So what is everyone's take on the best way to potentially represent the Assault Gunboat in Armada?

I was thinking Speed 2, 5 hull points, 1 Black + 1 Red dice for anti-ship, 2 Blue for anti-starfighter, Heavy, Bomber (13 pts)

Just for kicks.

I think maybe speed 3...they weren't THAT slow. Faster than Y-Wings iirc (though i admit it's been a long time!).

But otherwise that looks pretty good to me. How about Red for Anti-fighter? less hits, but more doubles....represents their missile load? Random thought.

Well it would reflect their absolute annoying tendency for the AI controlled ones to use missiles at every bloody opportunity. I figured speed 2 to reflect a balance. But I could see 3 speed. Have to remember the B-wing was faster then the Y-wing but it is slower in this game as well. Also like the idea of Maybe a single Red and a single blue anti-starfighter attack.

Good point on the B-Wing. 2 would be ok, thats fair. Red and Blue seems good for anti fighter

Well it would reflect their absolute annoying tendency for the AI controlled ones to use missiles at every bloody opportunity. I figured speed 2 to reflect a balance. But I could see 3 speed. Have to remember the B-wing was faster then the Y-wing but it is slower in this game as well. Also like the idea of Maybe a single Red and a single blue anti-starfighter attack.

Wookiepedia, B-wing entry, Characteristics, 5th paragraph: "The B-wing was designed to replace the aging BTL Y-wing starfighter in the heavy assault role against capital ships, as it had the advantage of more weaponry and stronger shields. However, the B-wing had several weaknesses, notably being difficult to fly and lacking speed and agility, affecting its dogfighting capability. Its large hull furthermore made it an easier target and it also had less armor protection. Consequently, it did not fully replace the Y-wing in the assault starfighter role until the New Republic was well established."

Wookiepedia, Y-wing entry, Usage, 1st paragraph: "The Y-wing was not a sluggish fighter overall, as its speed and agility exceeded that of its intended replacement, the B-wing."

So what is everyone's take on the best way to potentially represent the Assault Gunboat in Armada?

I was thinking Speed 2, 5 hull points, 1 Black + 1 Red dice for anti-ship, 2 Blue for anti-starfighter, Heavy, Bomber (13 pts)

Just for kicks.

Seems pretty balanced compared to other bombers in the game. Good stats design, at first glance.

I feel that if included the Gunboat should focus even more heavily on anti-ship capability and fare even worse as a straighter. The trade-off should offer even better anti-ship capabilities that the tie-bomber and should include a weaker version of Assault Concussion Missiles. As such you basically cannot afford to let them get close to your ships.

Speed: 3

Hull: 5

Anti-squadron: 1 Red

Anti-Ship: 2 Black

Bomber

Heavy

Concussion Missiles (Black Critical delivers 1 damage to 1 additional hull zone).

Fleet Points: 16-17

I like your stats, but no need for the concussion missile rule. Missiles were actually less powerful than torpedos as used by X, Y and B Wings, so they certainly shouldnt have an extra damage rule.

I think in the video games, the B-Wing was faster than the Y-Wing at default energy levels, so that might be where the notion comes from.

Don't forget the imperial title that increases bomber speed by 1. That max speed you want to put on it is 2, but you need to take into account that speed boost. Maybe increase the cost or decrease the speed to 1.

Speed 1 is FAR too slow, it'd be basically worthless. 2 is fine...makes 3 with the title, which is still far from speedy.

You guys have to remember that the Assault Gunboat was a hyperspace raider. It was designed to do everything from interception to light bombing roles while being hyperspace capable. Why on earth would you give it Heavy when killing enemy starfighters was one of its roles?

14 points

Speed: 4

Hull: 5

A/S: 2 Blue 1 Black

A/C: 1 Black

Escort, Bomber

Well as current canon goes, it was put in that role, but it was far from great at it. Too big, too slow. "The Assault Gunboat was designed and deployed to perform specific missions that standard TIE fighters were unable to complete." Primary targets are ships and stations and forward recon.

I would make it very similar to the Y-wing.

what really set it apart from other Imperial fighters was it had shields, a hyperdrive, and missiles.

Well we are all over the map here. Lets focus on certain areas of the fighter. It has a single ion cannon and 2 laser cannons. Similar to the Y-wing, so 2 blue dice makes sense. It carries twice as many warheads although of smaller yield and able to engage fighters with those better then torpedo armed fighters. So with that in mind what about 1 blue and 1 black Anti-squadron dice? Compromising between both abilities?

LOVING this topic guys! :wub:

Thank you Wes Janson for initiating this post!

You guys have to remember that the Assault Gunboat was a hyperspace raider. It was designed to do everything from interception to light bombing roles while being hyperspace capable. Why on earth would you give it Heavy when killing enemy starfighters was one of its roles?

14 points

Speed: 4

Hull: 5

A/S: 2 Blue 1 Black

A/C: 1 Black

Escort, Bomber

Loving these specs Norsehound! :wub:

We would still need to keep some 'stat space' open for the TIE Defender, which simply out-performs our beloved GUN in every way.

FFG MUST make Assault Gunboats Happen, is there a pettition somewhere we could sign? Hehe.

Yeah! I remember favouring the Gunboat over all other craft in X-Wing VS TIE Fighter.

