Hi All

Has anyone tried Imperial Kath with an Ion cannon and Calculation (perhaps recon specialist as well). Giving an ion or a stress seems like a good thing.

I don't think it works since you have to cancel all dice results as per the ion cannon text.

Because it doesn't work quite like how you are thinking. The defender has to cancel the stress, not the Ion Cannon.

Doesn't the ion cancelation happen at the end, after any other dice results are cancelled? I'm just talking about ion OR stress not both. the ion only cancels on a hit, after the defender can use defense dice to cancel hits, so it should work fine.

Kath + Calculation seems like it could be a good bet but I don't see the Ion Cannon adding anything to it. It may make it more likely to trigger the Stress but then the Ion is just added to that. Here's how I see things going down:

Kath attacks (with Ion Cannon)

Roll Attack: [boom] [kaboom] [eye]

Defender Modifies: None

Kath Modifies: Uses Calculation to turn [eye] into [kaboom]

Roll Defense: [blank] [evade] [evade]

Defense modified: none

Check Results: [evade] cancels [boom], [evade] cancels [kaboom], [kaboom] uncancelled; ATTACK HITS and Kath Triggered.

Resolve dice: Ion Cannon texts kicks in and does what it does including cancelling the remaining [kaboom]

Now if Calculation was NOT used when Kath modified the attack but a standard Focus was used the modified result would have been [boom] [boom] [kaboom] and the Defense would have only cancelled the [boom] results so Kath would NOT trigger there. When the Ion goes it cancels that [kaboom] but that has nothing to do with the defender so Kath doesn't care.

Calculation can be a good thing with Kath as more [kaboom] results mean more chances to see the defender cancel one.

You check to see if the attack hits before you cancel the dice results. This is where Kath's ability would trigger. If you rolled a crit (or produced one with Calculation) and the defender cancels it, they'd receive a stress token. If there were un-cancelled hits/crits remaining, the attack would hit, they'd take one damage and one ion token, and then you'd cancel all the dice results.

That said, I think you'd get more mileage out of Kath + Mangler cannon. For the same points cost as Ion + Calculation you have the potential to deal more damage, and unless you completely whiff on your attack roll, you'll always have at least one crit in your dice results that your opponent has to eat or cancel and take the stress. Plus it frees up your EPT slot.

I like the idea! Alas, the others are correct about it.

However: Ten + Ion Cannon + Calculating gives a 75% chance of dealing a crit (and therefore 1 ion + 1 damage) as long as you have a focus token.

Might as well just use a Mango, so you don't screw your damage output

...

However: Ten + Ion Cannon + Calculating gives a 75% chance of dealing a crit (and therefore 1 ion + 1 damage) as long as you have a focus token.

I think the odds of getting a [kaboom] result are better than that as you've got a 3/8 chance of ending up with one with three dice (and then I look a the 5/8 chance of not getting it and realize that doing that three times gets you down to a 24.4% chance of no [kaboom] or [eye] results) which Ten make sure gets through. IF you are going for control that may good but that's a lot of points for a control ship.

With Ten going with the Mangler Cannon for damage output is probably the much better choice. If you attack with a Focus you have a 98.4% chance of getting a [kaboom] through and even without the Focus you've got a 93.75% chance of getting a [kaboom] to go through. Often you'll get even more damage rolled although that could be negated.

It would work, but.... You'd rarely get ion and stress together, because when you cancel crits, they have to be cancelled last, so if you roll hit focus blank, and calculate to hit crit... The opponent is stressed if they get double evades (to cancel the crit), but, that will make the attack miss, so no ion.if they get only one evade, then they are hit, but ion cannon text cancels the crit, so they don't become stressed but take one ion.

To stress and ion, you'd need one crit to be cancelled, and one crit to get through.... So we need minimally two crits for both stress and ion. Crit focus is at least more likely than crit crit... Mangler cannon makes the two crits no problem, but of course it's not the ion cannon.... Interestingly merc copilot will help you here at range 3, but you may as well just take tactician for the auto range 2 stress..

If you're taking calculation, a recon specialist seems really good though... It's a good combination that can cause an interesting dilemma for the enemy (do I spend my focus to avoid the shot and take stress, or save it and get ionned?), just don't expect the stress + ion effect to happen together very often.

yeah sorry but it wont work

ion/flechette cannons is not compatible with calculating.

Kath only triggers if your opponent cancels the critical hits not if you cancel the critical hits.

yeah sorry but it wont work

ion/flechette cannons is not compatible with calculating.

Kath only triggers if your opponent cancels the critical hits not if you cancel the critical hits.

Except they cancel them first...Which then determines whether or no the attack gets through. THEN you cancel your own results, giving them 1 damage and a token. Seems like it should work fine to me.

Ion Cannon: Attack: Attack 1 ship. If this attack hits the target ship, the ship suffers 1 damage and receives 1 ion token. Then cancel all dice results. Attack value: 3. Range: 1-3.

Calculation: When attacking, you may spend a focus token to change 1 of your

results to a [crit] result

Kath Pilot skill: When attacking, the defender receives 1 stress if they cancel at least 1 [Crit] result

Rule book page 12 step 6. Compare results...The defender compares evade results to attack dice removing [hit] before [crit] results. During this step of the attack is when you discover if you successfully HIT the ship.

The effect from the ion cannon resolves in step 7, dealing damage, Where as the stress effect from Kath would resolve in step 6, compare results.

so by wording and stages of the attack process yes it appears that you can Stress Ion. However it wouldn't be guaranteed to happen everytime. The defender could clean dodge the ion shot or not cancel the crit and it then becomes a regular hit with ion and no stress.

So for a best chance at that combo being pulled off you might want to throw on a tactician. Then you could double stress and Ion your opponent...