While at the laundromat today, I will be tackling this issue. I'll be back later today with a full in-depth report of my thinking.

Until then, please leave your comments below. If any of them approach the problem from an angle I did not foresee, I'll include your points in the mondo-post!

_**_*Finalized Post _**_*

For the record, this is attempt no. 3 to write this thing out. Both previous times, I misclicked while transferring back to this while managing my typing-music, and had to start back from the top. I must really like you guys, or something.

Still, this will be around 1/2-1/3 the size of the previous drafts, which should tell you something when you finally get to the bottom.

The biggest problem with comparing these two is that they fly completely differently.

The Aggressor is bloody fast, and is better at the Disengage/Re-engage dance than any ship I've broken down this in-depth.

This is Sablegryphon's excellent demonstration at how a Shuttle can be extremely mobile with just the addition of boost. Read it, and remember that the Aggressor has a substantially superior dial.

The Segnor's Loop is a great way to dart around a Furball or similarly slow-moving opponent while keeping the damage up.

The Aggressor is practically indefatigable. The only ships better at shedding stress are A-Wings, Interceptors, and ships that have equipped an R2 or Unhinged Astromech.

The Aggressor has a 1↱, meaning that it corners as well as a Large ship possibly can.

The Firespray is at its best while being pursued, and is extremely good at extended engagements.

If you and your opponent are moving in vaguely similar directions, your forward momentum cancels each other out. Aiming the Auxillary Arc, in such a situation, becomes simplicity itself, as you only have to compensate a shift along the horizontal vector to keep the offense going.

The Bomb slot, the Andrasta Title, Emon Azzameen, and Kath Scumlet all point to this as being the most dangerous role for the Firespray-31 as well.

The Auxillary Arc also allows you to perform a white maneuver to have an identical attack as the Segnor's Loop.

Following that, you move away from the opponent, who may re-enter your firing arc turn after turn in this way, as opposed to the Aggressor who must break away and re-engage. However, the Segnor's Loop is still superior when fighting close to the edge of the battlefield.

The Auxillary Arc can also act as a pseudo-Turret, if you can dissuade your opponents from attacking your sides with Obstacles or Rest-of-the-Fleet.

The two ships have most of their upgrade bars in common.

The Aggressor can take Systems and Autothrusters

The Firespray can take Crew, Missiles, Title into Torpedoes or More Bombs, and Engine Upgrades.

The amazing quality of the IG-2000 title does not enter the equation if you're only fielding one Aggressor, after all.

I cannot overstress how good Advanced Sensors are on any of the Aggressors, but particularly C and D, and Fire-Control System is super deadly on B and D as well.

The Firespray is the only ship that can take Greedo, Outlaw Tech, and R4 Security Droid.

Tactician, Mercenary Co-Pilot, Recon Specialist, and Gunner are also very good on it.

Yes, Tactician works out of the Aux Arc.

The Mandalorian Merc's best attribute in this particular fight is that he costs 1 point less than the plural IG-88, at the expense of having PS 5.

Of all of the pilots for these two craft, Emon Azzameen is the only one without an Elite Talent.

This is probably to keep Veteran's Instinct from being auto-include on him, as that combo would be broken.

You see, Emon Azzameen doesn't actually cost 36. He's worse than a Mandalorian Merc with VI if you don't use Bombs. However, he provides substantially more of a threat with what was already an amazing upgrade slot, and the Andrasta title allows him to do so thrice in a game.

IG-88A stacks Regeneration on top of what is already the most survivable ship in the game (according to MajorJuggler's Jousting Value Table). With the Aggressor's speed, your ability to get the heck out of dodge when your shields are lower than you like is unparalleled, and then you can whip around, pick someone off, and heal back up. Kill this in the early game, or not at all.

Like Azzameen, IG-88B doesn't actually cost 36. He requires a Cannon. We've all seen how effective Gunnerish effects are in this game, and the ability to turn it into an actual Buzzsaw makes him more terrifying. However, like the Phantom, 4 dice is likely to get at least one damage through, so this ability isn't as effective solo as one might think. It does, however, open up your actions for Mobility and Defense, which he is certainly able to do.

