New to the game watched my first store tournament this past weekend. All three factions where represented well with maybe a little more scum but I think this is because they still have that new ship smell. But there was a lot more medium ships on the tables than I thought there would be!
So I wanted to ask folks that have been playing a lot longer than I what faction do you play against/seen the most? Thanks for your time!
There's actually no need to guess - we've got a LOT of data on this, already.
There's actually no need to guess - we've got a LOT of data on this, already.
Simply awesome chart. Thanks for posting. That's like a how-to guide in data presentation right there.
Interesting, in my local area its heavily imperial favored, I'm pretty much the only guy who primarily plays rebels.
Then again, isn't list juggler more tournament data than casual play? That may be why.
That looked not too far off from the lists at my tournament Saturday at Team Covenant store. Of the 20 players there it was 4 scum players including me, and split down the middle rebels and imps for the rest. Most people were still playing the old meta, and fewer people knew what to do with scum.
That's funny rebels are still the most prominent tournament build with the yt1300 the most common ship by points and its also the list with the highest win % and people honestly think wave 6 killed the fat han build...lol
The second strongest build compared to the falcon was just nerfed leaving the fat falcon alone on its pedestal
That's funny rebels are still the most prominent tournament build with the yt1300 the most common ship by points and its also the list with the highest win % and people honestly think wave 6 killed the fat han build...lol
The second strongest build compared to the falcon was just nerfed leaving the fat falcon alone on its pedestal
List juggler presents aggregate data, meaning the Wave 5 metagame is mixed in with Wave 6. You're reasoning very, very far from the data.
Just as thought...
Filthy rebels...
That's funny rebels are still the most prominent tournament build with the yt1300 the most common ship by points and its also the list with the highest win % and people honestly think wave 6 killed the fat han build...lol
The second strongest build compared to the falcon was just nerfed leaving the fat falcon alone on its pedestal
List juggler presents aggregate data, meaning the Wave 5 metagame is mixed in with Wave 6. You're reasoning very, very far from the data.
The thing about statistical samples is that there is always exceptions. There will always be outliers that don't follow a mathematical models as well as with a assuredly infinite poll of data to sample from, plenty of samples that will be missed and not recorded in the statistic. Even the US census misses allot of information that doesn't get processed into data.
The Falcon is the most played faction.....
Everyone runs around like headless chickens screaming it's broken.
Of course the Falcon gets played the most in tournaments.
The Falcon wins more partly because there are more Falcons. Imagine for the sake of argument that all the lists are perfectly balanced and have an equal chance of winning. If over half the lists are Falcons which one is going to win the most?
That's funny rebels are still the most prominent tournament build with the yt1300 the most common ship by points and its also the list with the highest win % and people honestly think wave 6 killed the fat han build...lol
The second strongest build compared to the falcon was just nerfed leaving the fat falcon alone on its pedestal
The build that got nerfed a bit is the reason people brought Falcons and Decivaders. They'll still be around but they'll be less popular. Our local meta went from half turrets to <10% after scum dropped.
Except your understanding of list juggler is far from accurate since it can and does break down wins by tournaments and still shows fat turrets as having higher win %That's funny rebels are still the most prominent tournament build with the yt1300 the most common ship by points and its also the list with the highest win % and people honestly think wave 6 killed the fat han build...lol
The second strongest build compared to the falcon was just nerfed leaving the fat falcon alone on its pedestal
List juggler presents aggregate data, meaning the Wave 5 metagame is mixed in with Wave 6. You're reasoning very, very far from the data.
"It doesn't matter, it's in the past." -Rafiki
Lately game nights have been Scum vs. Villainy. I've been playing Villainy just to be different from all the Scum players.
Everyone runs around like headless chickens screaming it's broken.
Of course the Falcon gets played the most in tournaments.
The Falcon wins more partly because there are more Falcons. Imagine for the sake of argument that all the lists are perfectly balanced and have an equal chance of winning. If over half the lists are Falcons which one is going to win the most?
This is the beginning of a tautological argument, I think, but I'll bite anyway. Also, I'd like to preface the upcoming rant with I do not think the Falcon is overpowered:
The Falcon is played more, and therefore wins more, because it is already a proven winner. For its point-cost, no ship in the game even compares to the action economy and survivability a Falcon, specifically Fat Han, offers. With Han, you don't ever need to do any action other than Evade, essentially. And if you know you won't get shot, of course you're going to focus with a built-in target lock.
As far as defense, it is the only 1-agility ship in the game that can mitigate up to 3 damage a turn if it's in the sweet-spot with an R2-D2 crew or good guesses on 3-P0. Yes, I admit that's still an issue of luck but the fact that it can even do that, or at the least guarantee 2 mitigated damage per turn with shields, is ridiculous. Sure, Kenkirk with Ysanne (a four-point upgrade that activates only with shields down) can evade 2 damage, too, but you're already taking hull damage at that point. And if the Falcon is in that sweet spot with only shields down and no hull damage, it can use R2-D2 crew with no penalty whatsoever.
Now then, I'm not going to say the Falcon is overpowered. I've taken down plenty (been facerolled by plenty, too) and seen others do the same. But I will say that it is bar-none in a class of its own, especially Fat Han. The 'point cost premium' argument kind of falls apart because no other ship in no other faction for a similar point cost can do all the things a Fat Falcon can do. It is literally a best-of-all-worlds ship that can game the MoV rules for tournaments while stomping ships on offense and turtling on defense. There is no middle ground for it.
