I've recently fallen in love with Soontir Fel, and aces in general. I was really excited to see that the tie advanced is getting some love. I like to see the iconic characters being played and want to play Vader.

As I've been looking at different builds I'm still not sure what Vader is bringing to the table, or more generally with the upgrade what will be the big strength of the tie Tie Advanced? Is it just that it will be a little more beefy than the Interceptor in situations where autothrusters won't help?

Is trying to fly Vader like an arc dodger the wrong way to do it?

Vader will be nearly as dodgy, but inherently tougher and more effective offensively before you even add an EPT. Add Predator or Outmaneuver and even deadlier. Add VI for supreme initiative bid. Add a support EPT since he is elite based on his ability alone.

Once the Raider drops, Vader will be THE elite Imperial pilot over Soontir or Whisper... which is where has belonged all along. Can't wait.

I will also add that the Interceptor and Phantom are not the ships that will disappear. Once the TIE/A fix hits, you can kiss the Defender goodbye (not that you see it much anyway).

Vader will be a LOT bulkier than any interceptor. Vader gets 2 actions per turn and is not limited to green moves afterwards, his offensive potential is higher with ATC, and Vader gets +2 shields plus a free EPT slot.

Flying Vader as an arc dodger isn't the wrong way to do it, but I think Vader has the survivability and offensive presence that simply jousting with him will be a viable strategy.

Vader can arc-dodge, but shouldn't if it costs him a shot (or arguably even an action, depending on whose arc it is). Interceptors, meanwhile, rely upon arc-dodging just to stay alive; sacrificing a shot to avoid being killified is perfectly acceptable.

Soontir

*relatively cheaper thanks to base cost and no need to equip engine for boost action

*inherently superior dial

*ability to equip auto-thrusters

Vader

*Inherently superior defensive stat-line

*Better dial relative to a stressed interceptor, inferior in general

*ATC should guarantee more overall damage, but is slightly more difficult to set-up than normal shots (costing an action to reapply it doesn't hurt Vader much, but it is not as efficient as it could be)

Vader's going to be a nice option to have. He can arc-dodge most likely, but I'm wondering if we can't just use him without slapping on an additional four points. Doing so would turn him into a mini-phantom essentially, half-way between soontir and whisper, but I wonder if running him cheaper would be viable.

One thing he has that no one else does, however, is the ability to run V.I at PS 11 effectively. Soontir can run V.I at Ps 11, but not at all effectively.

Soontir

*relatively cheaper thanks to base cost and no need to equip engine for boost action

*inherently superior dial

*ability to equip auto-thrusters

Vader

*Inherently superior defensive stat-line

*Better dial relative to a stressed interceptor, inferior in general

*ATC should guarantee more overall damage, but is slightly more difficult to set-up than normal shots (costing an action to reapply it doesn't hurt Vader much, but it is not as efficient as it could be)

Vader's going to be a nice option to have. He can arc-dodge most likely, but I'm wondering if we can't just use him without slapping on an additional four points. Doing so would turn him into a mini-phantom essentially, half-way between soontir and whisper, but I wonder if running him cheaper would be viable.

One thing he has that no one else does, however, is the ability to run V.I at PS 11 effectively. Soontir can run V.I at Ps 11, but not at all effectively.

Vader and Fel in the same list would be pretty fun. Tons of actions all around.

Vader

Tie/x1 title

ATC

Ruthlessness or Predator

EU optional

Thanks for the replies. So do you think a list with Vader and a couple of ties jousting and Soontir flanking would be competitive?

Vader and Fel in the same list would be pretty fun.

I would desperately like to fly a list with vader, soontir and a VI whisper, but there just aren't quite enough points in a standard fine, so I have to talk someone into a slightly bigger game.

Thanks for the replies. So do you think a list with Vader and a couple of ties jousting and Soontir flanking would be competitive?

Anything can be competitive in a vacuum if flown right. This list could be fun and could hold its own, absolutely. Are there counters? Sure. But you could hold your own against a lot of competition.

Vader will be nearly as dodgy, but inherently tougher and more effective offensively before you even add an EPT. Add Predator or Outmaneuver and even deadlier. Add VI for supreme initiative bid. Add a support EPT since he is elite based on his ability alone.

Once the Raider drops, Vader will be THE elite Imperial pilot over Soontir or Whisper... which is where has belonged all along. Can't wait.

I will also add that the Interceptor and Phantom are not the ships that will disappear. Once the TIE/A fix hits, you can kiss the Defender goodbye (not that you see it much anyway).

