Don't listen to any of it my wonderful Star Brothers... it is just gamer-gaa-gaa-noisees, and it has absolutely no effect on what we do with our toys and how we enjoy what we love.

So Alex Davy is making "gamer-gaa-gaa-noisees"?

YES IN FACT... it is a part of his job to placate the unwashed and smile a whole lot.

Been there and did it... didn't like it and got my life in order.

But... I remember how gw and other tournaments worked.

Tought it was the Y-wings getting replaced with the B's (switching bombers for heavy fighter) I'll admit X-wings are the superior fighter in the Rebs arsenal but I'll pilot a B-wing anytime.

Rediculously overgunned, thats how i like 'em!

Dat B-Wing is a pip... in the right situation.

The X-Wing is just fine... in fact everything is fine now or soon will be (come on wit dat bad boy RAIDER!!!).

This talk of meta-fix-viable-flip-yarble is only here because of the stupid-jock-40k-space-gyrine-schmuck competitive mentality.

Don't listen to any of it my wonderful Star Brothers... it is just gamer-gaa-gaa-noisees, and it has absolutely no effect on what we do with our toys and how we enjoy what we love.

The "the stupid-jock-40k-space-gyrine-schmuck competitive mentality" refers to a large potion of X-wing's players, and without whom FFG wouldn't be making the sales necessary to continue producing this game that you love.

It's fine if you're not into the competitive aspect of the game, but lots of players are. I don't mean to sound argumentative or anything, I bet you're an awesome guy to hang with for some fun casual x-wing games, but I get the impression that your entire game design philosophy is basically "MOAR TOYZ PLZ!!! ".

I get that some people are not interested in competitive play, but saying that the xwing doesn't have issues becuase you play casually makes no sense.

The X-Wing is just fine... in fact everything is fine now or soon will be (come on wit dat bad boy RAIDER!!!).

This talk of meta-fix-viable-flip-yarble is only here because of the stupid-jock-40k-space-gyrine-schmuck competitive mentality.

Don't listen to any of it my wonderful Star Brothers... it is just gamer-gaa-gaa-noisees, and it has absolutely no effect on what we do with our toys and how we enjoy what we love.

The "the stupid-jock-40k-space-gyrine-schmuck competitive mentality" refers to a large potion of X-wing's players, and without whom FFG wouldn't be making the sales necessary to continue producing this game that you love.

It's fine if you're not into the competitive aspect of the game, but lots of players are. I don't mean to sound argumentative or anything, I bet you're an awesome guy to hang with for some fun casual x-wing games, but I get the impression that your entire game design philosophy is basically "MOAR TOYZ PLZ!!! ".

Oh I get it... but I am not going to cry like a punk until FFG feels they need to change rules that are fine as is.

I do not like the sport-mind either. I can kick your butt all day with any ship... or you will kill me, and I will have great fun either way.

Also I guarantee you that millions of people who purchase this excellent product will never be seen here arguing meta yap, or bumbling around at a convention hall.

Point of order... the EPIC ships sold out three times last year, and you barely see them discussed here in a positive way.

So who buys this game? Everyone who loves STAR WARS.

... AND a few thousand of them are gamer nerds too.

:lol:

To make your X-wings worth using you have to look at what they can do that those other ships cannot,

The X-Wing is also the only 25 point option for the rebels with 2 agility and 3 attack dice.

The BTL-A4 Y and the 2x Z-95 both have reduced damage, though they have more attacks. They do not deal with high-agility ships as well as the X.

The B and Y both have 1 agility, and do not mitigate damage as well.

....

That boardgamegeek thread was like getting in a Delorean and going 88mph..

Hey Joe Boss... I'm somewhat offended. Not with your position on the X-Wing game and balance, but the fact that you didn't pick your avatar from the available Smiley Face game avatars.

The X-Wing is just fine... in fact everything is fine now or soon will be (come on wit dat bad boy RAIDER!!!).

This talk of meta-fix-viable-flip-yarble is only here because of the stupid-jock-40k-space-gyrine-schmuck competitive mentality.

Don't listen to any of it my wonderful Star Brothers... it is just gamer-gaa-gaa-noisees, and it has absolutely no effect on what we do with our toys and how we enjoy what we love.

The "the stupid-jock-40k-space-gyrine-schmuck competitive mentality" refers to a large potion of X-wing's players, and without whom FFG wouldn't be making the sales necessary to continue producing this game that you love.

It's fine if you're not into the competitive aspect of the game, but lots of players are. I don't mean to sound argumentative or anything, I bet you're an awesome guy to hang with for some fun casual x-wing games, but I get the impression that your entire game design philosophy is basically "MOAR TOYZ PLZ!!! ".

