So, has anyone considered not allowing True Aim and Autofire to stack? It's a legal if questionable combination, given that the two are practically anathema to each other. If you're aiming, you're generally not going full-bore autofire. My players are nowhere near the level in the OP, still having less than 100 xp each, but if the problem is massive dice pools with Autofire, perhaps something can be done about that?

Rather than completely nerfing it, perhaps you could ask the current combat monster's player to forego using True Aim for the next two or three sessions, to see how it goes. Tell him that if he wants to use True Aim, then he needs to forego using Autofire. While they are a legal combo, they are thematically opposite, which should count for a lot in a narrative-based game like this.

Bounty Hunter Gadgeteer / Gambler with jury rigged auto-fire + improved double or nothing...

Insane!

I finally got one massive roll and did 26 damage (deadly accuracy + point blank), followed by 30 auto-fire hits of 19 each. I obliterated the big bad.

But how many Infinite Backpacks do you have?

Anyway, you are a bad person and should feel bad

But honestly, this game is very easy to break - because it kind of assumes you want to be playing pulp sci-fi rather than Diablo. Y'know - chases, setbacks, surprises, plot twists, unbelievable coincidences, moral lessons, awkward romantic situations with hot aliens, etc.

Anyway, if we're bragging, my GMPC for the explorer game now has 1300 XP and could be outfought by any starting Droid Marauder.

Beat that.

I'm not really boasting. While I didn't go through the details here, in a campaign that was run by a very adversarial GM my character was killed willy nilly and I was allowed to make a new character with around 600 earned XP. Knowing the campaign had a defined end point, and having a GM that made it his goal to maim, destroy, and kill the characters, I decided to break his game.

I played this character in 5 sessions, 4 of which involved combat. The 5th session was the final session of the entire campaign.

It was essentially an experiment in a perfect environment (high level game, set end point, standard of rollplay over roleplay already established). Theory crafting is fun, but I wanted to see it in action and provide actual feedback based on my experiences.

The funny thing is that the tables are turning now. I'm set to run the next campaign, but this GM (who plans to ay) has already told me he is making an almost pure social character. Which is great!

I've played and GMd a lot of this system over the last year and half and I am certainly one that realizes how easily this game can breakdown mechanically when the focus is taken off the narrative. I don't need any reminders here, though I do appreciate the concern .

So it sounds like the GM "drew first blood" in terms of setting the tone of the game as Extreme Build Challenge.

As a GM when I see this kind of immature behavior it turns into a teaching moment for the player(s). I simply replicate the combo in the main bad guy, and maybe even up the ante a little bit, and then show the player that the rules go in both directions. Anything he can do I can do worse.

It generally doesn't make for an award winning experience, but as long as I don't kill the rest of the party and they aren't mad I still have a game.

There are also other things that can counter this, such as a quick lightsaber/force power to disarm or destroy his weapon. Missile launchers at extreme range... you get the drift. A lot of times I can cleverly kill the PC and make it "appear" as it was just an accident.

As a GM when I see this kind of immature behavior it turns into a teaching moment for the player(s). I simply replicate the combo in the main bad guy, and maybe even up the ante a little bit, and then show the player that the rules go in both directions. Anything he can do I can do worse.

It generally doesn't make for an award winning experience, but as long as I don't kill the rest of the party and they aren't mad I still have a game.

There are also other things that can counter this, such as a quick lightsaber/force power to disarm or destroy his weapon. Missile launchers at extreme range... you get the drift. A lot of times I can cleverly kill the PC and make it "appear" as it was just an accident.

I may have lost track, but it sounds like the situation originated with the GM and the type of game they were running...

As a GM when I see this kind of immature behavior it turns into a teaching moment for the player(s). I simply replicate the combo in the main bad guy, and maybe even up the ante a little bit, and then show the player that the rules go in both directions. Anything he can do I can do worse.

It generally doesn't make for an award winning experience, but as long as I don't kill the rest of the party and they aren't mad I still have a game.

There are also other things that can counter this, such as a quick lightsaber/force power to disarm or destroy his weapon. Missile launchers at extreme range... you get the drift. A lot of times I can cleverly kill the PC and make it "appear" as it was just an accident.

I may have lost track, but it sounds like the situation originated with the GM and the type of game they were running...

Depends on if he is talking about my recent posts, or the original posts that started this thread

I finally got one massive roll and did 26 damage (deadly accuracy + point blank), followed by 30 auto-fire hits of 19 each. I obliterated the big bad.

