Star Wars adds its first LGBT character . Don't know if the book is any good, but I can at least appreciate that.

Star Wars adds its first LGBT character . Don't know if the book is any good, but I can at least appreciate that.

Well Hutts are hermaphroditic so probably count, I would say.

Great work for SW people. We need more open minds, respect and tollerance in our world

Thanks for the info Mouthy!

Great work for SW people. We need more open minds, respect and tollerance in our world

Thanks for the info Mouthy!

Yes. In case my last post came across as sarcastic, this seems like a good thing. And importantly, based on your link, it's simply that the character happens to be homosexual rather than it being some mandated big deal. That, to me, is what equality is about: not special treatment, but normalization.

You should have seen the amount of "childhood ruined!", "burning my books now!" and "the fans don't want this!!!" type of replies The Star Wars Underworld got on their FB page when they covered this... It was terrible.

You should have seen the amount of "childhood ruined!", "burning my books now!" and "the fans don't want this!!!" type of replies The Star Wars Underworld got on their FB page when they covered this... It was terrible.

That... is depressing. Very depressing. Happily I think we will see none of that here. I think this community is a lot better than that.

EDIT: I mean if the character turned out to be entirely defined by this trait and was basically a one-dimensional cut-out going "did I mention that I'm a lesbian" every other page in place of characterization, then it wouldn't be good. But I'm going to give the writer more credit than that.

After seeing the reactions to a similar character on Order of the Stick, I'm afraid I can't be surprised at those reactions, as sad as they are. I, for one, am always glad to see diversity in a series that has a lot of underlying (and occasionally not-so-underlying) themes of the value of diversity against the regimented.

Here's what I wrote, in reply on the FB page;

I am officialy ashamed that a community of geeks and nerds would be so hate filled and bigoted. No matter how you chose to express your disdain for an LGBT character being introduced into a fictional universe you cannot do it without being a complete and utter homophobe.

Why on Earth are people complaining about political correctness, sexualization, the gay agenda, the injection of sex, gimmick, advertising, tokenisme, etc. etc.?

Are you out of your mind? There is a character in an upcoming Star Wars product that is not heterosexual that is all, nothing more nothing less. If that makes you feel anything other than “fine” you should really, really think about what kind of person you are and why you think it is normal that you are getting worked up over this. Now mind you, I am not talking about the people that just came out and said that “being gay is a lifestyle choice” or that wrote “homosexuality is degenerative” or the moron who said “I am not a homophobe, but I don’t want my children to read that” those idiots are a lost cause and should not even be on this page.

Those hateful morons might find a better crowd of likeminded individuals among the ranks of the Islamic State.

No, I am talking to those of you who have been ostracized for being different. To those of you that have been on the receiving end of jokes because you are part of a subculture that goes to conventions, reads books, buys comics, watches cartoons, rewatches the same movies over and over because you love a galaxy far far away. Those of you that were called geeks and dorks. Those of you that didn’t quite fit in at high school and were given a hard time.

You would judge a character for being different?

Thank you to The Star Wars Underworld for taking a stand and defending those people that have had to put up with so much bs already in their lives. You would think that people that enjoy your page be a little bit more openminded and I can only imagine your shock having to have catered to so many close minded fools for so long.

I just looked, and the comments on that Facebook page are awful... reading the comments, it's as if there never had been a single sequence involving heterosexual relationships in Star Wars before... God, as if Han and Leia, Anakin and Padme, Obi-Wan and Satine, etc. had never happened. Heck, if I was against all depiction of relationships, I'd be more doubtful of the whole Luke-Leia brother-sister thing...

I'm so happy FFG has taken a subtle pro-diversity stance on the visuals of the SWRPG. The representation of people of color (in the case of humans), of women and the often non-stereotypical take on non-humans is very inspiring, and above the norm IMHO. I especially like the reasonable outfits and armor coverage, compared to the rest of the hobby, for female characters. Very little of the usual pandering/fanservice "chainmail bikini" armor, and even Twi'Lek females, usually the main targets of Internet Rule 34, are treated with respect and "humanity" (or "twi'lek-ity"?). Just look at that totally badass Oskara from the beginner game!

Good thing we've gone from Lucas's “[...] Star Wars was designed for 12-year-old boys” to a more inclusive one. Star Wars is really popular with people of all genders now, and shows like TCW/Rebels have tremendously increased the number of canon female protagonists with a voice. I personally welcome the addition of LGBT characters, it shows the maturity of the fandom (we'll, at least, let's hope for that!).

You should have seen the amount of "childhood ruined!", "burning my books now!" and "the fans don't want this!!!" type of replies The Star Wars Underworld got on their FB page when they covered this... It was terrible.

