Corrupting a sister of battle.

What say the community?

HERESY!!!

Sorry that was the automated Standard Imperial Responce To Everything.

I think current canon has it that no sister has ever fallen. But as we all have established on this forum: "There is no canon".

Also i take this as no sister has voluntarily of her own accord turned to chaos. That doesn't mean none got captured and brainwashed into joining chaos or having their souls ripped out and replaced by daemons trough the use of some chaos macguffin.

I say it should be possible. Chaos sisters are cool.

And not just the slaaneshi dominatrix mother superior with elctrowhips. But also Ordo Hospitaler taken over by Nurgle (shudder) or the "Brides of Blood" sisters dedicating themselves to Khorne. (Evicerators for the win!) And the flamers! Tzeentch likes flames! Tzeentch like nun packing flamethrowers now twisted to his cause!

A thing I was wondering wasn't so much what the lore had to say (I usually do what sounds cool anyway) but more like what the crowd response was as a way of gauging my group's response when they fight a squad of corrupted sisters.

Show your players a pic of an adepta sororita making out with Cultist-Chan. If they like it then they will accept corrupted sisters. If they go "that only happens on 4chan not in the official universe" then they have a problem with chaos sisters.

I'm kinda interested in what Lynata's response will be...

I got money on "Incomming Extreminatus"

well cannon say unlikely so this is were the fun is true sisters are so closed off that chaos think them not worth the time.

so found your set of sisters and DIY to be true brides the emperor

It's one of the absolute no-gos in our current game, because we like having elements that are "incorruptable" in our universe. It forces us to switch around our M.O..

Though, technically, our sisters are cultists of the warp god of order and the guy bound into the golden throne is actually a very pissed off personified Necoho, so there's actually a reason you can't corrupt them as in, they're already (unknowing) cultists of a very powerful warp entity. But that's just our headcanon for the current campaign (it may all be different in the next!), the main reason is as first stated.

In the end, it's really up to you how you want to run your battlesisters, and if you want to open the door of the uncorruptable being corruptable, and how far.

Well I think you could corrupt sisters, personally. I also think if you wanna corrupt some you better work preeety darn hard for it. Part of my thinking though, is what could potentially make them turn on their own?

Sisters of Battle can and have fallen to chaos by accounts of official fluff.

Their poster child is Miriael Sabathiel that is the only one that willingly turned to chaos. Also she leads a warband of fallen sisters that were send to kill her and, after they were corrupted by her, now serve her.

So yea, it is perfectly possible for a sister to fall to chaos by being corrupted or manipulated and it happened several times. Not that often as in other institutions of the imperium but they are far from being save.

ATM the only faction where nobody has fallen to chaos are the grey knights. One of the reasons they exist in the first place.

I would never expect to turn a grey knight, that sounds too painful and kinda retarded to even try. Sisters though....well it seems people aren't totally opposed to the idea, iz gut.

Besides their Faith sisters have no resistance to corruption. Way to corrupt a Sister? Take away her faith which might be rather difficult but to corrupt her faith is the way to go. Or simply go by the more "drastic" steps.

Their strength is that as long as their believe-system is intact you wont find any sister that actively goes out and ask the chaos gods for strength (Besides Miriael that set a precedent) but that makes them still vulnerable to an "infection" of their believe-system or simply physical corruption that later on might affect the mind.

Best example? Their origin where they follow the WRONG faith that might be very well considered heresy by imperial standards. They blindly follow what they think and believe is right, no matter what it actually is. That is their strength and weakness.

There is a Reason the Imperium throws humongous resources at the Grey Knights and why they are considered to be the final gift of the emperor against the taint of chaos. Simply because they have that snowflake ability that sets them apart from everybody .

Alright. So we seem to generally accept its possible to corrupt sisters, if difficult.

Now another thing. My Nurgle Sorceror managed to acquire the service of a large pack of Kroot Cannibals. How possie would it be to genuinely corrupt Kroot? What's our thoughts on this?

I vaguely remember Kroots Getting corrupted by eating Chaos Worshipers. That is also a reason their Shapers forbid them to do so.

Making them eating such stuff by force seems to be the way to go though other means should work just as fine.

What will you create that way? I dont know, be creative.