But how many Infinite Backpacks do you have?

Anyway, you are a bad person and should feel bad

But honestly, this game is very easy to break - because it kind of assumes you want to be playing pulp sci-fi rather than Diablo. Y'know - chases, setbacks, surprises, plot twists, unbelievable coincidences, moral lessons, awkward romantic situations with hot aliens, etc.

Anyway, if we're bragging, my GMPC for the explorer game now has 1300 XP and could be outfought by any starting Droid Marauder.

Beat that.

I'm not really boasting. While I didn't go through the details here, in a campaign that was run by a very adversarial GM my character was killed willy nilly and I was allowed to make a new character with around 600 earned XP. Knowing the campaign had a defined end point, and having a GM that made it his goal to maim, destroy, and kill the characters, I decided to break his game.

I played this character in 5 sessions, 4 of which involved combat. The 5th session was the final session of the entire campaign.

It was essentially an experiment in a perfect environment (high level game, set end point, standard of rollplay over roleplay already established). Theory crafting is fun, but I wanted to see it in action and provide actual feedback based on my experiences.

The funny thing is that the tables are turning now. I'm set to run the next campaign, but this GM (who plans to ay) has already told me he is making an almost pure social character. Which is great!

I've played and GMd a lot of this system over the last year and half and I am certainly one that realizes how easily this game can breakdown mechanically when the focus is taken off the narrative. I don't need any reminders here, though I do appreciate the concern .

So it sounds like the GM "drew first blood" in terms of setting the tone of the game as Extreme Build Challenge.

He took a cheesed out Marauder/Assassin/broken PC, "killed him", gave his melee attacks Linked 4, and unleashed him on the party full bore as an NPC in a completely unexpected encounter with the party split. He then proceeded to lament that he assumed the party would fight him together while he continued to maim things.

As a GM when I see this kind of immature behavior it turns into a teaching moment for the player(s). I simply replicate the combo in the main bad guy, and maybe even up the ante a little bit, and then show the player that the rules go in both directions. Anything he can do I can do worse.

Very mature...

Don't take it too hard, but it is definitely not mature from you side neither.

As a GM when I see this kind of immature behavior it turns into a teaching moment for the player(s). I simply replicate the combo in the main bad guy, and maybe even up the ante a little bit, and then show the player that the rules go in both directions. Anything he can do I can do worse.

That's exactly the kind of escalation war that gave us the Yuuzhan Vong in the EU...

There comes a time when all good campaigns must come to an end. When the GM isn't having fun anymore and the situation can't be resolved, you've reached that time.

Start the campaign over, keep xp rewards reasonable (15ish) going forward, and learn from past mistakes.

I don't allow my players to aim and use autofire on the same attack... it's logically absurd so he shouldn't have an 8 yellow pool (i.e. true aim doesn't apply to autofire)

Okay, question time kids. I've read around here that Autofire and Jury Rig was crazy broken, but since nobody at the table had Jury Rig, I'd not really pay attention to the why and how. But hey, imagine that - I'm working my way to Jury Rigged even as we speak, so I'd better listen up.

Looking over the two mechanics, they don't seem that bad. What's broken about them?

Okay, question time kids. I've read around here that Autofire and Jury Rig was crazy broken, but since nobody at the table had Jury Rig, I'd not really pay attention to the why and how. But hey, imagine that - I'm working my way to Jury Rigged even as we speak, so I'd better listen up.

Looking over the two mechanics, they don't seem that bad. What's broken about them?

Additional hit for every advantage. It doesn't get really broken until rank 4 in the respective weapon skill. There are ways to make it even -more- broken, but they involve Gambler and Double or Nothing.

Autofire is the single best way to deal with minions without invoking a Signature Ability.

By itself, Jury Ridding isn't broken.

As part of some munchkinised, juvenile 'build', it can get very broken with autofire.

Yet another reason I don't allow multiclassing.

Okay, question time kids. I've read around here that Autofire and Jury Rig was crazy broken, but since nobody at the table had Jury Rig, I'd not really pay attention to the why and how. But hey, imagine that - I'm working my way to Jury Rigged even as we speak, so I'd better listen up.

Looking over the two mechanics, they don't seem that bad. What's broken about them?

Nothing. Lots of folks just get a bad case of the twitches when their players bust open a can full of awesome.