I have only one thing to say to that... F-u-c-k Them!!.. and I will not excuse my language. I have no patience nor room for intolerance or ignorance.

Here's what I wrote, in reply on the FB page;

I am officialy ashamed that a community of geeks and nerds would be so hate filled and bigoted. No matter how you chose to express your disdain for an LGBT character being introduced into a fictional universe you cannot do it without being a complete and utter homophobe.

Why on Earth are people complaining about political correctness, sexualization, the *** agenda, the injection of sex, gimmick, advertising, tokenisme, etc. etc.?

Are you out of your mind? There is a character in an upcoming Star Wars product that is not heterosexual that is all, nothing more nothing less. If that makes you feel anything other than “fine” you should really, really think about what kind of person you are and why you think it is normal that you are getting worked up over this. Now mind you, I am not talking about the people that just came out and said that “being *** is a lifestyle choice” or that wrote “homosexuality is degenerative” or the moron who said “I am not a homophobe, but I don’t want my children to read that” those idiots are a lost cause and should not even be on this page.

Those hateful morons might find a better crowd of likeminded individuals among the ranks of the Islamic State.

No, I am talking to those of you who have been ostracized for being different. To those of you that have been on the receiving end of jokes because you are part of a subculture that goes to conventions, reads books, buys comics, watches cartoons, rewatches the same movies over and over because you love a galaxy far far away. Those of you that were called geeks and dorks. Those of you that didn’t quite fit in at high school and were given a hard time.

You would judge a character for being different?

Thank you to The Star Wars Underworld for taking a stand and defending those people that have had to put up with so much bs already in their lives. You would think that people that enjoy your page be a little bit more openminded and I can only imagine your shock having to have catered to so many close minded fools for so long.

Why?! Why?! Why can I only like this once? Well said.

Bravo, Dante.

Here's what I wrote, in reply on the FB page;

I am officialy ashamed that a community of geeks and nerds would be so hate filled and bigoted. No matter how you chose to express your disdain for an LGBT character being introduced into a fictional universe you cannot do it without being a complete and utter homophobe.

Why on Earth are people complaining about political correctness, sexualization, the *** agenda, the injection of sex, gimmick, advertising, tokenisme, etc. etc.?

Are you out of your mind? There is a character in an upcoming Star Wars product that is not heterosexual that is all, nothing more nothing less. If that makes you feel anything other than “fine” you should really, really think about what kind of person you are and why you think it is normal that you are getting worked up over this. Now mind you, I am not talking about the people that just came out and said that “being *** is a lifestyle choice” or that wrote “homosexuality is degenerative” or the moron who said “I am not a homophobe, but I don’t want my children to read that” those idiots are a lost cause and should not even be on this page.

Those hateful morons might find a better crowd of likeminded individuals among the ranks of the Islamic State.

No, I am talking to those of you who have been ostracized for being different. To those of you that have been on the receiving end of jokes because you are part of a subculture that goes to conventions, reads books, buys comics, watches cartoons, rewatches the same movies over and over because you love a galaxy far far away. Those of you that were called geeks and dorks. Those of you that didn’t quite fit in at high school and were given a hard time.

You would judge a character for being different?

Thank you to The Star Wars Underworld for taking a stand and defending those people that have had to put up with so much bs already in their lives. You would think that people that enjoy your page be a little bit more openminded and I can only imagine your shock having to have catered to so many close minded fools for so long.

Why?! Why?! Why can I only like this once? Well said.

If it's any consolation, I think everyone else is Liking it too. In fact, the only thing that I disagree with in the whole badly spaced paragraph of nailing it is one single sentence: "those idiots are a lost cause". I was pretty anti-gay when I was young. It was just what I learned. Nowadays I regard it as pretty much irrelevant to who someone is for the most part. People can and do change. Not always, but some of them. There is always some hope. And I look forward to the day when such bigotry is beaten back. To do that, we have to keep saying things like Dante just said.

well said, Dante.

