenever he pleases, for his power is to that of the Imperium as a conscripted soldier is to a battleship of the Imperial Navy - meagre and unimpressive.

And besides, what self-respecting Rogue Trader would be seen carrying around a common-or-garden power sword and Munitorum-issue bolt pistol, when he could be wielding the blade carried into battle by Lord-Commissar Eorith Qan during the final battle of the Rephanic Crusades, with which he single-handedly slew the Ork Warlord Grugnash Headstompa, and a Bolt Pistol hand- and mechadendrite-crafted by Magos Zephraim Aloris Theta-Six-One-Six of Mars before his tragic death, known to be one of only six in all existence and perhaps the finest example of that craft anywhere in the Imperium?

N0-1_H3r3 said:

I would point out that the above is incorrect. It goes out of its way in the Rogue Trader book to point out that you are one of the most powerful individuals in Imperial space. A rogue trader's Writ gives him the equivalent rank as a Lord General of the Imperial Guard, an Inquisitor, or Planetary Governer. Thats why they have such amazing starting gear.

Madadh said:

A Rogue Trader has immense wealth and status, but that doesn't entitle him to take whatever he wants from an Imperial World. As the smackdown of the Rogue Trader fleet by the Imperial Navy in the novel "Legacy" indicates, Rogue Traders aren't necessarily liked by other Imperial Authorities. If you piss off the Arch-Magos of Forgeworldia V, you might be getting a taste of death by orbital defense satellites. A Rogue Trader is power, but not omnipotent nor are his actions free of negative consequences.

On the other hand, his bank balance (when he's flush) is immense as is his status. Assuming you have the time and the object is available, all sorts of treasures and exotica can be acquired, from weapons to clothes to statuettes for a trophy room if you can find a reasonably friendly seller.

Cynical Cat said:

And most people will become friendly if offered enough money (or other items of value).

Madadh said:

A Lord General or Imperial Commander/Planetary Governor, perhaps, but not an Inquisitor. The only people who have as much authority as Inquisitors are other Inquisitors, because their authority is literally limitless. No authority may bind an Inquisitor, nor law impede him, for he is the Left Hand of the Emperor, answerable to none but the Immortal Lord of All Mankind.

But even so, to be an Imperial Commander is to be the ruler of one world amongst a million, and still subject to the whims of many other people. To be a Lord-General in the Imperial Guard is to command only a single army group amongst millions and still be beholden to the needs of the Imperial Navy for transport between worlds. Such men are expendable and easily replaced, their power great only compared to those beneath them.

A Rogue Trader's power comes from his freedom to move around and beyond the Imperium, and the fact that beyond the fringes of the Imperium, its laws no longer apply. His actual power within the Imperium itself comes from the particular nature of his Warrant of Trade (with some rare examples being gifts from the Emperor during the Great Crusades, passed down through the generations). A Rogue Trader still cannot do anything he wants, because no matter how big and important he thinks he is, there are still those further up the food chain than he. Amongst other things, the Imperial Navy is still a greater military force than any Rogue Trader

N0-1_H3r3 said:

It depends entirely on the Rogue Trader and his origins. For some, who have only become a Rogue Trader as part of the family business, that might be true to a greater or lesser degree, depending on said familiy's status and powerbase. For some however, this is emphatically incorrect.

For example, Jan Van Yastobaal, from the original 40k Rogue Trader book, was formerly a High Lord of Terra who went to Rogue Trading in his advancing years because he didn't want to retire and wanted to return to a life of adventure and action. There are also many cases where an extremely powerful individual is given a trade warrant simply to get them as far away from the seat of power as possible so they can't stir up trouble, including such influential beings as would be High Lords, Sector Commanders, overly energetic Inquisitors and even the occasional Space Marine Commander.

So it really varies on a case by case basis, but if you want a Rogue Trader =I= who brings the light of the Emperor to the outer darkenss, brings back treasures for the Emperor's glory, and smites would be threats before they can grow into actual threats to the Imperium, with all the authourity that entails, it is perfectly feasible if the GM allows it...

N0-1_H3r3 said:

Actually depending on the Rougue Trader they may be an equivalent. The Rougue Trader Arkadius (last name and not sure if its spelt right) in Star of Damocles says at one point that he had the right to go in to the present of pretty much any one armed and do what he wanted and that even a Space Marine Chapter Master or Lord Inquistor would have to ask hom nicely for favours (I'm sorry I can't remember the name or exact quote). He also ends up being one of the main power bases in the Damoclese Gulf Crusade although admitedly some of that is not cannon (the Tau use Custodians etc. when the ships were developed in response to Imperial ships being better able to fight than the Tau's)

I also think that as one of the above posts said you may be able to get Power Armour/Power Fist/Psycannons etc. but it wqould depend on your location in the Imperium, different factions feelings towards you and how culturally signifficant the item is to the culture. For instance in the Gaunts Ghosts stories th whole of the Tanith First have one Power Sword (The Sword of Hieronomo Sondar) and one Plasma Pistol (Commisar Harks). but it all depends on how you'd portray the Imperium as although in the BL books these pieces of equipment are rare when you play 40k you could have every veteren sargent in an Imperial Guard army equiped with Power Weapon and Plasma Pistol if you wanted.

I'd take it that your Rougue Trader could quite easily have x number of rare weapons but I would have thought he would use most of it for cermony or only when the occasion required it due to repairs and running costs. I wouldn't see Rougue Trader who ever turning up in his masrter crafted power armour and with his hierloom power sword to a bar for a drink and to try and get some gossip.

I'd also say that Orks would still be quite worrying to a band even tooled up (hopefully depending on rules) because there as in the 0k game they are as tough as a Space Marine and even a group of boys can mess up a special character.

Sorry if the post is rambly and a bit long.

Cadarnofjeal said:

Even if the Orks aren't a threat in small numbers, aren't the Orks known for showing up in huge numbers ?

Cadarnofjeal said:

Politics and circumstances. Technically, any Inquisitor can march into the Forge-Palace of the Fabricator General on Mars and demand a Titan Legion or six be placed at his disposal, or set foot on Macragge and personally insist that the Ultramarines chapter do his bidding... but in practical terms, the former will see him reduced to a charred and irradiated corpse by several Maniples of elite Skitarii, and the latter will see him either blasted apart by bolter fire or cut into tiny pieces by power weapons as Marneus Calgar's honour guard step in to cut him down.

Theoretical power is never the same as practical power, and that goes both ways. Outside of the Imperium, a Rogue Trader has limitless freedom and ultimate authority aboard his ships. Inside the Imperium, his power is only as great as his wealth, reputation and contacts (much like anyone else). Being a Rogue Trader in and of itself grants no specific authority over the servants of the Imperium save that granted by his wealth and the favours he can call in.

N0-1_H3r3 said:

I agree I could imagine though that a lot of the power in the imperium is built upon circumstance and a complex political web. I supose it all comes down to how you personally would see the situation and the Rogue Trader and the person he's interacting with.