Component convenience is not really solid ground for a rules argument to spring from.

I mean we don't even have enough dice for an X-wing attack.

To me, the Wulff argument is well over into "but it doesn't say that I can't" -territory.

In cases where you believe cards break general game rules, you need a better argument than that.

At this point for me ... FFG has to basically say "Yes with Wulf you can use two command tokens that are the same on the same action" and NOT "You are not allowed to do it."

There is nowhere near enough evidence into the legalese that people are tossing around that convinces me that there is even a chance that is what they intended.

Till then when I play people playing Wulf I ask how they play it and if they play like some people are trying I just don't bother playing b ecause generally those type games frustrate me as rules are picked apart and the game lasts SO long.

Seeing that this seems to be the consensus I'll play it this way too then.

Though I can see the argument for the other side, and it would be good if someone emailed FFG about it. (I don't care enough to do so though. :> )

Adlerson

I am trying to follow here. What does Wulff's Card actually say?

Wulf's effect states the following:

"When you spend a command token, you may exhaust this card to gain 1 command token of the same type."

Now, here's where it get's interesting. The 'when' keyword is used here, now the When keyword is covered in the section marked Effect Use and Timing as being the following:

" A 'when' effect occurs at the moment that the specified event occurs and cannot occur again for that instance of the event."

So the effect is instant, and occurs at the point that the player spends a command token with his command dial. Since the command is still at the point where you combine tokens and dials to merge the effect into a single Command this allows you to spend a second token to further upgrade the effect.

Now where I'm saying a FAQ is needed is that clearly FFG hadn't envisaged a situation where it would be possible to put two tokens of the same type into a Command Dial, or potentially each other.

Now, in my mind there's several ways they could errata this.

1) A ship can spend both a command dial and any command tokens of the same type to combine into a single resolution of that command.

2) Any tokens gained from exhausting Wulf Yularans effect occur after the Command Token effect has been resolved.

3) You can only augment a Dial Command with one Command Token per Command effect.

Then of course there's the question of can you use two Command Tokens of the same type with each other.

Clearly looking on Page 4 under commands: "A ship can spend both a command dial and a command token to combine their effects. Doing so counts as a single .... "

If it as like you said then they would have included "token(s)"

No where in the rules does it ever mention using multiple tokens in combination with each other its says 1 command dial and 1 command token.

As NeverTell said also. I think the rule is clear, single dial and single token. But Con Fire token can be used on your second attack. That's my vote.

I think this is way too much rules lawyering.

I always ALWAYS do Rules as Intended because otherwise its people generally trying to "break" the game or "Find ways around rules"

Its clear in my mind the idea of Wulf is that you can use a repair token finish the effect, then get the repair token back.

It wasn't intended so you could use two repair tokens in the same action.

It's very clear to me in the Rules Reference that they never intended you to be able to have and use 2 tokens at the same time.

Otherwise its just Rules Lawyering looking for loop holes that clearly aren't there, and it bloats the FAQ.

Clearly looking on Page 4 under commands:

"A ship can spend both a command dial and a command token to combine their effects. Doing so counts as a single .... "

If it as like you said then they would have included "token(s)"

No where in the rules does it ever mention using multiple tokens in combination with each other its says 1 command dial and 1 command token.

This exactly.

There is too much over thinking on him. Wulf just replaces a spent token, simple as that.

I think this is way too much rules lawyering.

There is too much over thinking on him. Wulf just replaces a spent token, simple as that.

Agreed

Clearly looking on Page 4 under commands:

"A ship can spend both a command dial and a command token to combine their effects. Doing so counts as a single .... "

It says "a command token." Typically in American English "a" denotes singular. If it was any number of tokens I would have expected wording such as "a command dial and one or more of its command tokens" or "a command dial and any command tokens." Both of these word choices are used in other locations of the rules, while "A" is used in multiple locations to denote singular. "A ship," for example.

" A 'when' effect occurs at the moment that the specified event occurs and cannot occur again for that instance of the event."

So the effect is instant, and occurs at the point that the player spends a command token with his command dial. Since the command is still at the point where you combine tokens and dials to merge the effect into a single Command this allows you to spend a second token to further upgrade the effect.

The wording as written allows for spending "both" to "combine their effects." The event that triggers the 'when' effect is the spending of both the dial and the token. You don't spend the dial and then spend the token to enhance its effect. You spend both, at the same time. There is no, spend one then the other. You have to let the spending of both resolve before you can interrupt with Wulf. Even if you do immediately interrupt at the time the command token is spent, spending a command token is not an immediate interrupt itself. They can only be spent at certain times, and can only resolve once. In this case the spending of Wulf's token and the spending of the dial and token would resolve with the same timing. "If two or more of a player’s effects have the same timing, that player can resolve those effects in any order." So which order do you resolve it in? I hope it's dial and token, because "A ship cannot resolve the same command more than once per round." Just for clarity sake: "A ship can resolve the effect of a command by spending a command dial or command token with the matching icon at the appropriate time."

This becomes really interesting in the case of the Concentrate Fire command. It resolves during the "Resolve Attack Effects" step of "an attack" and so you'd need to both add a dice and re-roll a dice at the same time to use both dial and token, not one then the other. This is after you have already resolved the "Roll Attack Dice" step so it is possible. It also means that even though ships get two attacks, Concentrate Fire is only usable in one of the two "Resolve Attack Effects" steps.

This is rules as written. I am not speculating the intention behind the rules, simply as it is on paper.

So to confirm, the dominator card lets you have 3 anot squadron dice

Yes, though you would be spending 2 shields to have 3 dice vs one squadron only, and 1 die vs any other squadrons. The extra blue dice only apply to one attack, and anti-squadron is a bunch of attacks one after another.