Congratulations Gigerstreak

Hrmm... I have scoured my books (I have all of them) and can't seem to find it. This would have been great during my session before last. Darn. Thank you for telling me. If you remember where it came from please hit me up!

It's from "Rescue at Glare Peak" the Rebellion Day adventure from 2014. https://www.fantasyflightgames.com/en/news/2014/7/18/rebellion-day/

Not available yet unless you somehow got it from a store that hosted it.

I ran this event at my LFGS. I have the module. It says if VADER meets PC's.. Party looses.<------------- ( Look close...That's a big fat PERIOD at the end of that sentence.)

Actually to be honest it says if he arrives at the facility.. so.. it maters not, dont even have to be in the same room just same building.. and Party LOOSES!!!

Yeah, what actually bothered me in most Star Wars Games are that the heroes are High Level gods, never see it in them, actually, I think it is more opposed to the idea of the underdogs with a good heart who fight a superior force. I don´t think that they are better than the PCs in the parallel stage (if you see IV as starting point, V as mid-campaign and VI as Campaign end). So good that FFG has not put me through that anger again .

But anyone found a Boba Fett Type Gadgeteer Bounty Hunter NPC yet? Or a Sith apprentice? Would spare me the work of building them myself...

What I would like to see would be NPC generating rules like they did with the Inquisitor, would spare me a great amount of time, and that is for me the only annoying thing I know of being a GM, the time consuming-calculating- NPC-building... at least the FFG rules are not very complicated, so this goes faster than in most games.

Patching them together from the Stats in the books, to get what I want, works but the Inquisitor way is a great thing... ...

A generator like that could give the people at least an opportunity to build NPC like canon heroes like Leia fairly fast, if they want to see them...

Yeah, what actually bothered me in most Star Wars Games are that the heroes are High Level gods, never see it in them, actually, I think it is more opposed to the idea of the underdogs with a good heart who fight a superior force. I don´t think that they are better than the PCs in the parallel stage (if you see IV as starting point, V as mid-campaign and VI as Campaign end). So good that FFG has not put me through that anger again .

But anyone found a Boba Fett Type Gadgeteer Bounty Hunter NPC yet? Or a Sith apprentice? Would spare me the work of building them myself...

What I would like to see would be NPC generating rules like they did with the Inquisitor, would spare me a great amount of time, and that is for me the only annoying thing I know of being a GM, the time consuming-calculating- NPC-building... at least the FFG rules are not very complicated, so this goes faster than in most games.

Patching them together from the Stats in the books, to get what I want, works but the Inquisitor way is a great thing... ...

A generator like that could give the people at least an opportunity to build NPC like canon heroes like Leia fairly fast, if they want to see them...

Give a listen to the NPC deli episode of the order 66 podcast. Not that I ever listen. but I hear they did a great discusion on the topic.

Yeah, what actually bothered me in most Star Wars Games are that the heroes are High Level gods, never see it in them, actually, I think it is more opposed to the idea of the underdogs with a good heart who fight a superior force. I don´t think that they are better than the PCs in the parallel stage (if you see IV as starting point, V as mid-campaign and VI as Campaign end). So good that FFG has not put me through that anger again .

But anyone found a Boba Fett Type Gadgeteer Bounty Hunter NPC yet? Or a Sith apprentice? Would spare me the work of building them myself...

What I would like to see would be NPC generating rules like they did with the Inquisitor, would spare me a great amount of time, and that is for me the only annoying thing I know of being a GM, the time consuming-calculating- NPC-building... at least the FFG rules are not very complicated, so this goes faster than in most games.

Patching them together from the Stats in the books, to get what I want, works but the Inquisitor way is a great thing... ...

A generator like that could give the people at least an opportunity to build NPC like canon heroes like Leia fairly fast, if they want to see them...

Give a listen to the NPC deli episode of the order 66 podcast. Not that I ever listen. but I hear they did a great discusion on the topic.

Man, that is long. As far as I can see, they are more diskussing about how to create GOOD NPCs. I would like to get a system about creating NPCs fast. Maybe I´m making myself one... investig in the future so to speak

NPC creation is pretty fast on Edge.

Get the main essence of the NPC. Determine if it's a Minion, Rival, Nemesis. Add Specie/Stats. Put some talents, no need to follow a "restrictive" path, just pick some talents or special abilities if needed. Determine Skill Ranks just to main Skills or "on the screen" ones and finally, some basic equipment to fulfill its purposes.

This is a creation from zero. Also you can get the samples from the books and just adapt them.