Okay, so a Wookiee Heavy firing a Heavy Repeating Blaster :

Heavy Repeating Blaster

Skill: Gunnery

Damage: 15

Critical: 2

Range: Long

Encumbrance: 9

HP: 4

Price: ® 6,000

Rarity: 8

Special: Auto-Fire, Cumbersome 5, Pierce 2, Vicious 1,

Category: Energy

Indexes: A-BGR:31, A-CRB:176, E-CRB:162

Let’s say it’s Jury-Rigged, and gets one extra hit per single Advantage.

Go to your favourite online dice rolling program for SWRPG, and let’s get an idea of what that might look like, with five yellow dice, three boost dice (assuming double Aim plus at least one other boost), and three purple difficulty dice (because he’s doing auto-fire).

I did that, and on the first roll I got a single net Success, and 7 net Advantage. So, seven bolts hit, each doing sixteen points of damage, but of course Soak has to be considered for each hit. If the target has Soak 5, that’s still 7*(15-5) damage, or 70 points of damage that gets through Soak, in a single pull of the trigger.

Is that enough to wipe your Big Bad Bug-Eyed Boss in a single round?

Okay, question time kids. I've read around here that Autofire and Jury Rig was crazy broken, but since nobody at the table had Jury Rig, I'd not really pay attention to the why and how. But hey, imagine that - I'm working my way to Jury Rigged even as we speak, so I'd better listen up.

Looking over the two mechanics, they don't seem that bad. What's broken about them?

The weapons with autofire tend to also have high damage. Once your character gets up there in ranks of the appropriate weapon skill, it is pretty easy to have advantage left over. Now normally you need 2 advantage to activate autofire. But after jury rigged, you only need 1 and have effectively DOUBLED the damage output of your weapon. This is of course assuming you are not using your advantage for other things.

If you roleplay well and don't plan just pumping as many blaster bolts into things as possible, you will probably be OK. If you want to kill things, jury rigging autofire is a good way to give your GM fits.

Not sure if it helps here at all, but back in WEG, the autofire weapons were so potentially lethal that we house-ruled that every hit from the same burst on the same target after the first added another damage die, instead of multiple Xd6 hits. Or something like that, it's been a long time. I know whatever we did made the repeaters, etc, less overwhelmingly lethal.

Okay, question time kids. I've read around here that Autofire and Jury Rig was crazy broken, but since nobody at the table had Jury Rig, I'd not really pay attention to the why and how. But hey, imagine that - I'm working my way to Jury Rigged even as we speak, so I'd better listen up.

Looking over the two mechanics, they don't seem that bad. What's broken about them?

Jury Rigged to one Advantage to activate. Then mod a weapon to have Superior, a Laser Sight, and as many Boost dice for Accurate mods as you can fit. Couple that with double aiming and decent skill and it should be readily apparent in a couple test rolls.

Okay, question time kids. I've read around here that Autofire and Jury Rig was crazy broken, but since nobody at the table had Jury Rig, I'd not really pay attention to the why and how. But hey, imagine that - I'm working my way to Jury Rigged even as we speak, so I'd better listen up.

Looking over the two mechanics, they don't seem that bad. What's broken about them?

Jury Rigged to one Advantage to activate. Then mod a weapon to have Superior, a Laser Sight, and as many Boost dice for Accurate mods as you can fit. Couple that with double aiming and decent skill and it should be readily apparent in a couple test rolls.

Then add Double or Nothing from Gambler and the output becomes 2 additional hits for every advantage and watch the scores really change.

I don't have the supplement, but DoN...signature ability?

Double or Nothing, and it's Improved and Supreme versions, are talents in the Gambler specialization.

Base form doubles all remaining advantages after cancellations.

Improved doubles all remaining successes after cancellations.

Supreme doubles all triumphs and despairs.

It is an incidental that causes two strain to the user, taken before a check. It also increases the difficulty of said check by one.

As much as a I love the Gambler spec, Second Chances, Double or Nothing and then SA Unmatched Fortune is pretty OTT.

As much as a I love the Gambler spec, Second Chances, Double or Nothing and then SA Unmatched Fortune is pretty OTT.

Definitely! The spec is ripe for abuse.

I don't have an issue with limiting Signature Abilities or Talents to "areas of expertise." It solves situations such as this nicely.

I know that isn't necessarily RAW, but I believe it is Rules as Intended.