If vanilla were a bad flavor, you wouldn't see it all over the place.

I think that Scyks are ships that are good to use as filler in a list. You don't have to do a swarm of them or load up with cannons to be effective. Just treat it as a Tie Fighter. Yes, it's 2 pts more, but you get a little bit more than an Academy Pilot. These ships don't have to be centerpieces, but they can fill out a list.

The biggest difference IMO is that Imperials have some great aces in the 30-40 point range (Fel, Phantoms, etc.) that perform well in a list with 4-5 TIEs bolted on. Oh, and Howlrunner. Such an awesome buff for cheapie TIEs, giving them some teeth. Without a cheap way to get some damage buffs on your swarmy Scum ships, you can't quite rely on Serissu to the same extent. Keeping ships that don't do any damage alive doesn't seem as useful as making all your ships significantly more dangerous for a couple turns. Especially if the opponent can just swat Serissu first.

Building Scum lists I usually buy a lot of weapon upgrades and have a very squishy looking list without enough hull/shields on the board, or I end up with a defensive list that doesn't seem all that threatening. I also seem to get stuck on 98 points a lot, in a list where the initiative bid is irrelevant Then there's the always fun "good list that has no answer to the Phantom". I'm enjoying the mental exercise of wrapping my head around a whole new faction, but I really need to throw some more dice and get some experience to go with my theories.

Maybe Guri with Bodyguard would be worth it for Serissu and some friends. Agility 4 might finally push people to shoot at something else, so you get some mileage out of her ability. Serissu, loaded Bodyguard Guri and two Spanglers is 99 pts. And I would get to sing out of tune Whitney Houston a lot while playing this list, which is a plus.

Maybe I should just learn to love the Feedback Array Z-95 swarm

First off: Serissu with VI and Ion Cannon doesn't seem like a bad Phantom counter for not too much of a price premium. With that in mind:

Serissu, Heavy Scyk, Ion Cannon, VI = 26

Tansarri Point Veteran, Heavy Scyk, Bodyguard, Ion Cannon = 24

Cartel Spacer, Heavy Scyk, HLC = 23

Cartel Spacer, Heavy Scyk, HLC = 23

4 points left for a defensive upgrade on Serissu, maybe Stealth Device, make her an AGI5 target, where everyone else is AGI3 with re-rolls. You could take the spare point and upgrade an Ion Cannon to a Mangler. Fat Turrets should take a little time to chew through that agility, meanwhile, you've got 2 HLCs and 2 other cannons piling up the damage. Phantoms will have to face a PS10 Ion or Mangler, and won't like HLCs, even at PS2.

I do keep forgetting that she is PS 8, which is pretty darn good. Forget that ability she has, she's great just as an anti PS 9 arc dodger.

A potential PS10 cannon solves a lot of problems.

I bought 3 M3-A's and now I'm thinking I need another.

I'm thinking three will work ok without Serrisu but will get chopped to pieces in close combat. Then once you take Serrisu there's the issue of of him getting focus fired on right from the start. Adding Laetin should offer another high value target to shoot at but only after Serrisu is dead. To counter this, why not put a big gun (HLC) on him and his mates?

http://xwing-builder.co.uk/view/201992/cartel-cannonade

But then I thought that Serrisu is will probably get totally mushed around turn 3 making him a total waste of 21 points. So:

http://xwing-builder.co.uk/view/202009/cartel-cannonade-v2

Manglers will get the job done as good as HLC's and now PtL Serrisu can uber turtle and make Laetin look like the better target, right? If you want to go ahead and shoot at a focus/evade ship who's going to be hanging in the back of a diamond formation, be my guest!

Whatcha think, sirs?

Serissu is a girl, and so are some of the people on this site. As for the build, I like it, though I find it crazy that the link's language is as gender specific as yours, and is not the way the cards are actually written.

That's great.

Now what do you think of the build?

I told you what I thought of the build in my post that you quoted, but I suppose in addition to not seeking women's opinions about anything, you don't listen to them either.

A potential PS10 cannon solves a lot of problems.

not the problem of its own green dice

Probably the only thing keeping me from trying V.I heavy Seirussu (apart from the fact that her ability already makes her a MASSIVE BULLSEYE as is)

23 points base (no cannon) is rough enough as is, going to 27 or 30 or 30 to 33 (stealth or hull) is a bit of a tall order imo

I think that Scyks are ships that are good to use as filler in a list. You don't have to do a swarm of them or load up with cannons to be effective. Just treat it as a Tie Fighter. Yes, it's 2 pts more, but you get a little bit more than an Academy Pilot. These ships don't have to be centerpieces, but they can fill out a list.

