Tagrineth said:

Remember when Cutting Edge, that monster of a jank set came out? Remember the absolute crap the majority of the set is beyond all teh cards that got banned? Big sets do not equil a good enviroment/healthy game.

As for the rotation... I'm kinda pissed this wasn't posted on the forums by Steve if it is true. SotGs NEED to be on the forums cause not all of us are able to go to GenCon

As much as I am going to hate for this to happen, this really does need to happen for the game. Its going to put everybody on an even playing field, and its going to bring more interest in the new sets. But if they do this, I think they need to release more than one set at a time.

This had better not be true. This is just ridiculous, we're just going to end up in the same situation as before, with certain cards dominating and the now miniscule character base leading to *shochhorror* a few characters being better that others.

I'm already seriously hacked off at the moment for certain FFG-based reasons I won't go into right now, but all we're going to be in is a new snoresville environment where the same stuff gets played over and over again.

Now, usually I'm upbeat and find something good in a situation, but this is just too quick.

I think that the whole this is better for the game stuff is bull crap. The only reason FFG is doing this is so that people have to buy the cards in the new set and they make more money. Its the same reason that they waited so long to ban/errat cards like lord and felie spike, so that people will have a chance to buy then befor FFG makes them worthless. There are not nearly enough cards out to make this switch either, come on 3 freaken packs, thats just retarted. There is a reason that mini block is not played on a big level, its fun every now and then, but it can't support an entier trading card game. Also, bigger sets just means more crap cards thrown in, so that cards that are actually worth something are harder to get, which means FFG can jack up the prices on those cards. This is way to soon for a rotation, normaly we have a little more than a year to start getting new cards be for rotation, but now the only way most player are going to be able to make standar decks is if they fork out the money to get the new stuff. That might be fine for the people who can afford it or were able to already trade for the 5 star stuff they wanted, but this just stafts most of us. On top of that, because of the limited play environment everyone will be trying to make the same decks, not because there tire 1, because they will be the only playable decks that exist, which will make it even harder to get good cards. I for one think this is a horrable decicion, and if my scout decideds to enforce this rotation I'll probalbly just quit, along with alot of other player, becuase I don't have enough 5 star to trade for a new 5 star exclusive deck, and I don't want to wast any more money on a game that is just going to make my cards almost worthless with two weeks notice.

Yoko Charming Fox said:

lololololol

also, come back when you've learned proper paragraph spacing.

im a little ticked about this ( i started in 4) while im gonna get screwed cause I really didnt like Soul calibur or shadow war but I guess I'll have to conform and start buying them. I knew that set 4 was gonna get cycled out eventually but I was kinda hoping after a few sets of 5 have come out. What I hate that I'm not gonna be able to play my favorite characters, Dan, leona, terry etc.. for awhile though I'am happy atleast paul is in the new set so I dont have to use a crappy shadow war character.

But I will agree this is for the best there were alot of cards in set 4 that were just stupid like blood runs true for example. So I'm about 50/50 on this.

Yoko Charming Fox said:

First, FFG has no control over the secondary market, to them every card is worth something like $.02. Second, I recomend that you try out mini-block before quitting. Every char is playable, yes, even Cervantez.. The other week we were discussing which symbol will be the best for mini--- well I gues standard--- and we each came up with something different. The chars all play differently and pretty close to thier ingame versions. Astaroth is slow as hell but will DESTROY you if he connects, Cervantez can spam like a champ, as can Ivy in her own way.

bloodocean said:

Cervantes sets up his kill methodically. Especially with Shadow Flare.

I actually feel that this rotation is good for the game but it is actually too short a notice (2 weeks) and there is not enough cards (3 sets) to support the game as of right now!
Our playgroup is dying due to the bans earlier and this could be the death blow lol!

I just got off the phone with folks from Gen Con. It's official. I'm not going to lie. I'm not very happy about this. I think it is wrong to do this on such short notice. I am very glad I unloaded my cards a few weeks ago. It's too bad everyone's $120 sets of BRT won't be worth anything tomorrow. Now there are less characters to choose from. We now have no Street Fighter, no Darkstalkers, no KoF2006, no Samurai Showdown, and no Soul Calibur III.

I do think this is for the good of the game, but it was done the wrong way. Oh well, at least at this rate we'll have one set for block 6 in April!!!

Yoko Charming Fox said:

FYI, Darkstalkers:Realm of Midnight has been completely sold out since less than 6 months after its launch. In other words, the set's revenue to the parent company maxed out like 6 months before Makai & Spike got banned. Secondary market sales don't affect STG/FFG in the slightest.