Happy gaming

Yeah, what actually bothered me in most Star Wars Games are that the heroes are High Level gods, never see it in them, actually, I think it is more opposed to the idea of the underdogs with a good heart who fight a superior force. I don´t think that they are better than the PCs in the parallel stage (if you see IV as starting point, V as mid-campaign and VI as Campaign end). So good that FFG has not put me through that anger again .

But anyone found a Boba Fett Type Gadgeteer Bounty Hunter NPC yet? Or a Sith apprentice? Would spare me the work of building them myself...

What I would like to see would be NPC generating rules like they did with the Inquisitor, would spare me a great amount of time, and that is for me the only annoying thing I know of being a GM, the time consuming-calculating- NPC-building... at least the FFG rules are not very complicated, so this goes faster than in most games.

Patching them together from the Stats in the books, to get what I want, works but the Inquisitor way is a great thing... ...

A generator like that could give the people at least an opportunity to build NPC like canon heroes like Leia fairly fast, if they want to see them...

Give a listen to the NPC deli episode of the order 66 podcast. Not that I ever listen. but I hear they did a great discusion on the topic.

Man, that is long. As far as I can see, they are more diskussing about how to create GOOD NPCs. I would like to get a system about creating NPCs fast. Maybe I´m making myself one... investig in the future so to speak

That would be because NPC generation is fast already. So the important part is how to generate good ones.

NPC creation? Easy peasy. Have your concept ready and then use Oggdude's GM Tools .

Yeah, what actually bothered me in most Star Wars Games are that the heroes are High Level gods, never see it in them, actually, I think it is more opposed to the idea of the underdogs with a good heart who fight a superior force. I don´t think that they are better than the PCs in the parallel stage (if you see IV as starting point, V as mid-campaign and VI as Campaign end). So good that FFG has not put me through that anger again .

But anyone found a Boba Fett Type Gadgeteer Bounty Hunter NPC yet? Or a Sith apprentice? Would spare me the work of building them myself...

What I would like to see would be NPC generating rules like they did with the Inquisitor, would spare me a great amount of time, and that is for me the only annoying thing I know of being a GM, the time consuming-calculating- NPC-building... at least the FFG rules are not very complicated, so this goes faster than in most games.

Patching them together from the Stats in the books, to get what I want, works but the Inquisitor way is a great thing... ...

A generator like that could give the people at least an opportunity to build NPC like canon heroes like Leia fairly fast, if they want to see them...

Give a listen to the NPC deli episode of the order 66 podcast. Not that I ever listen. but I hear they did a great discusion on the topic.

Man, that is long. As far as I can see, they are more diskussing about how to create GOOD NPCs. I would like to get a system about creating NPCs fast. Maybe I´m making myself one... investig in the future so to speak

That would be because NPC generation is fast already. So the important part is how to generate good ones.

As you said, it is really simple and fast. And it is always interesting to hear about the many theories how to create good NPCs that were floating arount the last decades. My point was, that FFG Star Wars has the opportunity, because of it´s way to handle NPCs, to present a really quick stack together system, which would make NPC creation really fast (you can always stick to the CharGen rules if a character needs more attention). Less time to generate NPCs is for me more time to generate the actual adventure. And time gets a bit scarce now I´m reaching mid-30. I saw the Inquisitor system and thought: man, THIS for the regulars would be great. Some packs of Attributes, some packs of skills, both themed for a purpose and different the character level, a list of NPC talents like advercary and a guideline how many points you can spent depending of the character level -BAM- that would be great.

But maybe I will do it myself in the next weeks, when I got a few hours to spare.

If I was to involve canon characters in my games, I'd just use the nearest equivalent from the relevant core rulebook. I'd never have Darth Vader as someone the PCs could fight, but I might be inclined to use some of the scum and villainy types - in which case the entries in the back of Edge would easily suffice for me.

Darth Vadar stats: if you're a PC and make a challenge against Darth Vadar you lose.

There does that help?

I was foolish enough to have Vader (as Anakin attacking the temple) walk up to the PCs in the Jedi Temple as they were escaping with the younglings. One PC was willing to sacrifice himself to save everyone. Vader went to toss him aside with Move but I gave the PC the benefit of the doubt and actually rolled his discipline. Well.... as it turned out the PC had a 5 Willpower and 3 discipline. With some destiny in there, he managed to use a Triumph/Despair effectively. He went sailing into the Turbolift but Anakin also got knocked backward off of his feet. It was a funny "Ouch... Did I win?" but it allowed them to escape with the younglings and that PC to earn Obligation 5 (Nemesis-Anakin/Vader). This goes to show, if you allow your PCs to even roll VS. a Movie Villain, they can always pull off something. In this case it just upped the tension, but how would you Stat Vader to handle an autofire murderhobo?