Yeah no, I think FFG sales would be just fine even without them. Never underestimate the power of the Star Wars franchise.

I'm sure a LOT of players buy into this game just because it is Star Wars and doesn't care about the tournament scene or overall balance of the game. And those are the kind of players that will buy a lot of ship just so they can live the battle of Yavin or Endor. They don't care that the X-Wing might need a little boost, it's Luke and Wedge! They don't care that the Advanced don't see much tournament scene, it's Vader, and the Advanced is his own personal Tie.

So, as much as competitive players refers to a large portion of X-Wing players, I'm pretty sure that there is as many, or even more, casual players. This forum tend to go in the competitive discussion because that's mainly what there is to discuss, but it represents only a small margin of the X-Wing community. There's not much to discuss for casual players, except maybe for what to expect next wave or personal paint job.

...

As far as ship-fix/nerf threads goes in general, people will tend to extrapolate the problem and come with ridiculous ideas that would just makes things worst. A little boost become free actions, shared abilities, more attack dice and probably somewhere teleportation. A ship needing a little boost become a unplayable crappy ship. I'll personally try to avoid those threads now as they bring nothing except negativity and exageration of a ship weakness/power. Those ships might actually need a little boost or be overpowered, but I'll make my own judgement on the subject, instead of believing everything that is said by some overly competitive players, or just people that will say anything just to be right and prove a point. If the ship really have a problem, I have no doubt that FFG will bring a solution like they already did with the A-Wing and Tie Advanced. But thank god, they don't listen to everything that is said on this forum, because that game would have sinked a long time ago.

March is the month of the X-Wing. Care to take some bet as to which ship it's gonna be in April? Mine is the Starviper. God I love that ship, but I can already see it having the same treatment as the Defender.

The X-Wing is just fine... in fact everything is fine now or soon will be (come on wit dat bad boy RAIDER!!!).

This talk of meta-fix-viable-flip-yarble is only here because of the stupid-jock-40k-space-gyrine-schmuck competitive mentality.

Don't listen to any of it my wonderful Star Brothers... it is just gamer-gaa-gaa-noisees, and it has absolutely no effect on what we do with our toys and how we enjoy what we love.

I've never played 40k; X-wing is my first competitive minis game.

And honestly I'm getting a little tired of being insulted by you. If you don't like the thread then stay out of it. If you don't understand the arguments being made, then ask for help. But wandering in and insulting broad groups of people because they enjoy a different aspect of the game than you do hurts the community, rather than building it up.

The X-Wing is just fine... in fact everything is fine now or soon will be (come on wit dat bad boy RAIDER!!!).

This talk of meta-fix-viable-flip-yarble is only here because of the stupid-jock-40k-space-gyrine-schmuck competitive mentality.

Don't listen to any of it my wonderful Star Brothers... it is just gamer-gaa-gaa-noisees, and it has absolutely no effect on what we do with our toys and how we enjoy what we love.

I've never played 40k; X-wing is my first competitive minis game.

And honestly I'm getting a little tired of being insulted by you. If you don't like the thread then stay out of it. If you don't understand the arguments being made, then ask for help. But wandering in and insulting broad groups of people because they enjoy a different aspect of the game than you do hurts the community, rather than building it up.

Don't waste your time, he won't listen anyway and just come back with even more smilies. Just follow the advice you once gave me about a player on a vendetta against the Phantom: ignore.

There is a difference between a fix and getting a little something extra. I will never begrudge a ship for gettting some more options.

The X-Wing is just fine... in fact everything is fine now or soon will be (come on wit dat bad boy RAIDER!!!).

This talk of meta-fix-viable-flip-yarble is only here because of the stupid-jock-40k-space-gyrine-schmuck competitive mentality.

Don't listen to any of it my wonderful Star Brothers... it is just gamer-gaa-gaa-noisees, and it has absolutely no effect on what we do with our toys and how we enjoy what we love.

The "the stupid-jock-40k-space-gyrine-schmuck competitive mentality" refers to a large potion of X-wing's players, and without whom FFG wouldn't be making the sales necessary to continue producing this game that you love.

It's fine if you're not into the competitive aspect of the game, but lots of players are. I don't mean to sound argumentative or anything, I bet you're an awesome guy to hang with for some fun casual x-wing games, but I get the impression that your entire game design philosophy is basically "MOAR TOYZ PLZ!!! ".

Yeah no, I think FFG sales would be just fine even without them. Never underestimate the power of the Star Wars franchise.

I'm sure a LOT of players buy into this game just because it is Star Wars and doesn't care about the tournament scene or overall balance of the game. And those are the kind of players that will buy a lot of ship just so they can live the battle of Yavin or Endor. They don't care that the X-Wing might need a little boost, it's Luke and Wedge! They don't care that the Advanced don't see much tournament scene, it's Vader, and the Advanced is his own personal Tie.

