what is the actual cannon size of the rebel flagship from return of the jedi the home one?

Too me it looks huge, and ive found many sources that claim that its about twice the size of a star destroyer. Yet there also seems to be evidence that its just slightly smaller and this has what fantasy flight has gone with.

my question is which is considered canonn and why?

Home One is all over the **** place in size. There are a sources saying its only 1200-1400 meters, while others say its 2.5kms. It does look huge on screen, but its hard to judge the size of it. My only thinking is that its not much bigger than your standard MC80, which there is no standard. They make every MC80 unique, but maybe its around 1500-1600 meters (bigger than average). If it was ~2,500 meters why wouldn't the Death Star II's gunners target her first? It would really stick out as the most important Rebel ship being that it would be twice the size of the other cruisers. But a lot of stuff doesn't make sense in that battle, so whatevs.

I personnally like the idea of it being twice the size of a star destroyer if only because then it makes it a more ferocious opponent for them, gives the rebs a more BA ship, and perhaps something to be used with more potency against an SSD.

also its my favorite ship so im totally biased.

I will most certainly be modifying the vanilla cruiser from wave 2 to fit my vision more so than what it is now. It just looks to small next to that ISD to me :/

A normal MC80 IS small next to an ISD

The length difference is one thing, but the shape makes the ISD have vastly more bulk than an MC80.

Kind of makes it more impressive that they aren't a million miles apart in effectiveness really.....and ISD is certainly superior to an MC80, but not by as much as that size difference suggests!

Well actually, and again im biased here I dont think the mon calamari cruisers are not the equals and perhaps even supeeiors in some departments to the ISD's. Thats going to be an unpopular thought on a most imp forum XD

and while the wing types that are shown in the film, and this appears to be backed up in other places seem just slightly smaller than a star destroyer you also have to remember that the lore stresses that each mon cal cruiser is built to be unique and so the size variation could be quite something.

Now this is the most thorough research ive found into this topic http://www.theforce.net/swtc/mcc.html

he seems to conclude a size of about 3.7km is about right for the Home One. And based on what i saw in the movies id say hes right. Now if you wanna talk about extended lore or size determinations in other materials etc or even how perspective plays a role in the films thats fine. But to me its just a bit annoying because it is my favorite ship.

Of course im not looking to make the model three times the size of an ISD though! There is a sliding scale for a reason. But i do think extending the body by basically transplanting another cruisers section into the middle will give it a longer even more irregular unique look that I love avout the Mon Cals. Of course i plan on doing a whole blurb about modifying and painting those guys though XD

Well, relative power is going to be a very tricky argument. Certainly an ISD had more, bigger guns (a huge edge in firepower actually) and a greater fighter and troop complement. MC80 shields were superior however. I dont think hull strength has ever been strictly compared, but it's known that MC80's were very tough at least.

Again, this is for a normal MC80a though....Home One types (of which there were several) had a bigger fighter complement, though were equally outgunned. Probably even tougher than a standard MC80a though.

Oh, totally agree on size. I was referring strictly to a normal MC80 and responding to " I will most certainly be modifying the vanilla cruiser from wave 2 to fit my vision more so than what it is now. It just looks to small next to that ISD to me" rather than talking about Home One.

I think HO should at the least be as long or slightly longer than an ISD, no doubt. As to HOW big....i think the 3km+ is a bit unlikely for various reasons, but other than that i dunno!

The argument against that a normal MC80 (possibly excluding Home One) was a modified luxury cruise liner retrofitted to be a warship, while the ISD was specifically designed as a warship.

The Royal Navy could have completely stripped the Queen Mary down to bare metal and rebuilt her during World War 2, but at the end of the day it would have still been a modified ocean liner, not a battleship.

No denying the MC80 were expertly modified and posed a very viable threat to star destroyer, but at the end of the day, they're still cruise liners originally designed to carry passengers.