Again major NPC at the beginning not meant to be harmed and seem like a god-- Vadar force crushes the hobo's gun automatically. Aka...tell the PCs this is a god compared to you. Move along.

Darth Vadar stats: if you're a PC and make a challenge against Darth Vadar you lose.

There does that help?

I was foolish enough to have Vader (as Anakin attacking the temple) walk up to the PCs in the Jedi Temple as they were escaping with the younglings. One PC was willing to sacrifice himself to save everyone. Vader went to toss him aside with Move but I gave the PC the benefit of the doubt and actually rolled his discipline. Well.... as it turned out the PC had a 5 Willpower and 3 discipline. With some destiny in there, he managed to use a Triumph/Despair effectively. He went sailing into the Turbolift but Anakin also got knocked backward off of his feet. It was a funny "Ouch... Did I win?" but it allowed them to escape with the younglings and that PC to earn Obligation 5 (Nemesis-Anakin/Vader). This goes to show, if you allow your PCs to even roll VS. a Movie Villain, they can always pull off something. In this case it just upped the tension, but how would you Stat Vader to handle an autofire murderhobo?

Again major NPC at the beginning not meant to be harmed and seem like a god-- Vadar force crushes the hobo's gun automatically. Aka...tell the PCs this is a god compared to you. Move along.

To be honest; i am a firm advoate of "Autofire requires one additional advantage for every additional shot taken." drastically cuts down on the number of shots fired. Though I would probably build a PC with Force Sheild and simply go "In responce to that, as a powerful villain he has the power to manipulate his own destiny, the major villian knew your likely reaction and errects a force sheild, blocking with his hand, drastically reducing your damage combined with reflect. With that resolved, it's his turn. With his action he yanks the weapon out of your hand over to his side and begins to advance menchingly." Though I would do this to anyone, not just an auto fire person if it felt apporiate.

The other suggestion is that villians are never seen to engage a entire "party" of players. They either turn out unexpectingly out of the blue (Both Maul and many of vaders appearances are completely unannounced.) or they are only accessable to the select few (Only Obi-Wan and Anakin were able to reach Dooku, only Obi-Wan was there to fight Vader on the Deathstar, only Luke was crazy enough to seek out Vader alone on both occations) hence suggests that they are far from unbeatable; just unless there are combatants that can force the meeting, the villian will likely only engage the party when the odds likely to be with him.

As someone already mentioned, canon characters have their own stories. The campaigns that we run aren't about them, they're about the PCs and their stories. If, for some reason, the PCs cross paths with a canon storyline, I might make a vague reference to a canon character, but that's about it. I have no desire to actually include any of these characters into my campaign since my campaign isn't about them at all. As such, I couldn't care less about having stats for them.

Luke, Leia, Han, Vader, and Obi-Wan have already had their story told. It's now time for the PCs to have a story of their own.

Mixed feelings on this. I loved and hope to see movie/book sourcebooks like West End did with main characters stat's done progressively through the story. Like Luke AOBY[as of battle of Yavin] AOBH [as of battle of Hoth] etc… but then your going to get those players that are going to want to take out the Emperor or Darth Vader and will be more than capable and have their stats memorized and will know if you add extra talents powers etc. so, I guess I would prefer to do that myself.

If we just create everythings just thinking about cheats, powers gamers (the bad ones XD) and those people that doesn't care about true roleplay, at last we will have more protection rules and hard mechanics and restrictions than fun or options.

The same way that starship, weapons/armors, beasts or other NPC's (minor generally) are stated, there is no apparent reason (apart from personal point of view of course) to not craete them (or at least a "scenario version" like Lando). For example, one of my players doesn't agree with starfighter stats and want to improve his one to defeat Imperial TIE's but, I love that people from FFG created those base sample to work on them.

I don' like "Luke killers" or "stats analyzers to win", but, I don't let them guide my game (Or directly I don't play with them or just kill them with explosive protocol droids XDD)

I loved the WEG books, especially the movie/book sourcebooks. It let my group play with "What If" stories occassionally, which can be fun for breathing fresh life into a universe that can be quoted back to front. ALL of my group have seen the movies dozens of times, and know the setting in minute detail. Throw them a big enough loop and it can make things fresh. I also like to have stats just in case. As they become more important in the rebellion the greater the chance of meeting the heroes, or at least the villians.