So, as much as competitive players refers to a large portion of X-Wing players, I'm pretty sure that there is as many, or even more, casual players. This forum tend to go in the competitive discussion because that's mainly what there is to discuss, but it represents only a small margin of the X-Wing community. There's not much to discuss for casual players, except maybe for what to expect next wave or personal paint job.

...

As far as ship-fix/nerf threads goes in general, people will tend to extrapolate the problem and come with ridiculous ideas that would just makes things worst. A little boost become free actions, shared abilities, more attack dice and probably somewhere teleportation. A ship needing a little boost become a unplayable crappy ship. I'll personally try to avoid those threads now as they bring nothing except negativity and exageration of a ship weakness/power. Those ships might actually need a little boost or be overpowered, but I'll make my own judgement on the subject, instead of believing everything that is said by some overly competitive players, or just people that will say anything just to be right and prove a point. If the ship really have a problem, I have no doubt that FFG will bring a solution like they already did with the A-Wing and Tie Advanced. But thank god, they don't listen to everything that is said on this forum, because that game would have sinked a long time ago.

March is the month of the X-Wing. Care to take some bet as to which ship it's gonna be in April? Mine is the Starviper. God I love that ship, but I can already see it having the same treatment as the Defender.

ALL DAT DAT DAT... AND DAT !!!!!!!!!!!!!

DAT DAT DAT? Is that some new kind of Imperial Walker?

And just as a point of reference; I have a number of friends who're Star Wars fans, and none of them play X-wing. I also, have a local game store, that hosts a large gaming group, and half of them dove into X-wing last summer and immediately bought more ships than they knew what to do with, none of them are hardcore Star Wars fans, they just heard it was well balanced, and were pre-painted minis, because they were fed up with 40k's imbalance and painting requirements. My guess is that people who invest a lot of money in games are X-wing's biggest customers.

DAT DAT DAT? Is that some new kind of Imperial Walker?

And just as a point of reference; I have a number of friends who're Star Wars fans, and none of them play X-wing. I also, have a local game store, that hosts a large gaming group, and half of them dove into X-wing last summer and immediately bought more ships than they knew what to do with, none of them are hardcore Star Wars fans, they just heard it was well balanced, and were pre-painted minis, because they were fed up with 40k's imbalance and painting requirements. My guess is that people who invest a lot of money in games are X-wing's biggest customers.

I played a lot of the gw games for like ten years... so not all ex-gw-types are bad people. I just get a little annoyed by the dirty types that have gamer rot on 'em.

@JBR7...

You know, if you're not interested in discussions of what is lacking and how to fix it (or gently nudge it in the right direction), you don't have to participate.

Posting comments that essentially say "I have the moral high ground, neiner neiner, haha!" Would be funny if it happened once or twice. But to consistently drop in, insult people, and then claim that the people you arbitrarily insult are somehow injecting the environment with negativity is more than a little ironic. All the emoticons in the world don't make it any less hypocritical.

It also seems odd that you support the fix for the Advanced (presumably because you understand it to be underpowered), yet draw an imaginary line at fixing another weaker-than-it-ought-to-be ship. Fixing this ship is cause for joy and excitement, but discussing fixing another makes you a dumb jock? Ooookay then...

Alex Davy has repeatedly acknowledged weak ships and fixes or new toys for them--the HWK, the advanced, the interceptor, and also the X-WING.

You're implying (whether intentionally or not) that one of the core designers of the game you love and so hypocritically defend is a 'stupid-jock-40k-space-gyrine-schmuck" simply because he agrees with competitively minded players that the X-wing isn't represented as it should be. Yet you suckle from his "unwashed" "gamer rot" teat as they continue to expand this game with an eye toward balance.

If you don't care about the meta, that's totally fine, enjoy the game as you do! These conversations are irrelevant to your interests. Instead of hurling smiley barbs around, and attempting to counteract perceived negativity with spite and pettines, just avoid these threads and post another "I love everything" thread. That's what you're best at!

wow that is some big font.

Well if you cant beat em..

IT'S A GOOOD THING FFG IS NOT RELEASING X-WINGS INSIDE OF X-WINGS AS A FIX!

And just as a point of reference; I have a number of friends who're Star Wars fans, and none of them play X-wing. I also, have a local game store, that hosts a large gaming group, and half of them dove into X-wing last summer and immediately bought more ships than they knew what to do with, none of them are hardcore Star Wars fans, they just heard it was well balanced, and were pre-painted minis, because they were fed up with 40k's imbalance and painting requirements. My guess is that people who invest a lot of money in games are X-wing's biggest customers.

