from france

i just watched the video it is impressive but the commentary are more. ludittes is right here. it remind me that if comentary on the french revolution movies can be agressive, like some on wwi and wwii at least they are better in their argumentation. there is no hope for certain part of humanity when you can read a lol in this kind of movie.

but back to the subject. it seems to me tha asi explained the one shot options for a long las is not good. it will be good if doing so doesn't take of the reliable quality.

long bas 1d10+3; pen1 reliable accurate+ one shot= 1d10+3 pen4= 1d10+7 without the reliable trait and you have to reload after the shot.

long bas 1d10+3; pen 1reliable accurate+ overcharge pack = 1d10++3 +1 + pen1= 1d10+5 with 20 shot

snipper rifle 1d10+ precise + mans stopper = 1d10+6 reliable whith 5 shot.

in the first case i think it s really it s not good enough. in the second cases you may have a point but +6 remove a lot of good armor. i know the is only one point left but 1 point camake the difference. rember that when you have do your math all that is not fiexd depends on the dice. i prefer a higher fixe bonus rather than a capricious dice.

It isn't that easy. Some enemies (quite many actually) will have no armor.

Then you'd rather have 1D10+4/Pen 1 than 1D10+3/Pen 3. And 4x the clip size, free ammo and Reliable over 1 Throne per Manstopper bullet.

The caveat (not rulewise but common sense) is that the Long Las as a Laser weapon is giving away the shooter's position/direction (not something a sniper would want). A bullet will not and there's no muzzle flash too if the Hunting Rifle comes equipped with the optional Silencer.

LOCQUE,

Indeed. When a man is riddled with gunfire, relatively little velocity is imparted to the body in the exchange of momentum from the much smaller bullet. One could launch a bowling ball at a steam locomotive at tremendous velocity, but the result would be a shattered bowling ball and a dented locomotive, not a locomotive cartoonishly flying backwards down the track away from the impact. Remember p = mv...

I'm not sure where this absurd hollywood convention (men being blasted backwards by gunfire) got started. The truth is rather more disturbing.

When a man is riddled with machine gun fire, he just falls down and doesn't get up again. It looks like he just fainted, folded up like a newspaper...There's something sad, final, and almost gracefull about it...

from france

i just watched the video it is impressive but the commentary are more. ludittes is right here. it remind me that if comentary on the french revolution movies can be agressive, like some on wwi and wwii at least they are better in their argumentation. there is no hope for certain part of humanity when you can read a lol in this kind of movie.

but back to the subject. it seems to me tha asi explained the one shot options for a long las is not good. it will be good if doing so doesn't take of the reliable quality.

long las 1d10+3; pen 1, reliable, accurate+ one shot= 1d10+3 pen4= 1d10+7 without the reliable trait and you have to reload after the shot.

long las 1d10+3; pen 1, reliable, accurate+ overcharge pack = 1d10++3 +1 + pen1= 1d10+5 with 20 shot

sniper rifle 1d10+ accurate+ mans stopper = 1d10+6 reliable whith 5 shot.

Hehe, I've got a better combo.

Nomad+hyper density penetrators 1d10+5 pen 4 accurate, reliable, tearing, knocks human sized targets down. Range 125, five shots.

from france

that wasn't my point. i wasn't looking for a combo. i was just trying to demonstrate that the las weapons are not what they should be. plus they are only ten nomads made per year. thus it 's not a good option. long las and hunting rifle are easier to get by. it's not a topic about munchkins but how we see the problems of equipement and weapons and sometimes how we can corect it.

Graspar said:

Apples and Oranges.

Long Las + Overcharge Pack: 115 Thrones, Scarce, free ammo.

Nomad + HDP: 2000 Thrones, Very Rare (10/year sector-wide), 100 Thrones per shot.

You're playing a very strange version of Dark Heresy where money and availability don't matter. By its stats the Long Las is easily the sniper weapon of choice for imperial armies (over Hunting Rifles) which could make it qualify as "iconic", The Nomad definitely is not. While you were at it you could have mentioned the Exitus rifle of Vindicare... there's always some bigger gun out there, you just gotta get your hands on it.

Laser weapons are iconic actually because they are cheap, reliable and have almost "infinite" ammo, not because the massive amount of damage it can do. Lasguns are the 40k equivalent to actual AK47; not the most powerful gun, nor the most accurate, but easy to maintain and with ammunition easily to buy "everywhere".

If you want a weapon that you could use at any circunstance (after months of campaign, after hundred of shots, etc), las weapons are the better choice because they would be working when all others don't, and that's a big point.

the 8 spider said:

1. You've forgotten an important part of the Hot shot ammunition: tearing. This gives you 2d10 and you keep the highest, doubling the chance for Fury (and who wouldn't want fury on a sniper shot?) Even without fury, 2d10 keep highest is worth at least 1 point of damage.

2. Hunting Rifle is not reliable. I don't know what sniper rifle you would otherwise be talking of, and if it's from IH then it's a moot point as all IH weapons are superior versions of the DH book ones.

3. With the hot shot pack you also gain +1 damage. Thus it's 2d10 (drop lowest) +4 with penetration 4. And if you're really sniping then the Accurate quality gives you more dice of damage so you probably won't need more than a single shot.