Well based on the way FFG has treated Mon cals in their other material id say shes going to be every but as much the beast as a star destroyer. Just with different strengths and weaknesses. If you take the stats from age of rebellion for instance id definiately give the edge if only slightly in a strait fight to the Mon cal. So i think its likely that the stats will reflect that in this game as well because its the same company XD

my own view is that they should just be pretty much on the same terms with different strengths so i like the idea that FFG will hopefully remain consistent.

I remember reading awhile back, cant remember/find the source that mon cal cruiserz were built with hulls designed to go underwater to extreme depths. Which is interesting and might give itself credance to thier supposed extreme durability and i know they are supposed to have pretty much the best cap shields of thier size but as you've mentioned ther'ye firepower is lacking due to the civilian modification nature of their existence.

http://fc03.deviantart.net/fs71/i/2011/303/3/2/starwars_and_wh40k_ships_2_by_dirkloechel-d39j5n5.jpg this i think makes for a better variation in sized ships for the rebels and gives them something a little better to look forward too than the EU mon cal dssigns which i consider to be supa ugly

And just to clarify, my own opionion is that the Home one if it were to be bigger than a star destroyer itself still not be more of a match in direct combat to one, just that i think its more of a commandship and carrier.

I do believe Home One was an exception to the MC80 core, I'd almost put it in another class. I don't necessarily buy into it being substantially larger than an ISD, but I think its a cut above a regular MC80.

I think its main advantages were heavy shields with no externally exposed generators, and advanced fire control.

Though the argument has been made that the globes on the Executor were communications globes (as Lucas based his ships on WW2 warships), and that the shields had been stripped by the Alliance's concentrated firepower. And it goes that Green Leader made it through because the Executor was essentially sensor blind at that point.

Well i don't buy any of the bullcrap lets be honest. The reason an A wing blew up an SSD is because the good guys had to win and plot armour.

I have some very strong thought on the WW2 analogies and how it pertains to capital ships in satr wars. I will say for instance your retrofitted cruise liner argument is not necessarily correct takeing into consideration everything, even though its a very popular argument. but thats for a different thread Xp

It seems to me however that based soley on wether or not home one should have special treatment and should have been slightly longer or more skewed to the larger size than the other way seems a popular sentiment. If only to make her really stand out amongst the mon cals

I've always believed Home One should have been classified as an MC85 or MC90, instead of lumping it in with the other 80 class cruisers.

But let's be honest, the films were never made to be scrutinized frame by frame. At that level some of the inconsistencies are pretty glaring, and everyone has their own headcanon to try and explain them away.

It should be a smaller ship. Shouldn't be much bigger then 1300 meters.

The best commentary I've seen on the Executor and Ackbar's Flagship come from Dr. Curtis Saxton's Technical Commentaries.

http://www.theforce.net/swtc/mcc.html#home1

He puts it as a good bit larger than an ISD, though maybe not double the length. Diffidently not a standard Mon Cal cruiser.

Scrutinizeing movies from ages ago is all i have 2e!!! XD I still think it can be very pertinent to the discussion to talk about its on screen size as opposed to just throwing it out however, is that not supposed to be the highest form of cannon?

Wes i think it currently is that big? At least FFG interpretation of the model appears to be?

My question is because their seems to be alot of contention between which size is accurate, and i myself am personnally skewed in one direction id like to know what others thoughts are and if you do agree with the current size can you give me a good cannon source (not just a wiki) for that legitimacy?

2e!!!! I already posted a link to his site!!! Lol

and he decides on a 3.7km size btw which is a little more than double.

Scrutinizeing movies from ages ago is all i have 2e!!!

Tell me about it, I spent my teenage years obsessing over every detail of the Imperial Navy, that has translated into quite the adult obsession, though its more starfighter based now. (I have half of my gameroom dedicated to a Yavin Hanger display (6 X-wings, 2 Y-wings + MF)

Interesting Dr Saxton puts the Executor at nearly double the published length, based on the studio models.

The Executor is another hotly debated ship, but i think we can all agree that the importnat answer to that one is "Bloody big"

I dont think thats true. Its 19km almost everybody agrees on that, wiki and saxton both do and most sources will agree. What is this 'published' length you speak of 2e what source are you refering too?