The biggest difference IMO is that Imperials have some great aces in the 30-40 point range (Fel, Phantoms, etc.) that perform well in a list with 4-5 TIEs bolted on. Oh, and Howlrunner. Such an awesome buff for cheapie TIEs, giving them some teeth. Without a cheap way to get some damage buffs on your swarmy Scum ships, you can't quite rely on Serissu to the same extent. Keeping ships that don't do any damage alive doesn't seem as useful as making all your ships significantly more dangerous for a couple turns. Especially if the opponent can just swat Serissu first.

Building Scum lists I usually buy a lot of weapon upgrades and have a very squishy looking list without enough hull/shields on the board, or I end up with a defensive list that doesn't seem all that threatening. I also seem to get stuck on 98 points a lot, in a list where the initiative bid is irrelevant Then there's the always fun "good list that has no answer to the Phantom". I'm enjoying the mental exercise of wrapping my head around a whole new faction, but I really need to throw some more dice and get some experience to go with my theories.

Maybe Guri with Bodyguard would be worth it for Serissu and some friends. Agility 4 might finally push people to shoot at something else, so you get some mileage out of her ability. Serissu, loaded Bodyguard Guri and two Spanglers is 99 pts. And I would get to sing out of tune Whitney Houston a lot while playing this list, which is a plus.

Maybe I should just learn to love the Feedback Array Z-95 swarm

First off: Serissu with VI and Ion Cannon doesn't seem like a bad Phantom counter for not too much of a price premium.

VI and Flechette seems like it might be a better Phantom counter. The stress keeps the Phantom from cloaking back up with ACD. An Ion token just prevents the decloak the following turn

to be fair, preventing the following de-cloak is absolutely massive because you know exactly where he's going and the poor bugger can't even shoot you

Imo, it comes down to what you don't want to fight after the phantom

Don't like fatties? Flechette cannon it is. Don't like elite small ships (esp such as corran horn)? Ion.

Flechette is probably better, I agree. Stopping a re-cloak and forcing a green move to cloak up next turn is way better than just stopping a decloak next turn. You can't de-cloak if you never got to re-cloak in the first place.

Flechette is probably better, I agree. Stopping a re-cloak and forcing a green move to cloak up next turn is way better than just stopping a decloak next turn. You can't de-cloak if you never got to re-cloak in the first place.

I do understand if we're all a little mixed up from Advanced Cloaking device screwing up how the Cloak rules are supposed to work...but if he's not de-cloaked he can't shoot. He can't even de-cloak to alter the WHITE 1-foward you forced him into in any way. At best, he can roll.

The four agility + focus is a bit of a pain to get through, but I'll be damned if I said that stress is strictly better than ion against a phantom. It is certainly easier to apply (R3-A2 guarantees it, you never have to roll dice), but assuming you got the token on the ship the ion is easily more devastating.

Having played tons upon tons of games with PS 10 Stress Wings, I can say that a stressed phantom is trivially killed but by god it will take a chunk out of something before it goes very un-queitly into the night. Said something will probably be Biggs, but hey 25 points is 25 points.

So, just to reiterate, PS 10 stress cripples phantoms but ion neuters them

Flechette is probably better, I agree. Stopping a re-cloak and forcing a green move to cloak up next turn is way better than just stopping a decloak next turn. You can't de-cloak if you never got to re-cloak in the first place.

But you can still attack with your four dice again, especially if you got lucky and killed the Flechette last turn.

I'd agree with everyone who goes with Ion. I'd rather have a shot at a slow-drifting Phantom who will be in a very predictable location and unable to attack than at a stressed Phantom who could still get a shot off if you don't kill it.

Flechette is probably better, I agree. Stopping a re-cloak and forcing a green move to cloak up next turn is way better than just stopping a decloak next turn. You can't de-cloak if you never got to re-cloak in the first place.

But you can still attack with your four dice again, especially if you got lucky and killed the Flechette last turn.

I'd agree with everyone who goes with Ion. I'd rather have a shot at a slow-drifting Phantom who will be in a very predictable location and unable to attack than at a stressed Phantom who could still get a shot off if you don't kill it.

Flechette is probably better, I agree. Stopping a re-cloak and forcing a green move to cloak up next turn is way better than just stopping a decloak next turn. You can't de-cloak if you never got to re-cloak in the first place.

But you can still attack with your four dice again, especially if you got lucky and killed the Flechette last turn.