You don't need stats for your players to meet these guys.

You don't need stats for your players to meet these guys.

Of course I do. Otherwise I'm not being fair to the players. If there is something they do that requires rolled interaction - an Opposed Roll or a combat, then without stats I'm just arbitrarily deciding on the spot whether I want the players to succeed or fail. That's not how I play. The universe MUST be impartial. It can be cruel, it can be almost impossible to overcome, it can be utterly one-sided but it MUST be because that's what is appropriate, not because someone just says "you win" or "you lose" according to their whim. To do that, is to take away the one thing players control.

You don't need stats for your players to meet these guys.

Of course I do. Otherwise I'm not being fair to the players. If there is something they do that requires rolled interaction - an Opposed Roll or a combat, then without stats I'm just arbitrarily deciding on the spot whether I want the players to succeed or fail. That's not how I play. The universe MUST be impartial. It can be cruel, it can be almost impossible to overcome, it can be utterly one-sided but it MUST be because that's what is appropriate, not because someone just says "you win" or "you lose" according to their whim. To do that, is to take away the one thing players control.

So make them. You do not need them to be from FFG. FFG is not going to provide them. They just lead to arguments.

You don't need stats for your players to meet these guys.

Of course I do. Otherwise I'm not being fair to the players. If there is something they do that requires rolled interaction - an Opposed Roll or a combat, then without stats I'm just arbitrarily deciding on the spot whether I want the players to succeed or fail. That's not how I play. The universe MUST be impartial. It can be cruel, it can be almost impossible to overcome, it can be utterly one-sided but it MUST be because that's what is appropriate, not because someone just says "you win" or "you lose" according to their whim. To do that, is to take away the one thing players control.

So make them. You do not need them to be from FFG. FFG is not going to provide them. They just lead to arguments.

I can apply that to anything and everything in the book. No Nebulon-B stats? Just make them. Not everything in every book will be of use to everyone. That's an inescapable fact. The difference with this argument is that some people take a special exception about named characters and want nobody to have them. Do we ever have arguments where people get angry about the inclusion of Personal Defence Shields and because they don't personally use them? No we don't - people just shrug and enjoy the parts of the book that they do use and are generally happy that those who do want them get to have them even if it's not of interest to them. But when it comes to named characters, suddenly it's an insistence that they shouldn't be included. So is the real reason that GM's who want them "can just make them"? Of course it isn't - you would rule out half the book with that. The argument that you "can just make them" is tacked on afterwards to dismiss the desires of people who would like such things.

You admit as much when you say "they just lead to arguments". Well if you don't like the published stats, you can 'just change them.' But it's a lot easier to do this from an existing character than ex nihilo. Published stats are very useful to many of us. Firstly for those who want to include the characters and secondly it helps us many of us new GMs get a feel for where to pitch things.

Basically, don't pretend this is about the stats not being necessary because they can be made up. The real fact is that some people get offended / upset by named characters being on the same playing field as PCs. Various posts on this so far have said named PCs should be "gods among men", "if it has stats, the PCs can kill it" and "just say that they [the PCs] lose". I don't really care much why some people regard named characters as so sacrosanct or it to be beyond the pale for players to beat or get one over on a named character. What it comes down to is you don't see me arguing there shouldn't be Bothans in the game for other people to use just because I don't want them. But that's the principle that other people are arguing to me.

I can see a big difference between stats for equipment or ships and named characters. The former may produce some debate, but nowhere near the level of debate the latter would. Hence the reason FFG only stats them as they are needed for the situation they are in and with the stipulation that this is so. It is also the reason they will, in all likelihood, continue to do so without producing any "official" stats in any kind of compilation.

While you can do this for ships equipment etc..

They are a solid state item. A Nebulon B will always have the same stats, as will a bog standard stormtrooper. But what about Luke's? BBC, ABY, New Jedi era these are not going to be the same stat block. So you print a Nebulon B stat block once, but how many times for Luke? If so all in the same book or in books for different periods? How many times would we see him? How many times would that be what you need for your campaign? Or would you end up altering it anyway as Luke needs maxed out (battle meditation) for what you need him to do.

If so you may as well have just built him anyway.

As mouthy said, equipment/vehicle stats (even TIE Defender, lightsabers, armors or other ones) don't use to have so much controversy compared with characters (also using the "scenario Lando" version). But they still do it. Some people at the forum even comented controversies like "paper starfighters" or that Star Destroyers are "easy" to blow up.

