Yup. Supression at half range only is silly indeed.

I forgot about weapon upgrades, yeah it should count as a heavy weapon for the purpose of those. I am still not sure what it should come under, I changed it because someone else said that it shouldn't be heavy as they can be fired from the hip and used as a normal weapon if needs be. The weapon really suits a new intermediate category but I would rather keep it in the confines of the normal game.

Since I didn't include the description again I didn't mention it but I did intend for normal autogun clips to be used. The higher rate often makes normal clips unreliable as the spring struggles to feed the ammo in fast enough so maybe it should gain the unreliable trait when using them. Not sure if that is a bit harsh but it may make sense.

I was looking at clip size instead of price >> oops, yes 300 is around right then.

Im not sure these type of weapons would have a burst mode, all of the examples I can find of weapons that are used as SAW's dont come with a burst fire either haveing only single and full auto fire modes or even just full auto so I dont think burst fire is appropriate in this case. The standard saw weapon isnt even capable of single shot (the FN Minimi which of which the US variant is known as the M249 SAW).

Light Stubber

The Light Stubber is and underused concept in the Imperial Guard with most regiments not seeing the need for a weapon that puts out comparible damage to a las gun when there is the reliable Heavy Stubber that provides much more punch. A few regiments that emphisise mobility and squad level operations though find them invaluable for the increased firepower they provide. Although not a common sight outside of the Imperial Guard they are occationally picked up by underhive gangs where thier massive rate of fire combined with thier accuracy make them a deadly proposition for those gangs that rely on the more conventional heavy stubber that requires time to set up. More than a few gangs have met thier grisly end after being ambushed by the Light Stubber.

The light stubber counts as a heavy weapon for the purposes of applying upgrades although may use any ammunition type available to an autogun. It can also use standard autogun clips as bought for an autogun including the same weight as these clips (and gains the unreliable rule?) while decreasing the reload time to a single full action. The lights subber is too unwieldy to use one handed and must always be used with 2 hands.

Name Type Range RoF Dam Pen Clip Rld Wt Special Cost Availability

Light Stubber Basic 120m S/-/10 d10+3 0 200 2full 8.5kg Suppressive Weapon 300 Rare

Suppressive Weapon: The rate of fire and accuracy of the Light Stubber makes it very useful as a suppressive weapon. The Light Stubber is capable of bracing like a heavy weapon, if it does so it gains a hit for every degree of success when using supressive fire rather than every 2 degrees.

Kaihlik

Kaihlik said:

We are getting somewhere About "semi -auto burst" - you do realize this is not really an automatic burst, but simply pressing the trigger repeatedly? Thus any weapon capable of firing once per squeeze of the trigger is semi-automatic, if not it is either a revolver, bolt action, lever action, pump action or older.

The 3-round burst of an m16 is something else entirely, and this weapon can fire almost as fast as a fully automatic weapon, but prevfents a user from accidentally firing more than he wants to. Hmm maybe the autopistol and other weapons with RoF 6 is supposedly firing 3 round bursts.. hmm no somehow these do not have semi-auto burst firing capability, which of course makes no sense at all.

Now afaik the SAW can be set to fire in semi-automatic mode (as can most automatic rifles), thus can fire either a single shot or several of them.

As for the unreiable trait, it's a bit harsh and really even if it is somewhat more prone to jamming it's can't be compared to other unreliable weapons such as the primitive musket. The reduced ammo capability is drawback enough I think.

Actually the M249 SAW is the US licenced version of the FN Minimi which cannot be set to single shot, so I would rather remove the single shot option than add a semi-auto. For game reasons I feel the weapon should eat through ammo at an alarming rate so I would prefer for it to just full auto every time, I added single shot before I looked up the fire modes on the M249.

TBH I dont see how muskets can really jam, fail to fire yes, but jam? A muskets ammo is smaller than the size of the bore and the act of reloading would clear away any blockages.

If anything I feel the unreliable rule suits the Light Stubber much better than a primitive weapon like a musket which didn't include many of the parts that jammed that a normal machine gun has. Autogun ammo should really be viewed as a last resort, as it is it would always pay to carry an autogun clip around in case you run out of ammo mid battle, that way you could quickly change the autogun clip with no penalties, if it became unreliable then people would definitly thing twice before switching to standard clips. The weapons aren't really designed to be using these clips so a significant increase in jamming makes sence especially if it is only made full auto.

Kaihlik

@ Kaihlik (i hate that term it sounds so rude). Even though a musket cant technically jam if the powder doesn't go off you still have to clear the weapon as the ball is held in with wading normally, which would take some time (you'll have to explain how a Tech priest can speed that up yourselves).

I agree with you, There are plenty of guns in rules (especially IHB) that are unreliable. Dud rounds is one, clogged breach and with belts breaking (which is going to happen more with weapons that you can run around with rather than ones that have their own gravity).

I like the idea the stubbers can suppress at longer range than other autofire weapons. Say up to the range of the weapon rather than half. It increases their worth but doesn't allow them to fire at single targerts more accurately at long range which is technically possible but not likely I imagine.

When talk about suppressing over a mile away they actually suppress a large area (a banana shaped area apparently) where the bullets fall. It doesn't really work anything like how it's described in the DH.

Kaihlik said:

Hmm my scource for that may not be very reliable. However, other machine rifles/LMGs does have semi-auto capability. In any case if the light stubber shouldn't have it then it shouldn't have single shot either like the heavy stubber. This is a definite drawback as you'll need a full action to fire it at all, which might not be a bad thing.

Jamming... I take it that it represents all kinds of misfires - duds, jams, weapon breakdown etc. Thus a musket that "jams" might just have wet gunpowder prime and needs to be reprimed (possibly cleared first). A revolver that "jams" doesent really do that but is probably just a dud (which is why it is reliable). Still, to please the machine spirit the corrupted ammunition must be cleared out of the gun in any case

Eh, give it unreliable with magazines if you want to.