Given how corruption works, faith ought to be the best resistance. But if we would follow GW's description of their lives, a good deal of their protection against corruption would not come from faith, but simply from not knowing better .

They never had a normal life. No parents. No toys. No fancy food. No love. Corruption is based on an individual's wishes and dreams - reduce the amount of said wishes and dreams (such as by, say, lack of experience, and a 100% monastic-ascetic lifestyle), and you reduce the amount of possible "hooks" for corruption to take hold.

I think a good description can be found in the short story "Daemonblood" by Ben Counter:

Also she leads a warband of fallen sisters that were send to kill her and, after they were corrupted by her, now serve her.

That bit is actually fan-fiction. Don't trust stuff on some wiki without verifying the source.

Miriael is the one exception from the rule - in the version of the background that features her (Dan Abnett's short story + the Sabertooth CCG), that is what makes her special. In the official material, her warband is a bunch of cultists, daemonettes, and Emperor's Children CSM.

As to the topic in general ... like Robin Graves already pointed out, there is no canon . In details such as these, the official material provides different sources all depending on where you look:

Games Workshop codices consistently state that "the Sisters of Battle are totally incorruptible" (WD #211, Chapter Approved 2, 2E codex p.57, 6E codex p.35) - however, in contrast, we frequently see the exact opposite in various author interpretations published via the Black Library, where the range of corrupted Battle Sisters ranges from a single abberation (Miriael Sabathiel in "The Invitation") to entire Orders ("Daemonifuge"). As usual in such cases, you will simply have to pick which of the many versions you prefer, although I tend to recommend discussing these things with the entire group so as to preserve a common ground in background interpretation.

It boils down to how you see the army and what you perceive as its perks. Myself, I "grew up" on GW's original descriptions, and as such I continue to see faith and purity as the Sisterhood's foremost traits, and their resilience against corruption is a result of that. To me, taking this away would be chipping at the foundation of this army's very identity, similar to what happened with the re-imagined Necrons whose leaders now have actual personalities. But just as some people prefer the Newcrons to the Oldcrons, I'm sure there are some who would prefer Sororitas who are less special on the basis of their faith offering less protection against corruption. Just like there are people who prefer Sororitas to be way more numerous (many millions) than they were presented in GW's books (fewer than the Marines). And just like there are people who generally prefer them to be weaker because they are "only human".

As far as my personal interpretation of the 41st millennium is concerned, I've taken a liking to Miriael Sabathiel, as her existence strikes me as a "happy medium" between both extremes of total protection and lack of protection. I consider the idea of something being totally incorruptible similarly bland as something being totally invincible - it reeks of comic book superpowers. And yes, on the same grounds I also consider the Grey Knights not to be totally incorruptible (otherwise, why would they feel a need to kill a bunch of SoB for their pure blood as protection? doesn't that imply that SoB are more resistant than GK? ). However, by limiting the occurrences of these failings to one or a few exceptions, we can preserve the spirit and identity of the Sororitas (or the Grey Knights) whilst still accounting for a more gritty realism. The best of both worlds! Plus, their rarity would make for a truly special encounter when the players eventually do meet one of these named characters, rather than just introducing yet another "unit type".

So ... why not just have Miriael show up in your game? As a Champion of Slaanesh, owner of an Inferno-class battlecruiser, and leader of a sizeable Chaos host, she might be a formidable ally .. or rival. And quite special, on the basis of being unique.

That sounds reasonable - probably the easiest way to go. Although I suppose it would also be possible as a lengthier process by undermining their animalistic beliefs .. do Kroot "pray", do they have shrines?

I recall there was a bunch of Orks in some official book who were corrupted by praying to a shrine of Nurgle when they thought it was a shrine to Gork.

Silly Orks XD

Well now I guess....what about other aliens? What would happen if a Tau (gasp) fell to Chaos? Yeah yeah "their souls are raisins" well if you get a bunch of them.....also if he causes slaughter and mayhem does it really matter?

It was pretty instantanious with the Kroot, actually. The account of it is in the fire warrior's report of how the Tau killed Slaanesh*, and he claims it was an instant transformation that happened rather abruptly, the moment the kroot who'd eaten chaos worshippers faced a chaos army.

And Tau don't fall to chaos. They're literally wired not to get it, genetically AND ideologically. Not even Farsight, who's been weilding a daemon weapon for ages, has fallen.