By the way, a controversy, at least for me, isn't enough reason for "ignore" that idea completely. I think that, apart piloting skills, almost everyone liked "Scenario-Lando". And that hasn't gived us so much problems.

Thanks to "Landoscene" XD now people have full options like:

- Ignore them.

- Use them as writen.

- Use an adapted version.

Everyone can be happy. Of course without those pseudo stats you can create your own Lando, but some people like to base thei games on developers idea, that probably, are the ones who better understand what every rules means on its game. You can do your own, you can disagree or change the rules, bu the ones who better know or know the rules are probably their developers. I can be wrong of course, but this is the general sensation I use to have.

About ships and other equip stats, well, as Vixen said they use to have fixed values and if you want to change them like have an alternate Nebulon B version like "anti-starfighter, medic, anti capital, scout version" you have rules to change that "easily". The same with all TIE versions, freighter versions, Alderanian Cruiser (AKA Corelian Corvette). The same way that hey have so much alternative versions there is any reason ti post them?

My guess here is "not necessarely but...". In the D6 Dark Stryder campaign heroes used a heavily modified version of a "Corelian Corvette". That sample, at least for me, is the equivalent to the "Landoscene" and I love that.

The same with chars for me. I don't feel that I need the "Luke after wake up, Luke after easting breakfast" and so on other versions XD But a version based on a precise story or one based on the books era, could be fine ok to me. I would Like a "Lukescene", and if ever created, as with Lando, everyone could be happy with the rule of "ignore, accept or change it".

OMG I written so much again XD

I can apply that to anything and everything in the book. No Nebulon-B stats? Just make them.

No, it's not the same at all. The Nebulon-B is supposed to scale with other starships. Everything from Silhouette to hull points to damage output is set up to be relative to other benchmarks in the system.

You can't do the same thing with characters in this system. There is no technical "top", or even a "middle". In some campaigns, top might be 300XP, in others it might be 1000P+. There are no levels like in D20 where you can rank a character's relative power level.

I can see a big difference between stats for equipment or ships and named characters. The former may produce some debate, but nowhere near the level of debate the latter would. Hence the reason FFG only stats them as they are needed for the situation they are in and with the stipulation that this is so. It is also the reason they will, in all likelihood, continue to do so without producing any "official" stats in any kind of compilation.

In what world is "will generate debate" a reason for excluding such things? Debate between GMs online about such stats would be useful and informative to many. Debate with players is a non-issue since a GM can change what they wish and if you have a player telling you that your NPC can't have the stats you've given you don't blame that on the rule-book.

Seriously, this is what you're saying to me? "You can't have stats for characters because people would debate?" It may have escaped your notice but people will debate regardless.

While you can do this for ships equipment etc..

They are a solid state item. A Nebulon B will always have the same stats, as will a bog standard stormtrooper. But what about Luke's? BBC, ABY, New Jedi era these are not going to be the same stat block. So you print a Nebulon B stat block once, but how many times for Luke? If so all in the same book or in books for different periods? How many times would we see him? How many times would that be what you need for your campaign? Or would you end up altering it anyway as Luke needs maxed out (battle meditation) for what you need him to do.

If so you may as well have just built him anyway.

You realize that FFG have so far published SIX different Tie-Fighter variants (some of which are nearly identical). So by your reasoning they should not have published stat blocks for Tie-fighters and we "may as well have just built them [ourselves] anyway". The logic is the same. Three different types of astromech, too! It's a poor choice of argument you have picked to use here given the publishing history of FFG. The books actually have defined time-periods, btw. So if Luke appeared in Edge of the Empire, it would be the Luke just after the Death Star was destroyed. It's not hard and as pointed out, it is a great deal easier to start with a base (e.g. Luke post-Yavin) and adjust to taste than have to start from scratch. ESPECIALLY for newer GMs who haven't got an intuitive grasp of the power-curves in this game. Which is pretty difficult, btw, in a non-linear system like this as opposed to most RPGs where you know what 50 hit points means compared to 25 hit points. Try the equivalent with comparing a pilot with GYYY and no relevant talents vs. one that is GGGY and several from the Pilot tree. Getting an NPC right is hard in this system.

All that I am hearing is people who don't want others to have these stats making up post-fact reasons to justify their non-appearance. The way things like "you can make it up yourself" is being selectively applied tell me this is exactly what is happening, along with turning questions (which version of a character to pick) into insurmountable obstacles.