I dont think thats true. Its 19km almost everybody agrees on that, wiki and saxton both do and most sources will agree. What is this 'published' length you speak of 2e what source are you refering too?

Theres a full list of the differing sources here:

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Executor-class_Star_Dreadnought

Even the official databank has given various sizes. " The Official Databank has given various sizes over the years, starting with "over eight times longer than an ISD", to 12,8km (as a compromise between fan groups) and finally, 19km"

However, 19km seems the current official size and fits with the movies, so good enough for me .

NO TARKINING THIS THREAD!

Well it seems for the most part people are either indifferent on this or they think that Home one should be slightly bigger than an ISD in size while the liberty and other classes are slightly smaller, or thats the vocal minority. Either way i will definitely be making a modified version when it comes out but i would really love to see better pictures of their model sooner rather than later.

i would really love to see better pictures of their model sooner rather than later.

Me too, I want to see how the ISD model stacks up against the VSD in size. The ISD is about 50% larger than the VSD, but I doubt the ISD model will be that much larger than the VSD model.

I'm basing that off the size between the Nebulon Frigate model and the VSD model (Depending on the source, the VSD should be almost triple the size of the Frigate). Eitherway, it'll be interesting to see the Wave 2 models.

So, i started this thread because i was unsure as to what the actual size of the Home one was. This is my favorite original trilogy ship and so i felt it deserved looking into. I have asked the community to offer me any evidence that the apparent FFG size of the ship was accurate so far i haven't really found or been given any evidence that this is the case.

Again this has all stemmed from watching the movies and seeing the Home One and saying. That thing is massive, like bigger than an SD, massive.

I have done my own research and have come to the conclusion that the Home One was specifically 3.7km long or TWICE the size of an SD. There are many well thought out and researched arguments, an overwhelming number really, that conclude with this.

However the most compelling argument that i found which is supported absolutely in the movie and just strait up proves it is this.

The Home one has a number of wing hangers aboard its sides. These are clearly seen and open in the films. We are taken into one of these hangers which house the captured lambha class shuttle a known entity with a verifiable height. So we know for the shuttle to fit in that hanger the hanger had to be at least as high as the shuttle. If you take that block of height and take a profile shot of the ship and then measure by factors of the hanger on the side of the ship you get your answer. Its verifiable.

Now there is obviously still gonna be nay sayers for various reasons im sure but heres the kicker, an indepedent modding group in an attempt to make a space sim based on star wars with full formed and functioning ships with a high level of detail tried to create the 3d model of the ship. knowing the information they had, for instance that the lambha shuttle had to be able to fit into the side hanger bays they found that the ONLY way for that to be the case was if the size of the ship was, guess what.

3.7km

So this brings me too two things.

one is that im going to be endlessly annoyed by this and i wish i never looked into it.

And the second is that how the hell and why does everyone think its smaller than it is!!

pg 8 has the 3d model.

http://www.hard-light.net/forums/index.php?topic=82078.140

Definately going to have to modify mine.

http://www.hard-light.net/forums/index.php?topic=44769.0

Dammit Lurtz! Now I know it too...

I had always figured "around an ISD" size... And now all I will be able to think about is it is way too small.

Any chance the shuttle parked sideways?

Lol, unfortunately not. The good thing in all of this however is that the actual Home One while much bigger than an ISD likely wasnt much more powerful than one and so the stats the have put up for the new Wave 2 reveal arent terrible and because of the shape of the Mon Cal Cruiser it hopefully wont be too hard to modify 2 ships together to get the neccessary length. Though it would still be to thin but i think i can live with it.

Still though, im suprised more people arent at least mildly annoyed by this, can you imagine the outrage had the ISD been out of scale this much?

I suppose its that there is a large misconception around this particular ship probably exacerbated by the other Mon Cals lengths. its a little bit of a dissapointment. Especially as i thought if they did release an SSD the Home one Commandship could have been the alliances best though not great chance at takeing one on.

I did send FFG an email explaining my case so well see what they say. Though theres no way in hell theyll change the production lines at this point.

Still its not all bad! The Mon cals had other ships that resembled Home one at that scale.