'ere we go, straight out of white dwarf:

http://redelf.narod.ru/w40k/ix/ix_tau_victories.html

*No, they didn't, but they genuinely THINK they did

Farsight has a Daemon Weapon?????

I want it.....

So Kroot are pretty easy to turn really. My player will be most pleased this Friday

Yup, kroot are easy. Here's the new codex take on Farsight's Dawn Blade, btw:

http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Dawn_Blade
The chronographic alloy is fairly new. I recall distinctly it used to be a daemon weapon (implied to be of Malal's; they snuck that in there rather nicely) and it did at least influence him enough to split from the ethereals...but not enough to actually fall to chaos.

So that's why Farsight turned away from the ethereals.....

Cheeky old bastard XD

And Tau don't fall to chaos. They're literally wired not to get it, genetically AND ideologically.

Yeah - at least in GW's material. Their d100 Inquisitor game even gave Tau characters the following perk:

Blunt : All Tau have virtually no psychic presence in the Warp. To the daemon, they appear as a shifting will-o-the-wisp rather than the burning fire that represents a human's soul. As such, Tau can never have psychic powers. All daemons, daemonhosts and other denizens of the Warp attempting to detect a Tau have -50% to their Awareness rolls and must roll even when the Tau is in plain sight. If they fail this detection roll, they must act as if they had no knowledge of the Tau's presence.

They just seem to ... lack the link, so to say? Like a computer cannot get infected with a virus if you never connect it to the internets. Although I'd once again say "never say never" - even if their presence is almost invisible, it is still there, so in this version of the background they must still have some sort of link, however faint. As such I'd apply the same train of thought as with Sororitas and Grey Knights: if you have one corrupted, use them as a special, unique nemesis; a warlord in their own right, or at least a very powerful "right hand" type of character of an even more terrible foe.

That's just my personal feelings on the subject, though. As mentioned before, it'd be perfectly alright to follow a different interpretation! With details such as these, there is no "wrong", merely a question of what official material you wish to align with.

ATM the only faction where nobody has fallen to chaos are the grey knights. One of the reasons they exist in the first place.

Never seen a black templar to fall either. Maybe I'm missing something.

Also, corrupting SoB is kind of not a challenge. Try corrupting a psychic blank. Try playing as a chaos-worshipping psychic blank: you genuinely like heretical ideas, you make sacrifices and rituals, you pray to the Ruinous Powers with all your heart, you tried summoning a Daemon once or twice, yet your prayers fall on deaf ears.

But you have faith.

Never seen a black templar to fall either. Maybe I'm missing something.

Just like with the SoB, it depends on which official books you look at. If you want Chaos-corrupted Black Templars, get "Daemonifuge". Sororitas are not the only ones that fall to Chaos there .

But what does it say about the purity of the Sororitas and the GKs when the latter's own codex states that the Grey Knights needed the Sisters' blood to protect themselves against Chaos? Food for thought - depending on whether or not the codex is part of one's interpretation of the Grey Knights, of course.

Well, the Imperium widely uses the bones and blood of martyrs as relics and does rather crazy stuff with these. The sororitas became only martyrs in a less fashionable sense though it is somewhat understandable.

Playing with blood and the remains of the dead is not only a chaos thingy.

Also my knowledge is rather shrouded here but wasn't it about the Bloodtide? If that is the same one Voldorius used this is in fact some sort of corrupted nano-machine from the dark age. If that is still the case one might also argue that their blood was turned into a ward against that very machine and its physical effects, not its corruption.

As for the matter "who can fall" everyone can - excluding those that are stated to be incapable to do so (And here only the GK life up to that statement in their dex). In that regard even BTs can fall. Nobody is safe from corruption except some snowflakes and that is very much the grim nature of chaos.

As mentioned even a Blank can fall to chaos. To be corrupted you have to embrace the ideas of chaos and that might happen with every sentient species. Your chaos gods might have no direct link to you and hence wont benefit from your emotions. But that does not mean you cant slaughter thousands of others in the name of the gods. Some people just want to see the world burn and dont do it for some gifts only.

So what could be a reason say, a Tau would fall?

We all agree this would be a very weird circumstance.

But what if he spent too much time away from the Greater Good, the same way Imperials fall from being away from the Ecclesiarchy too long?