IG-88C is the king of action economy. With PTL, you get 3 actions per turn!

IG-88D is a better fit for FCS, but is also a great pick with Advanced Sensors. This is the most likely 88 to keep a bead on the same target turn after turn, but could also Boost before performing Segnor's Loop with the 3↱ template, which will always surprise your opponent.

Kath Scarlet's ability is a straight upgrade to the Heavy Laser Cannon. 4 die attack out of the end you prefer to fight with, 5 at range one, and you get to keep any Crits that you roll. Giving the enemy a Bonus Die at Range 3 is sad, as you'll spend a lot of combat there, but its the only way to seem sporting.

Boba Fett's ability is really good, as it screws with the dictation of how your opponent plays.

See, with a Large Ship, you're usually outnumbered in an engagement.

Range 1 provides more benefits to a fleet the more ships you have. Therefore, Large Ships usually prefer NOT to fight at Range 1.

Fett's ability is a buff to his least preferred attacking scenario. You don't want to use the free re-rolls on offense near as much as you want them on defense, despite the Red Dice being stronger.

The scum firespray is the superior ship in my opinion when talking about Boba and Kath, even when talking about doubles. The rear arc gives it much better attack economy than the Aggressor and also makes it more flexible in it's maneuvering, even it does make Engine Upgrade an auto-include (just like Autothrusters and Advanced Sensors on the Aggressor). The firespray is also easier to fly and doesn't require the mental hoops to jump through that the Aggressor does (although for some people that is probably part of the appeal). Even though the Aggressor is slightly more durable, the Firespray is more kill-ey and can maintain an offensive even while it's running away.

The scum firespray pilots also have superior abilities and Pilot Skill to the Aggressor Pilots, with Boba able to reach the all-important PS 10.

I've seen a double aggressor list go toe to toe with kath/boba. The aggressors squeaked by, one health each

I'll reserve judgement after this weekend's last Atlanta store championship

The Firespray, hands down. Equally customizable (though with different slots, admittedly) and more deadly than the opposition. Scum Kath + Opportunist and HLC paired with Palob Godahli inflicts massive pain, allowing a minimum attack of five dice no matter where she's shooting from, and six at a range-1 auxiliary blast.

Now, the Aggressor does get the benefit of two Pilot Abilities the boost action + Autothrusters, but that really doesn't match the versatility of two firing arcs and the absurd new abilities of our favorite bounty hunters. The Aggressor also wins in the green maneuver department, but is totally lacking in what is easily one of the best maneuvers for a large ship: the hard 3 turn. You can cover a huge amount of distance with this turn and use it to appropriately position yourself. And remember: Boba gets his ability regardless of whether or not he's in arc.

Personally, the biggest strength for the scum Firesprays are Mandalorian Mercenaries. At a ridiculously cheap-for-what-they-can-take 35 points and 5 PS with an EPT slot, they are just too good. Consider the following: for the same price as any IG-88, they are pilot skill seven with comparable damage and, in my opinion, better upgrades (Crew > Systems any day of the week).

Yes they are lacking native Pilot Abilities, but that does not matter when you are shredding the opposition alive before they get a chance to return fire. Coupled with the excellent crew of Recon Specialist and the new addition of K4 Security Droid which plays into the strength of the Firespray's slow-rolling green maneuvers, and you've got some nasty die attacks coming at any ship. Also, its shield, hull and evasion make it nigh-impossible to kill in a single round of firing, even from the most dedicated of swarms.

Emon Azzameen brings a host of options to the table with his ability to drop bombs and wreak havoc in any direction as well, which can create a dynamic of unpredictability or target priority for your opponent. The Aggressor offers similar target priority issues I must admit, but depending on Emon's escort your opponent could have serios problems deciding what's deadlier: bombs galore or a mini-swarm.

The Aggressor is a very neat ship and has great utility, but I just don't think it can stack up to the battering rams that are the Scum Firesprays, and the Imperial Firesprays were never a bad option either.

I heard IGs like to zoom around the board. If you have range constrictions: Palob, Ndru, or lots of ships or want lots of rocks, this might be a bad idea.