I just hope they handle it well. I haven't read the article, but on about to. that said, if the character is a man, but doesn't hit on another guy at least once, then it was for nothing but buzz, and adds nothing to the character. however, they could also go to the other extreme and make it a characture of a gay man or a lesbian woman (again I haven't read it, so I don't know which yet). I just hope that this is a good character.

here's a question: traditionally, racis, homophobia, and sexism tend to go hand in hand, as far as governmental policies are concerned. so is it believable that a lesbian woman would rise to the rank of a moff? (I just read it)

edit: even in the mmovies, all commanding officers, and imperials period, are men.

here's a question: traditionally, racis, homophobia, and sexism tend to go hand in hand, as far as governmental policies are concerned. so is it believable that a lesbian woman would rise to the rank of a moff? (I just read it)

There is no particular reason they have to go together. It's just that totalitarian societies generally strengthen themselves by dividing people against each other and seeking to blame some Other. So they'll draw on as many convenient scapegoats as they need. But these prejudices don't have to be found together. For example, Ancient Greece (time of the Peloponesian wars) was as far as we know, fine with male homosexuality but they were sexist (against women) to a truly shocking degree (respectable wives were frequently not allowed out of the house). Similarly the Spartans had very little sexism (and in some ways were actually more sexist against men than women) but they were spectacularly racist.

They notably run together in America because there is a historical concordance of several factors - a difficult racial past and a strong puritan influence (bringing the homophobia and the sexism together). As a relatively young nation, all of these things got mixed up in American's origins as a nation and are still being worked out simultaneously. Someone who hasn't divested themselves of one prejudice is quite likely to have not divested themselves of others, either. Here in the UK, Black/White isn't really that much of an issue (I wont say it's none, but it's nothing compared to the USA); but religious prejudice is a significant issue (primarily against Islam) for obvious reasons. Different nations, different events in history at different times.

There's no especial reason why the Empire needs to have any particular prejudice, especially an orientation one. It's true that pretty much all of the Imperial officials in the OT that we see are male, but I think that's an unfortunate artefact of the time the films were made. In other media and I suspect in any OT-era material going forward, you'll see a mix of male and female officials. It's certainly so in my game - I like my fascism to be clean and pure. They can crush resistance and oppress planets, but homophobia or sexism would just be petty, to my mind and make them less of an epic evil and more just unpleasant individuals to be around.

There's no especial reason why the Empire needs to have any particular prejudice, especially an orientation one

Except that most of their concept was based on the Nazis but i guess it is easy to forget that with the empire being all lovable and all that.

Don't get me wrong i am not saying it was wrong to put this character in, I have no opinion until after the book comes out, but it is entirely reasonable to think that the empire would be racist (they were in the EU very anti-anything that wasn't human), sexist (not really any female characters on the empire's side at all), and every other kind of "-ist" that there is. That is part of why they were to be hated and beaten because they were the "bad guys". Bad guys are not generally thought of as tolerant.

Star Wars adds its first LGBT character . Don't know if the book is any good, but I can at least appreciate that.

It is progress, I will not deny that. However when I saw the news drop I instantly knew that it would be the "safe" lesbian coupling. Unfortunately we still live in an age where girl-girl getting it on is just there for a Man's Pleasure. Two men in love is an abomination against God.

Still waiting on the Star Wars equivalent of this fellow:

(subtitle: that's the daring and loveable omnisexual rouge Captain Jack Harkness from Doctor Who/Torchwood)

here's a question: traditionally, racis, homophobia, and sexism tend to go hand in hand, as far as governmental policies are concerned. so is it believable that a lesbian woman would rise to the rank of a moff? (I just read it)

edit: even in the mmovies, all commanding officers, and imperials period, are men.

See, if I have an issue anywhere with this - it would be this point. The Empire doesn't strike me as the most socially progressive organization. The gays cant get ahead in the Empire, but neither can the blacks, the women or pretty much anyone other than Old White Men with English Accents.

The rebels? Go nuts! But the Empire, not so much.

I was terrified clicking the link to this thread. Thank you all for being awesome.

I guess I am the only one opposed to this addition.

I guess I am the only one opposed to this addition.

For a reason? or just because it is a situation that requires a Devil's Advocate?

It seems unnecessary and forced.

Reading the article, it doesn't feel forced. According to the author, that's how he saw the character. He didn't even make big deal of it outside of the book (we can't say for certain within the context of the story yet). It was pointed out by one of his editors. That doesn't seem forced to me.

It seems unnecessary and forced.

You know, I can kind of see that - it's almost like the "Hey! We're doing an all female Ghostbusters movie!", where it was mandated by the studios.

Here, I would have not done a press release going "Look! We're progressive!" - I would have released the book with no fan-fare at all, not made a big deal of it in the text and just let it happen. Make it less of an event and more. . . normal and casual, I guess.

Never mind - I should RTFA first:

It should be noted that Del Rey is not using Delian Mors as a marketing ploy for Lords of the Sith. When Young read an advance review copy, Mors jumped out at him and he reached out to Del Rey and Kemp to see if he could write an article about it.

Guess they did just release it without fanfare. Good on them!

If you read the article to the end, it wasn't a press release - the article's author got a reviewer's preview of the book and contacted the publishing house specifically to do an article on this character's inclusion.