So what you can either do it the expensive way, in whicgh case hot shots are better, or the cheap way, in which the long las wins again because of cheap (free) ammunition.

People always forget about overcharge packs and hotshots, which is weird since they seem to regard man-stoppers as standard ammo.

Luddite said:

The FBI did some interesting research into the effects of being shot. One of the most interesting things they discovered was the relationship between being shot and the target falling down. The reason people tend to fall after being hit by a non-lethal shot? Hollywood.

When a Westerner (or anyone who has been exposed to western media for most of their lives) gets shot, they tend to fall over because they think that's what's supposed to happen. Physiologically there is usually no reason for it. Non-westerners are far less likely to fall over - they'll just keep on running-charging-fighting. Sometimes westerners won't drop - the 'fall over' reflex doesn't kick in, usually when they are surprised or even unaware that they've been shot.

from france

i a m just wondering how chains weapons are powered?

the 8 spider said:

They have a power cell near the hilt.

the 8 spider said:

* A variant of battery or H-cell together with a highly effective electrical engine would be the most common solution among the adeptus astartes and other with access to good quality gear.
* Simpler versions have a small combustion engine running on some energy-rich fuel. Especially orks tend to prefer this way because of the noice and smoke it produces. Kickstarting a chainweapon with a pulling strap like a modern day chainsaw is needed for certain models, others have electrical or compression ignition.
* A rarely seen solution, except in systems of techlevel M1.7 are the complex clokwork mechanics that require you to spend twenty minutes winding up the swords main spring between fights. Lord-technomagos TE-ssl-A have designed the as-fancy-as-it-is-practical design that is wound up by a pendulum mechanism inside the grip, pushed only by the movement of your swagger while the sword is strapped to your waist. This one is not surprisingly very popular with rogue traders.
* A small imp, squig or tyranid bug running really really fast in a squirrel-wheel, cheered on by combatdrugs and a small glowing hot brazier behind them might be appropriate for a more radical inquisitors henchmen.

The imperium is huge, solutions are not standard from one end to another. Anything goes :-)

from france

just a weird idea if hell pistol or las pistol are mounted over acreage lightning guantlet as a forearms weapons can the acgreage lightning effect recharge de battery of the hell or las pistol like a dynamo?

well i sais it s weird probably too much work.

Wow, 2 month necro (from your first recent post). Not bad.

from france

woah what a constructive post.!

no it wasn't two month ago. yes i did necros the topics because a i pefer to necros a subjetc rather than multiply the topics with few answers. topics that will be soon forgotten. topics that wil be ask again again.

the forum has broad categories too broad in fact. so i try to make a topics on equipement and i necros it from time to time with a another weapons subject in mind.

a example? there is no categories about economical issues in the game. the results? it is asked time and times again and at list in "rules questions", house "rules" and games masters.

i dont like to waste my time searching for a subject asked and to discovered that it has been asked 5 tmes.... well you got the picture. so i prefer necros. you have something against it?than just don't post i don't want to starts a flame war but that ... me of. i won't answer to futher provocation but just about equipement.

the 8 spider said:

Don't think so.

The description of the lightning chain and lightning gauntlet says that the weapon stores kinetic energy, not electrical energy. But it also says that the weapon "sparks" when struck against a target, so I guess that the released kinetic energy stored in the strange alloy is discharged as electric energy (not sure what other type of energy would "spark" in the same way).

I guess this means that if you wanted to power something with the discharged energy you would have to hit it against something repeatedly and somehow harnessing the electrical energy released from the gauntlet.

Varnias Tybalt said:

What if you tied the batteries in a lose manner onto the gauntlet giving them enough slack that they banged against it while you're walking and swinging your arms? In that situation, I would say they would charge but it would have the same effect as throwing the cells in a fire for charging... it's can't be good for them in the long run.

Graver said:

Probably not.

Still it all depends on how the GM inteprates the power involved. It only says that they store kinetic energy after all. How this is possible is obviously some sort of sci-fi solution as you can't normally "store" kinetic energy, only transform another form of energy into it.

If the GM wish for the released "sparks" to be electrical sparks then I guess it could be possible to charge power cells in such a manner. On the other hand the sparks could be more akin to the kind of sparks you see when you're welding or grinding metal (i.e minute fragments catching fire due to the extensive heat involved), and the "shocking" aspect of the weapon is simply a transference of said stored kinetic energy rather than a form of electrocution.

Somehow, im feeling like im giving this too much thought... But that's why you all love me, right?

Varnias Tybalt said:

Perhaps you are. The most important question to ask in regards to anything doing anything in 40k isn't how logical or feasible such a thing is but how cool it would be. So, ow cool would it be to charge a power cell or off of these things and how cool would it be to have them power a gun strait out when strapped to it? I guess the secondary concern there would be what kind of precedent would it set, but that should be less important then any cool factor that might arise.

Beyond that, if sparks are being released, if it's electrical, that should slowly charge the cells but if it's from the heat given off from the conversion of kinetic energy, it would still charge the cells. After all, they can be charged from thermal energy as well as electrical. That's how they are able to be charged up by tossing them in a fire or leaving them in the roof of your Land raider during the day.