I think Vader being an actual threat will make him stronger to pair up with a Defender actually. Vader giving Rexler double actions from squad leader then being able to evade since he has 2/2 hits anyway with accuracy corrector is terrifying. I don't think the Tie Advanced and the Defender serve the same role anyway, so I'm not sure that there will be a decrease.

Vader will be nearly as dodgy, but inherently tougher and more effective offensively before you even add an EPT. Add Predator or Outmaneuver and even deadlier. Add VI for supreme initiative bid. Add a support EPT since he is elite based on his ability alone.

Once the Raider drops, Vader will be THE elite Imperial pilot over Soontir or Whisper... which is where has belonged all along. Can't wait.

I will also add that the Interceptor and Phantom are not the ships that will disappear. Once the TIE/A fix hits, you can kiss the Defender goodbye (not that you see it much anyway).

Vessery just loves being in a squad with ATCs, so I don't expect he'll be going anywhere. You also can't put cannons on /x1s.

Vader and Fel in the same list would be pretty fun.

I would desperately like to fly a list with vader, soontir and a VI whisper, but there just aren't quite enough points in a standard fine, so I have to talk someone into a slightly bigger game.

Darth Vader — TIE Advanced 29

Veteran Instincts 1

Advanced Targeting Computer 1

TIE/x1 0

Soontir Fel — TIE Interceptor 27

Push the Limit 3

Autothrusters 2

"Whisper" — TIE Phantom 32

Veteran Instincts 1

Advanced Cloaking Device 4

Vader and Fel in the same list would be pretty fun.

I would desperately like to fly a list with vader, soontir and a VI whisper, but there just aren't quite enough points in a standard fine, so I have to talk someone into a slightly bigger game.

Darth Vader — TIE Advanced 29

Veteran Instincts 1

Advanced Targeting Computer 1

TIE/x1 0

Soontir Fel — TIE Interceptor 27

Push the Limit 3

Autothrusters 2

"Whisper" — TIE Phantom 32

Veteran Instincts 1

Advanced Cloaking Device 4

I would go for calculation over veteran on vader, with 2 attacks he can make the most use of it.

Why Vader?

Because Vader.

It is a self-evident truth, a logical tautology.

Vader

Tie/x1 title

ATC

Ruthlessness or Predator

EU optional

Engine Upgrade is never optional.

Vader + Accuracy corrector = 2 hits every time and 100% of the time

Sounds to me that Vader and Soontir will become a deadly 1-2 punch once the Raider drops.

I'm still not sure what Vader is bringing to the table

He's Darth F***ing Vader, that's what!

- H8

Well, he's no Juno Eclipse, but he might be worth flying all the same.

Vader + Accuracy corrector = 2 hits every time and 100% of the time

2 hit results that can be evaded by your opponents agility dice and/or tokens. Accuracy Corrector should have its uses but I think Vader will be stronger with Advanced Targeting Computer.

Soontir

*relatively cheaper thanks to base cost and no need to equip engine for boost action

*inherently superior dial

*ability to equip auto-thrusters

Vader

*Inherently superior defensive stat-line

*Better dial relative to a stressed interceptor, inferior in general

*ATC should guarantee more overall damage, but is slightly more difficult to set-up than normal shots (costing an action to reapply it doesn't hurt Vader much, but it is not as efficient as it could be)

Vader's going to be a nice option to have. He can arc-dodge most likely, but I'm wondering if we can't just use him without slapping on an additional four points. Doing so would turn him into a mini-phantom essentially, half-way between soontir and whisper, but I wonder if running him cheaper would be viable.

One thing he has that no one else does, however, is the ability to run V.I at PS 11 effectively. Soontir can run V.I at Ps 11, but not at all effectively.

You also forgot Vader has an open EPT slot for predator/outmaneuver/wingman/whatever. It makes him more expensive yet, relative to Soontir but how often do you wish you had PTL+Outmaneuver on your Interceptor?

Because no one can place a Proton Rocket better than him.

Put Vader in a shuttle or on the Decimator. You will find Vader is brutal in the game.

Vader

Tie/x1 title

ATC

Ruthlessness or Predator

EU optional

Ruthlessness is a terrible ept. Friendly fire isn't. Shooting your own blockers is not reckless, it is dumb which Vader is not.

Predator is vastly superior on a Tie Advanced, because it has only two red dice to roll.

EU on Vader is anything but optional. Only with EU you can make the most of Vader two actions, making him the ultimate arc dodger.