Firespray plays more traditionally.

A talk about Kath's Opportunist: Is it really worth it? I always do silly things like this in epic games because there's always a target, but in 100 pts...

Does it make up for the opportunity cost of the EPT? VI, PTL, Predator?

Lack of actions due to using boost?

A talk about Kath's Opportunist: Is it really worth it? I always do silly things like this in epic games because there's always a target, but in 100 pts...

Does it make up for the opportunity cost of the EPT? VI, PTL, Predator?

Lack of actions due to using boost?

Kath will be running with action-equivalent granting crew the vast majority of the time; a 6 dice attack at range 1 is nothing to sneeze at. That being said, the opportunity cost vs. the PTL boost to get that range 1 shot might be a bit high. I did have a lot of fun with that Scarlet Thief build though... it was brutal.

A talk about Kath's Opportunist: Is it really worth it? I always do silly things like this in epic games because there's always a target, but in 100 pts...

Does it make up for the opportunity cost of the EPT? VI, PTL, Predator?

Lack of actions due to using boost?

I don't use boost on the Firespray, but that's just me. Here's the Kath I was referring to, paired with an Outlaw Teched Palob.

Kath Scarlet

- Opportunist

- Heavy Laser Cannon

- Recon Specialist (or K4 depending on preference)

Obviously you can throw on other upgrades, but, like I said, I like to throw on Palob with Bodyguard and Outlaw Tech. A Focus to keep up with Kath from Palob's reds, and an additional focus (if you can properly maneuver it -- which is admittedly difficult) to bump Kath's agility to 3.

It's admittedly niche, but if your opponent bumps, attacks first and spends their Focus, or has it stolen from Palob, they're facing a nasty attack.

Also, Opportunist isn't something you always have to use. If you're facing a stress-inducing list it's obviously a bad choice, but at the moment I've not come up against any and Opportunist has wreaked absolute havoc.

It's kind of apples and oranges. The aggressor is sort of an oversized TIE interceptor. The firespray is more of a gunship.. The firespray dial lends itself better to long banking turns. The Agressor dial is balanced more towards true arc dodging. Now if I were building a scum squad with only one large ship it would probably be a firespray, but that mainly comes down to the loss of the ig2k title. That said I can see effective squads making use of a single aggressor.

I think this is hard to answer, but I would lean toward the firespray. The thing to consider is really the rest of your list and how it works together. One on one with equal points - I'd proably take the firespray with rec spec and lone wolf, or maybe the new security droid.

Native boost on the IG is pretty sweet though.....

It's kind of apples and oranges. The aggressor is sort of an oversized TIE interceptor. The firespray is more of a gunship.. The firespray dial lends itself better to long banking turns. The Agressor dial is balanced more towards true arc dodging. Now if I were building a scum squad with only one large ship it would probably be a firespray, but that mainly comes down to the loss of the ig2k title. That said I can see effective squads making use of a single aggressor.

The comparisons between the Aggressor and TIE Interceptor are pretty much superficial. The Aggressor flies much more like a very fast Adv Sensors Engine Lambda with a fancy k-turn then it flies like an Interceptor, which never k-turns. It mostly uses that boost action to keep it pointed at the enemy. With a large base, lack of a turret and a lack of a Barrel Roll, the Aggressor can't really dodge arcs the way Interceptors, Han and Dash can. Which is good, because it would be really annoying if the most durable ship in the game could move like Dash or Soontir.

The aggressor actually relies pretty heavily on it's bulk, evade dice and autothrusters to carry it through a battle. In fact, I actually think the Firespray's rear arc and higher Pilot Skill make it way better at arc-dodging with Engine Upgrade then the Aggressor. I think the Aggressor and the Firespray fill very similar roles in lists as tanky gunboats that can soak up a lot of hits and deal a ton of damage.

I for one am glad that everyone thinks the Firespray is better. It will make my dual-aggressor wins all the more sweeter!

(especially when putting the beatdown on dual firesprays! )

I for one am glad that everyone thinks the Firespray is better. It will make my dual-aggressor wins all the more sweeter!