You're making a conclusion based on your small region (not meant to be disrespectful, but the game is sold worldwide so pretty much every region is small).

I heard that Star Trek Attack Wing is very unbalanced. Yet, it continue to sells a lot. Why? Because of the gameplay? No. Because it is Star Trek. Considering this is Wizkid producing the game, I have no doubt that D&D AW will eventualy get unbalanced (if it's not already the case), but it will still sells. Why? Because it's D&D. Theme is the main selling point, especially in miniatures game.

The 2013 Star Wars revenue from toys and games was 1.5 billion$. The toy sales in general since the release of Star Wars in 1977 is almost half the total revenue of the whole franchise.

http://www.statisticbrain.com/star-wars-total-franchise-revenue/

Star Wars fans love their toys. And in the end, X-Wing Miniatures are just that, toys. I personnally bought into the game at first because it reminded me of the micromachines I used to buy 20 years ago; only now there are rules coming with them and it just so happens that I'm a gamer. But when I'm not playing the game, my miniatures are all exposed on the wall, because it's not just a game, it's also some nice Star Wars miniatures (and my collection is worth over a thousand... such a beauty...).

So, players coming from 40k might be a decent proportion of the gamers playing this game (and I have no problem with them, by the way), but saying that ''FFG wouldn't be making the sales necessary to continue producing this game without them'' is giving them far too much credit. The game sales would not be in danger if suddenly they all decided to play another game. There is also lot of people that only play this game at home with kids and family, play scenario games or buy into it mostly to collect. For a lot of people, X-Wing is actually their entry point into miniatures gaming, and their wallet hate them for it.

That's actually the beauty of the game: You can play it in a very competitive setting and yet, it's so simple that dad can also play it with the kids.

Got to admit, had X-Wing an original theme I probably wouldn't have got it in the first place let alone spend so much on it.

However, to say that X-Wing is mostly casual is not a reason to let it be unbalanced. FFG tweaks and fixes the balance because they care about their product, it's not the "print more crap they'll buy it" approach of WizKids and Attack Wing.

If we want to have discussion about the merits of thematic or cinematic play versus competitive play or the nature of X wings consumers it probably deserves it's own thread and not hijack a thread about whether or not the X wing needs a fix.

Also it doesn't need to turn into a flame war. In my younger days I was a jock, a gamer, and a Star Wars fan, those communities are not necessarily segregated.

Its relevance is the argument some peope seem to be making that because X-Wing is mostly casual players apparently FFG shouldn't balance it, instead giving it the "print moar stuffz" balance neglect Attack Wing suffers.

Its relevance is the argument some peope seem to be making that because X-Wing is mostly casual players apparently FFG shouldn't balance it, instead giving it the "print moar stuffz" balance neglect Attack Wing suffers.

Just to be sure, I hope you're not including me because I do care about game balance and the competitive aspect of the game. I just don't think that the 40k players are what's keeping the game alive.

And just as a point of reference; I have a number of friends who're Star Wars fans, and none of them play X-wing. I also, have a local game store, that hosts a large gaming group, and half of them dove into X-wing last summer and immediately bought more ships than they knew what to do with, none of them are hardcore Star Wars fans, they just heard it was well balanced, and were pre-painted minis, because they were fed up with 40k's imbalance and painting requirements. My guess is that people who invest a lot of money in games are X-wing's biggest customers.

You're making a conclusion based on your small region (not meant to be disrespectful, but the game is sold worldwide so pretty much every region is small).

That's why I prefaced what I wrote with "as a point of reference".

I'M SHOUTING

Its relevance is the argument some peope seem to be making that because X-Wing is mostly casual players apparently FFG shouldn't balance it, instead giving it the "print moar stuffz" balance neglect Attack Wing suffers.

Just to be sure, I hope you're not including me because I do care about game balance and the competitive aspect of the game. I just don't think that the 40k players are what's keeping the game alive.

Only including the people slinging insults.

And just as a point of reference; I have a number of friends who're Star Wars fans, and none of them play X-wing. I also, have a local game store, that hosts a large gaming group, and half of them dove into X-wing last summer and immediately bought more ships than they knew what to do with, none of them are hardcore Star Wars fans, they just heard it was well balanced, and were pre-painted minis, because they were fed up with 40k's imbalance and painting requirements. My guess is that people who invest a lot of money in games are X-wing's biggest customers.

You're making a conclusion based on your small region (not meant to be disrespectful, but the game is sold worldwide so pretty much every region is small).

That's why I prefaced what I wrote with "as a point of reference".

And I thought that it was ''a point of reference'' to your earlier claim that FFG would stop producing the game if it was not for the 40k players, which I simply don't think is true.