Yoko Charming Fox said:

No, it's more because miniblock was only recently created, and there hasn't been any chance to schedule any miniblock tournaments and set up support for them yet. The majour tournaments before worlds have been Nationals/Regionals that were scheduled and planned out long before Miniblock was made.

Yoko Charming Fox said:

Bigger sets, but only one set instead of two. So instead of two 99 card sets totaling 198 cards, it'll be one set with closer to maybe 150 or so cards (not official, just giving you an idea...)

Also, again, FFG has absolutely no control over the secondary market, and secondary market sales are basically irrelevant to them. If you buy a Knight Breaker for $40, that money doesn't go back to FFG in any way, it goes to the dude who sold the KB to you. They may have bought packs to pull said KB, but FFG didn't leave a note in the booster saying "This is a $40 card", that's just where the market took it.

Yoko Charming Fox said:

Normally yes we have a year to get new cards, but this game is already in an extremely bad state because of the horrible Standard/Block 3 format, with far too many problematic cards spread out over sets 8-11 that can't be dealt with so easily.

Also, just about every character in set 12 is viable in miniblock, even Cervantes as was previously mentioned. That's 16 different viable decks, with another handful of characters coming in Tekken as well as a new wave of promo characters coming soon. Yeah, the format's going to be small, but how is that different from the current Standard? Everything in Standard right now is a bunch of carbon copies of a handful of overpowered strategies that shut out the more creative decks, as well as shutting out the aggro decks this game NEEDS to survive. Without aggro decks, this game just doesn't work.

Also, TBH it wouldnt' make that much difference if the rotation was announced to happen, say, 2 months from now versus 2 weeks... there are no more tournaments until the next tournament season starts, which is at least 3 months from now. The secondary market is going to die down for a while after Worlds regardless - it ALWAYS does - so even if this was given as a more 'advance' announcement, it wouldn't make a lick of difference.

Tagrineth said:

Yep. From Worlds to February is ALWAYS dead with the exception of the UK Nationals.

Tagrineth said:

Except that people who don't play Legacy (like me) would have time to get rid of their block 3 cards while they were worth at least half of normal price. Prices do die down after GenCon but that’s because every time before this year everything rotated out in 5 months latter instead of 8 month like it is this year (or was).

I usually sold my stuff that was rotating after GenCon to get some extra cash to buy new sets, now my cards are worthless.

Early rotation pros:

+ Miniblock is a lot more fun than standard, so making miniblock standard can't be bad.

+ Encourages purchasing or Tekken

+ Rewards purchasing of Shadowar and SCIV01

+ Blood Runs True, Ira-Spinta, Feline Spike, Reanimated, Psycho Style, Chinese Boxing, Program Malfunction, The Gorgeous Team, Seal of Cessation, Amy's Assistance, Mysterious Stance, Make a Difference and many other cards that have been complained about will be GONE.

Cons:

- Your old cards won't work?

- You spent too much money getting pieces of cardboard that are as effective as the material they are printed on right about now

- Blood Runs True, Ira-Spinta, Feline Spike, Reanimated, Psycho Style, Chinese Boxing, Program Malfunction, The Gorgeous Team, Seal of Cessation, Amy's Assistance, Mysterious Stance, Make a Difference and many other cards that you use will be GONE.

even though tekken is boring, really really boring.

other than Calgary has NOT been able to get SC4 since we got our preorders, and our stores HAVE been trying, while coolstuffinc and every other area has boxes and tons of product for it. I just got off the phone with the owner of the main store I play at and was told that he was told it was out of print.

and people will just start crying and complaining about new cards so nothing will change.

JDub said:

not like everyone NEVER dropped the standard block after worlds before... but I'll give you $5.00 for all the stuff that you have that I need to fill out sets, so they are not worthless, they are worth $5.00 for a bunch of 'em.

I'm in the same boat as NintendoMan and several others.

This is good for the game: it's a lot more like Sets 1 and 2 (which us old guys remember fondly), but with (believe it or not) much clearer wordings, rules, etc., and an even more balanced, exciting format.

But it is not enough notice . This lack of advance communication (about what prize support will be for non-winners of top tournaments, about when sets will come out, about when new Organized Play schemes will kick in, about when rotation will happen) is perhaps the one thing that irritates me most about FFG's handling of UFS.

I suspect that we will be playing Block 3 or Legacy maybe 2-out-of-4 tournaments a month for a while, maybe 3-out-of-4.

Believe it or not, I actually LOVE current Block 3 (post July bannings). SoCal Regionals was a ton of fun. Our local tournaments have been a ton of fun. This past Tuesday we had two different people running Promo Lillith decks. I was running Huitzil theme deck (and I won a game!). There was a Zi Mei or two (both playing completely differently), and an Astrid. I know people complain a lot about the Earth stall and the foundation wars, but there's a heckofa lot of fun to have.