(especially when putting the beatdown on dual firesprays! )

I wish you the best of luck! Because my Dual Sprays have been romping those Aggressors, but it's always a good match.

Bump, as I've now updated the first post.

I've played about a half dozen games against dual aggressors with my dual firesprays, and have won all but one of them, so I personally feel the firespray is superior.

I do think aggressors have the edge vs swarms though because of their extra agility and auto thrusters.

I'd put a single Aggressor in a squad alongside ships that disengage, though sadly, not a large number of those in Scum yet. I imagine it would be a similar role to the Decimator, but the Decimator has a turret, which is much better anyways. So, I'm not sure.

Or put it in the role you sometimes find a Shuttle, which is, Adv Sensor bumping into the back of your forces.

As far as I can see though, I'd rather put a Firespray in that role, solely because I can make it work in lists with less upgrades. I'm not sure how a 44 pt IG88 + PTL + Adv Sensor + AT would fair alongside some Z95s and what not, especially because it doesn't solve any list problems (like PS10 for Phantoms). I'm pretty certain that 46pt Boba Fett + VI + K4 + Hotshot is an excellent fit into lots of lists.

Firespray, every time.

I'd put a single Aggressor in a squad alongside ships that disengage, though sadly, not a large number of those in Scum yet. I imagine it would be a similar role to the Decimator, but the Decimator has a turret, which is much better anyways. So, I'm not sure.

Or put it in the role you sometimes find a Shuttle, which is, Adv Sensor bumping into the back of your forces.

As far as I can see though, I'd rather put a Firespray in that role, solely because I can make it work in lists with less upgrades. I'm not sure how a 44 pt IG88 + PTL + Adv Sensor + AT would fair alongside some Z95s and what not, especially because it doesn't solve any list problems (like PS10 for Phantoms). I'm pretty certain that 46pt Boba Fett + VI + K4 + Hotshot is an excellent fit into lots of lists.

In fact, due to some smooth flying and unfortunate crits, the final blow was dealt to echo, from range one with my main cannon.

I don't believe many people can say they've killed a phantom with a turret-less HWK.

the main point of that is, fly your aggressor solo. its a very good ship in its own right, and can handle even the bigger threats from other factions.

i would like to fly against han, but the locals only bring him when there's money on the table.

Can someone explain to me why everyone loves the K4 Droid so much on the Firespray? The darn thing only has 3 green manuvers, and they're all speed 1! I get that you can bump and still get an action, but is that really it?

You team it with PTL and Engine Upgrade. Triple action Firespray.

I think Kath Scumlet(I like that) could be in the running for best pilot in the game now. At pilot skill 7 she has a wide range of choices for upgrades that work. She can go with VI and be a high skill threat. PTL is ways good. The way I plan to run her though is to get her into rear arc mode and abuse opportunist. At skill 7 she will likely be shooting the big boys when they don't have a focus and she will eat them up. The Firespray dial is excellent at shedding stress from the rear arc position. On top of that she will always be running recspec in my squads. Firesprays are just too good with recspec not to take it. Firesprays win IMO.

K4 gives you access to Rerolls + Focus when you want to take a non-Predator EPT or stack Focus and Evade with PTL instead of going all in on offense. VI + K4 makes sense as a cheap way to get your Kath/Boba to PS 9/10 and still have access to good offense. Obviously it doesn't trigger every round, but it will be good for things like the opening round of firing when you engage with a 2 fwd or something. Imo, free Actions for almost no work are a good thing (see FCS).

As a large ship with a rear arc, Firesprays don't really need to go that fast. It's essentially a free target lock almost every turn, which is really nice to have with a focus token when you're shooting 4 dice with an HLC or Kath's ability.

Anyone talk about or consider outmanuever on scummy kath? Thinking about trying it out. Running kath w/outmanuever, mando merc vanilla, and torkil mux w/ion turret. Send the vanilla spray in first to draw attention then have kath fly past everyone as quick as possible with torkil right next to her. Torkil drops high ps targets so kath can destroy them with 4 dice and they lose a defense dice because of outmanuever so kath will really punish them.