It could survive a hammering, inflict quite a lot of pain, but was definitely not impossible to kill.

Edit: Linked an image courtesy of starwars.wikia.com!

I have the first gunboats on the way now for so I aim to play test these by the end of the month. How about a compromise that puts it between the Y & B-wing?

Speed 3

5 hull points

2 Blue for anti-starfighter

1 Black + 1 red dice for anti-ship

Heavy, Bomber

(12 pts)

1 faster then the B-wing +1 pt, 1 less anti-squad dice -1 pt, Heavy -2pt. This puts it at a cheaper cost then the B, faster in keeping with the Imperial fighter scheme, and durable enough to survive a fur ball longer then their tie cousins.

I would say:

Speed 3

5 hull points

3 Blue for anti-starfighter

1 Black + 1 Red dice for anti-ship

Escort, Bomber

(14 pts)

I always figured, GUNS were like an X-Wing on steroids.

Why Escort? Because if you weren't taking the GUNS down first, they'd be all over you with Advanced Concussion Missiles.

Well we are all over the map here. Lets focus on certain areas of the fighter. It has a single ion cannon and 2 laser cannons. Similar to the Y-wing, so 2 blue dice makes sense. It carries twice as many warheads although of smaller yield and able to engage fighters with those better then torpedo armed fighters. So with that in mind what about 1 blue and 1 black Anti-squadron dice? Compromising between both abilities?

Wes Janson? Was that a typo or did you get the information wrong?

The Gunboat has 2 Ion Cannons and 2 Laser Cannons and could carry a double-load of Warheads.

Gunboat missions occasionally had escorting torpedo carriers (like TIE/sa) when they were doing their job, or when DX-9s were tasked to fire rockets at, I dunno, Rebel cruisers.

I threw in the red dice into their anti-fighter rating because I thought it was an interesting way to simulate their (frequent) concussion missile use in X-Wing. The double-hit result definitely occurred when one of them landed a hit.

What I don't want are gunboats to be useless in some way. In my opinion, Gunboats were very middle-of-the-road in being capable of every task, but not excelling at any of them. So they can pull escort missions, be bombers, or tangle with enemy starfighters if they can... but they don't have Counter, don't have swarm, and would be more expensive than the TIE/Sa they could be escorting or the Interceptors one would be motivated to take instead.

The Defener would be easier.

19 points

Mv: 5

Hull: 5

A/F: 4 Blue

A/C: 1 Blue-1 Black

Counter 2

The hell fighter of space, but pricey. Lacks escort, but has Counter. The choice would be either taking a single pricey defender squadron or a couple of TIE Interceptors, which have the SWARM keyword to benefit off of.

In any case, the Defender and Gunboat are both general assault fighters, which would make them stand out from the rest of the Navy craft, which tend to be hyper-specialized to their duties.

Well as current canon goes, it was put in that role, but it was far from great at it. Too big, too slow. "The Assault Gunboat was designed and deployed to perform specific missions that standard TIE fighters were unable to complete." Primary targets are ships and stations and forward recon.

Here's the entry about the Alpha-class Xg-1 Star Wing on Wookiepedia under 'Role'

Of particular interest is the entry about Maarek Steele's exploits with the Gunboat in the TIE Fighter PC game which has since been Canonised with the digital release of Star Wars: TIE Fighter Special Edition by GOG and Disney - too bad it didn't contain the higher resolution 1995 CD version with iMuse!!!!

I have the first gunboats on the way now for so I aim to play test these by the end of the month. How about a compromise that puts it between the Y & B-wing?

Speed 3

5 hull points

2 Blue for anti-starfighter

1 Black + 1 red dice for anti-ship

Heavy, Bomber

(12 pts)

1 faster then the B-wing +1 pt, 1 less anti-squad dice -1 pt, Heavy -2pt. This puts it at a cheaper cost then the B, faster in keeping with the Imperial fighter scheme, and durable enough to survive a fur ball longer then their tie cousins.

This is probably the best statline i've seen so far....some of the others are very heavy on the wishlisting. it wasn't a super fighter by any means, just a very solid multi-role ship. Maaaaaaybe add an extra ant-fighter dice for +2(?)pts, but that would need testing, and IMO not accurate to the ship.

Basically it's a Y-Wing with slightly less hull and slightly more firepower. Sounds about right....it has the exact gun layout of a Y-Wing, was similar in speed. Pretty good analogue.

Not a typo vs a momentary confusion with the silly missile boat and its single laser.

With all this we have contributed in mind, I think playtests will be a great way to deal with some of the doubts. My justification for Heavy follows my alternative X-wing experience when flying against gun boats. When they are ignored they bite, but if I decided to find one to blow up they usually couldn't escape. And I was a Y-wing pilot.

Now I may not agree on all points but that does not mean I don't see other players justifications. I can see the Escort role, but we have to cut it back in some other way to squeeze that in. Not a super fighter, just a capable one. Would it make sense being the only fighter to currently offer the Heavy and Escort ability on the same card? This would jack it back up to 14 pts, making them not so economical to use in numbers, but more significant when they get to do their job.

What do you think?

Btw, instead of using that crappy model from the XWA game, i know some people that did an update on the model using the same engine

Lol, I had that mod for XWA. That took the game to the next level of cool for me.

Life is good