My question is quite direct and simple, but it has broader implications. Should talents which extend the capabilities and effectiveness of melee and sword form weapons apply to a manifested Psychic Blade?

Could a psychic with the Blade Mastery feat re-roll a missed attack with his Psychic Blade? I've included the passages from the core rules which seem most relevant.

Page 113, Dark Heresy core rules, Blademaster Talent: "...When attacking with a sword or a knife of any type, including chanswords and power swords, you may re-roll a missed attack once per Round."

Page 177, Dark Heresy core rules, Psychic Blade telekenetic power: "...Once manifested, treat the Psychic Blade as a sword wielded by teh Psycher (though it does not require a free hand) that requires no Melee Training to use, but cannot Parry."

The power manifests a blade. Blademaster makes you extra-good when wielding blades. Sound like they should work together to me.

That was our group's feeling, as well.

However, ealizing that the blade is not held in the PC's hand, and that the blade cannot be used to parry, raised my curiosity. While I agree that it is a blade, its limitations make me wonder about the fairness of applying swordsmanship talents to it... at least, in full. Also, psychic blade is not among the listed examples of blades to which the Blademaster talent applies... though I really can't find anything to discount it.

I appreciate the feedback. Can anyone make a case for NOT allowing swordsmanship talents to apply to a psychically manifested weapon, not held in the character's hands, and not able to parry?

Am I being to uptight?

Also, psychic blade is not among the listed examples of blades to which the Blademaster talent applies...

Well, that's why they are examples. Force swords aren't listed either.

You don't use your hands to wield a psychic blade. It's got nothing to do with swordsmanship.

You don't even have to move in order to use it, you can stand around looking all innocent while the people next to you start loosing limbs. I'd rule a clear No.

I would have to say no also for the same reason, you don't actually wield it in your hands and physically swung by you.

The text on it makes me think that you are summoning this molecule thin blade infront of you and as you go about your actions you control it with your mind to swing and strike. Also since it can't parry I would also rule that it can't be parried either because it is infact so thin the human eye can't register it's existance. If you want to let it be parried, I would impose atleast a -30 to try and let someone because again.... your being hit by a line of molecules, how are you seeing this thing?

You cannot parry something that cannot be seen.

The only way to avoid this would be if you had some sort of supernatural talents, of psykic ability to see "danger coming! Duck right now"

Darth Smeg said:

On the other side, your hands normally act according to your will, just as the psychic blade does. I think that the Blademaster is a pattern saved within one's memory, which would probably interact with one's will just as fast or even faster than with one's hand.

True but those talent represent ones ability with the sword in your hands, not in control with your mind. I also have to believe the control with the Phsycic blade is not going to be nearly as percise as a swordsmans would be. Remember the power lets you summon it and control it for attacks, it doesn't state anything else about fine control etc. Movements of the blade may be a bit jerky or lacking the fine control required of a swordsman.

I have to go with yes on this, as the rules both state it pretty clear. Blademaster works with any kind of blade, psychic blade summons a blade. Nowhere under blademaster does it say that the sword you wield must be in your hands. It has nothing to do with whether or not the power allows for fine control, the Blademaster Talent wouldn't assist you if you were trying to pick a lock with a sword or knife either, it only applies to if you're trying to hack something to death with a blade. Just because a weapon cannot parry doesn't mean you can't be good at hitting your opponent with it. I'd say Blademaster could also apply to an Eviscerator, as all the models with them are just giant 2 handed chain swords.

karn987 said:

Why do you assume that a psyker would have less control over a blade controlled directly by his mind than he would over a blade that has his flesh sitting between his mind and the blade ?

If anything, wouldn't the psyker have more control over it ?

Control over the psychic blade would be different to a regular blade. That difference is shown by the psychic blade working off willpower instead of weapon skill. So unless they are an odd psyker, their willpower would be higher than their weapon skill, which means they have more control over the blade.

Blademaster would include a significant component on where you are trying to get the blade to go, weapon skill is how skilled you are about getting the blade to go there.

The rules are quite clear on the issue. Blademaster works with swords and knives "of any type", ranging from light daggers to heavy chainswords. Psychic blade says "treat the Psychic blade as a sword" then adds some exceptions that don't effect blademaster.

Wouldn't the two combined allow you to reroll when you accidently lopped off your mates head?

How would knowing the right kind of strike to perform help you when your errent thought of "By the Emperor she is HOT!!" causes you to slap her arse with your psychic blade???