I'd agree with everyone who goes with Ion. I'd rather have a shot at a slow-drifting Phantom who will be in a very predictable location and unable to attack than at a stressed Phantom who could still get a shot off if you don't kill it.

I guess I'm thinking if you can block the re-cloak with a PS10 stress, then the rest of your squad can muster 3 more points of damage to finish it. In both Ion and Flechette cases, the Phantom will have shots if Serissu hits it. In the case of the Ion, it will then fire on it's turn, cloak up, and drift next turn. In the case of the Flechette, it will stay uncloaked, stay AGI 2 for the turn, and be restricted to a regular move, probably a regular green move, no de-cloak. Not as predictable as an Ion, but pretty predictable if it wants to clear that crippling stress.

Oh right, I got so caught up in counter-phantom general tactics that I forgot we were talking about cannons

Okay, so between Flechette and Ion cannons fired at PS 10, the ion is strictly superior for anti-phantom duty (because you have to hit with the same number of dice either way) unless

1.) you can't afford that extra point

2.) your entire squad is full of 2 red dice scrubs that wouldn't hit four agility even if all the dice had nothing but blank faces

3.) You absolutely loath large ships

The reason stress is more recommended against phantoms is because stress did not require you to trust RNGesus not to ruin your day

R3-A2 --> no dice needed

Rebel Captive --> no dice needed, hell you don't even need arc

Flechette Torps --> dice do damage, but the stress is automatic

Tactician --> situational range, but no dice

Seirussu here is rolling dice (and the same number of dice) either way, and ion is by far the most devastating of the two effects (especially since flechette can't stack with itself, so you'd have to build the list with more stress mechanics that S&V have sadly very little access to). In general, I also vastly prefer the ion cannon because I know how powerful it is on 3 agility ships (granted, those were Defenders, but trust me they become vastly more survivable when the opponent can't shoot them )

If vanilla were a bad flavor, you wouldn't see it all over the place.

I like vanilla ice cream...

But I like TIE Defenders too.

I admittedly just love stressing things. It's fun, and flechettes are fun too.

Still, sounds like the Ion token's the way to handle the phantom as it can't do much the next turn, letting everybody get in arc. I should read up about phantom counters more.

Good point about VI Serissu though. I'll probably incorporate her into my future builds.

Such as this...:

Serissu (20)
Veteran Instincts (1)
Ion Cannon (3)
"Heavy Scyk" Interceptor (Cannon) (2)

Tansarii Point Veteran (17)
Push the Limit (3)
"Mangler" Cannon (4)
"Heavy Scyk" Interceptor (Cannon) (2)

Syndicate Thug (18)
Blaster Turret (4)
R4 Agromech (2)

Spice Runner (16)
Ion Cannon Turret (5)
Outlaw Tech (2)

Total: 99

View in Yet Another Squad Builder

It doesn't quite fit the current meta of "load up a turret and take filler or a second spendy ship" the Z is cheaper and more durable so for a number of lists it makes more sense. The M3 may find a role in a control type list and I think serissu will defiantly see play as a protector ship. If the ship is going to see play it will be for what happens on the table with a determined player, not due to what it does on paper.

It doesn't quite fit the current meta of "load up a turret and take filler or a second spendy ship" the Z is cheaper and more durable so for a number of lists it makes more sense. The M3 may find a role in a control type list and I think serissu will defiantly see play as a protector ship. If the ship is going to see play it will be for what happens on the table with a determined player, not due to what it does on paper.

S&V doesn't fit the meta at all

no turret

this is a beautiful beautiful thing :lol:

otherwise agreed with you. This thing is a finesse ship, it's not going to shine through it's raw stats alone

I admittedly just love stressing things. It's fun, and flechettes are fun too. Still, sounds like the Ion token's the way to handle the phantom as it can't do much the next turn, letting everybody get in arc. I should read up about phantom counters more. Good point about VI Serissu though. I'll probably incorporate her into my future builds. Such as this...:Serissu (20)Veteran Instincts (1)Ion Cannon (3)"Heavy Scyk" Interceptor (Cannon) (2)Tansarii Point Veteran (17)Push the Limit (3)"Mangler" Cannon (4)"Heavy Scyk" Interceptor (Cannon) (2)Syndicate Thug (18)Blaster Turret (4)R4 Agromech (2)Spice Runner (16)Ion Cannon Turret (5)Outlaw Tech (2)Total: 99View in Yet Another Squad Builder

Which of the generic ships that cost the same or less than Serissu are you hoping to protect by having your opponent shoot at Serissu first? You might be better off taking a second one instead of her.

I was following an earlier suggestion of using her as PS10 Phantom killer.