The Paul Heaver list was designed specifically for tournament success in that you have a 50-60+ point ship that can almost always destroy its point-cost before going down and then survive the remainder of the match for the win. And with its turret, it is very user-friendly. That's not to say anyone can just start playing X-Wing and go 8-0 with it, but you'd have a much easier time doing it with Fat Han than any other list in the game. And that is exactly why you both see more Falcons at tournaments and why they win more tournaments than any other list.
To answer OP's question, though: I see a wide variety of ships. I usually go up against Rebels, though.
my area's mainly split between staunch supporters of each faction (minus those of us who jumped to S&V and myself, who plays all sides 
)
the most consistently amazing player rolls with imperials, though, and so far we're counting two imperial victories in local story championships to one rebel (yay Stress Wing 
)
the latest store championship was very interesting with some very awesome lists coming out of the woodwork. A paul heaver variant (some weird PTL falcon with 3 bandits instead of talas) hit second place but first place was taken by thrusters Soontir with Swarm Howlie and four Academy Pilots.
Edited by ficklegreendiceI'm not convinced the Falcon is over powered, so I'm hardly headless-chickening, here, but this is a terribly flawed argument.
Everyone runs around like headless chickens screaming it's broken.
Of course the Falcon gets played the most in tournaments.
The Falcon wins more partly because there are more Falcons. Imagine for the sake of argument that all the lists are perfectly balanced and have an equal chance of winning. If over half the lists are Falcons which one is going to win the most?
So it only wins more because it's played more, but...what, it's just a coincidence that it's played more, in the first place?
You don't think you've got a little cart-before-the-horse action going on, here?
You don't think you've got a little cart-before-the-horse action going on, here?
There is something to that... It wins more because it's played more. But why is it played more? It's not just because it's the Falcon, it's because it's a very good ship.
It was a very good ship before C-3PO came along and we all enjoyed the endless summer of dual falcons... It was good when it shot first as well.
Does the fact that it wins or even shows up a lot prove it's OP? No it doesn't, but the fact that it shows up so much does prove it's very popular, and it is that for a reason.
But popular, or even effective is not the same as OP'ed.
I'm not convinced the Falcon is over powered, so I'm hardly headless-chickening, here, but this is a terribly flawed argument.
Everyone runs around like headless chickens screaming it's broken.
Of course the Falcon gets played the most in tournaments.
The Falcon wins more partly because there are more Falcons. Imagine for the sake of argument that all the lists are perfectly balanced and have an equal chance of winning. If over half the lists are Falcons which one is going to win the most?
So it only wins more because it's played more, but...what, it's just a coincidence that it's played more, in the first place?
You don't think you've got a little cart-before-the-horse action going on, here?
nope, he just didn't address the cause
Ardus explained it very well in his post, the Falcon is a ****-off easy ship to fly and do well with because it is incredibly forgiving especially with the lack of partial scoring
this ease of flight doesn't necessarily translate to the highest levels where pros will make it dance in ways newbies never could, but that explains its extreme popularity
and then, the more falcon lists being entered into an event, the far greater chance you have of seeing a few falcon squads placing high
mind you, just because I don't think its broken doesn't mean I wouldn't relish seeing it neutered. Fat Han represents the single most reprehensible game mechanic ala fat turrets, FFG's single greatest ****-up in this beatiful game that makes encounters with the most charismatic figure in Star Wars a mind-draining dice-grind that makes me wonder if I'm actually still playing X-wing or if I somehow transgressed back into 40k
Edited by ficklegreendicePlease drop the Falcon comments. Let's just discuss what's being played nearby.
interestingly enough, seeing a ton of Firesprays
the Wave 5 mindset is still alive and well (Sadly) translating into a lot of two-ship builds, but there aren't nearly as bad because they have ARCS 
most of the new two ship builds are S&V combinations of the Aggressor and Firespray (that is double aggressor, mixed, double firespray)
Ig-88B shows up across all builds with Aggressors and in double Aggressor he's mostly accompanied by D
Boba is Ig-88B's partner in mixed list
Kath and Emon make up most of the double firespray loadouts
in addition, the mangler cannon has brought back Imperial Kath to our area along with Krassis whom is being kept in the competitive environment by a player who quite enjoys him (and has since given him an escort of two auto-thruster interceptors, one PTL saber and one lone wolf thurr) and did quite well in the latest store championship
Please drop the Falcon comments. Let's just discuss what's being played nearby.
Well, the Falcon comments related directly to the graphs presented earlier which reflect the propensity of Rebels at tournaments. So they're not entirely off-topic.
My playgroup always has a good mix, most of us run something different every match we play. When tournaments get close we'll practice our one or two squads we're choosing from, which tend to favor Imperial small ships, but when it's just a get-together we see everything from Scum Feedback Swarms with Xizor to Scyk swarms to insane Lambda / Bounty Hunter builds or a classic 8 Academy TIE fleet. It's always good fun.
Tournaments are one thing and weekly games another. At least in my area, it is.
oh, forgot to mention,
there was the one Paul Heaver variant (not carbon copy) but not even a single Decimator and no Whisper + Chiraneau, not even in casuals
gather all the ******* doves you can and throw them into the air because that is cause for a ******* celebration
Edited by ficklegreendice