I think the worst part of the decision is that a lot of everybody's favorite characters won't be legal.

Perhaps they could do a delayed rotation for characters?

One of our new players got into the game in part because he could play as Lillith. He's considering Dhalsim strongly for his alternate, and just came up with a really interesting deck concept for the yoga master. I don't want to deprive him of that. Sure he can borrow my decks whenever he wants, but he's the kind of guy who plays to be effective, and my decks probably won't cut it.

I support the emphasis on mini-block, but I would have done it by offering special promo cards for mini-block format, rather than just shifting everything to mini-block.

ARMed_PIrate said:

Does it truly surprise you?

Surprise? No. Disappoint? Yes.

I like the idea of delaying character rotation again, but it'd mean another several months of Promo Zi Mei and such, y'know, characters that kinda outclass many block 4 characters. :X

I am so glad I did not buy the fight night pack. That would have pissed me off after reading this. The problem is that they made this announcement and didn't think of how many people they have mislead over the past 2 months getting rid of old product that was legal but in a very short time wasn't going to be legal. Lets look at the bonuses of having a Tekken prerelease. Buying 6 boxes nets you a lot of 4 star cards for free. If you are a retailer you are not going give those cards away you are going to sell them. Now that benifit is gone. No one is going to buy product that can't be played. This doesn't effect me much because I'm new and I'm glad I didn't get to deep in buying 4 star stuff. But man I will say it does rub me wrong in how they have promoted old product knowing this option was on the table.

I doubt they had this planned at all when they did all the Fight Night stuff.

I can't believe this is seriously happening, as I was about to make a surprise trip to UK nationals with a deck that I had already built according to the basic assumption that I would get to play with the cards that are tournament legal right now... Good thing I didn't waste +$800 bucks on a ticket to the UK.... At least I got a month's warning...

I understand why people would be upset over this... but it seems like it's probably better for the game... in the long run if the game can handle the potential backlash.... too many set backs are putting a strain to this game.

Thats the issue. They should have weighed that before making this decission. They should have at least waited for more results of mini block or even requiring mini block to be 2 tournaments a month. But that in of itself is what lead to the demise of heroclix when wizkids took to much control in what was being played. My consumer confidence gets lowered in a game company that fails to think ahead and look at their current promotions and see how their decission effects their business image. I have the most to gain from this decession but how it is put into practice i have a problem with just due to the fact they didn't think about their current promotions. I was trying to get some guys together to try to get enough money to sponser a tekken prerelease just so we can get all the free cool stuff, but if its worthless why try.

Just a side note were can i see the promo shadowar characters. I don't see them on twoheaded dragon.

bloodocean said:

bloodocean said:

I when to far earlyer with my accusations that FFG was just doing this for the money. Its just that this and other decitions they have made resently have really up set me, so I ended up saying some stuff without thinking about it, sorry

I also understand that FFG dose not control the secondary market, and ther for makes no more money selling a Knight Breaker than it dose a $.50 common, but by allowing powerfull cards to stay in rotation instead of banning them they encorage the buying a packs, and by increasing the rarity of cards they can increases the number of packs sold. Which can increase their revenue, that's all that I was trying to say.

Whether or not this rotation is good for the game it will force many player who want to stay in the game to buy cards from the new set, as it will be hard to trade 4 star cards for 5 star cards.

The fact that most of my cards just greatly decreased in value also upsets me. I don't doubt that there value decreases after worlds regardless, because there are no more big tornaments, but my play group never cared about that, and would still trade the same amount for cards up until a month or two before they rotated.

As for miniblock I honestly didn't know that it just came around recently, although the fack that I had never heard about it befor should have been a clue. I might have tryed miniblock if I had more 5 star cards, but as of now, I have only traded for a few cards from the new set and have bought one box. With that stuff I don't even have 30 playable foundations for any one symbol, and I hate running decks which are so poorly built that they have to run filler cards, I just don't find it fun.

Anyways, since I don't want to spend the money to make a decent type 3 deck, and have to do it again if miniblock becomes standard, I just think I'm going to quit and sell what type 3 stuff I have. The removal of foil card was another deciding factor, I know it sounds stupid, but I like shiny cards, they just look cooler. On top of eveything else my best friend is already told me that he was going to quit, giving me even less reason to play.

Oh well, I'm too old to play card games anyways, and this will just give me more time to focus on getting a girlfriend...lol.

Tagrineth said:

I doubt they had planned anything up to this point.