Hi there

I was considering how to handle starship prices when trying to buy a ship.

I'm mainly looking at official ship prices from FFG, at wookiepedia's entries for used ships, and at "used" status.

Let's take an example.

An YT-1300 price is 100.000 credits brand new, as the manual says.

Wookiepedia says an used YT-1300 can be bought for 30.000 credits.

That makes sense... but what are the in-game differences between an used and new ship?

In real life, it's a whole can of issues. Ingame, apart from roleplaying preferences, there should be a difference in performance if you spend 30.0000 cr vs 100k for the same ship.

So i was considering critical hits.

The corebook says its 500 credits per hull point to repair a starship.

I couldn't find any mention of critical hits, but i was considering making them cost 10% of the starship's listed price to repair.

For example, an used YT-1300 that you pay 30.000 Cr for, actually has 4-5 critical hits on it, so that the "value after repairs" is actually a lot closer to 70-80k, which is something that makes more sense to me.

To make up the rest of the difference, you might want to improvise/roleplay. Maybe the previous owner has modified the onboard computer so now it can't accept a new upgrade the PCs want to install unless they replace it first. Maybe a weapon is missing as the owner exchanged it for a new one, but unmounted it before selling the ship so you have to find a replacement weapon, and so on.

It also opens up a new possibility that when a ships has 10 crits or more (very unlikely, i know) it just might be easier to just buy a new one than repair it (like it happens in the real world with cars)

What do you guys say about this? Does it make sense? Am i overlooking anything?

Also, i'm looking at the excellent non-official guide, "Starships repair rules".

At the end of the manual, there is listed costs for "docking fee" (100-1000 cr per silhouette) and "berthing fee" (20-800 cr per silhouette).

What's the difference between docking and berthing? (my main language is not english and i couldn't find a translation)

Also, is that intended to per day of stay in a spaceport? A one time fee? I couldn't find any answer even on the forums

I found one:
Mechanic stress (suffer 1 point of system strain), Nav Computer Failure (no hyperspace until repaired), and Major Hull Breach (oh god oh god we're all gonna die) all cost 10% of ships base cost to repair?

If you want to get into this level of boring detail, why not factor in rarity too? Why should a custom built hand crafted but cheap prototype shuttle pod be cheaper to repair then a mass produced freighter that's been on the market for decades?

I get that you think you need this, but you don't, you really don't. I've been there, it's not worth it unless your players are more interested in balancing checkbooks then blast stormtroopers. If they are, go for it, if not, Stormtroopers!

Nearly all of the prices currently on Wookipedia are copied from Saga or WEG, depending on the vessel, which had a different currency value for almost everything, partly due to just making it up for their own balance, partly due to inflation based on the 1 credit ~ 1 dollar conversion.

However, if you want to have a cheaper, used version on the market, the house rules you proposed seem decent. Particularly if you want the first handful of sessions to be about gathering the money to fix these. I also assume the ships at list price are "gently used" or "well maintained". I'd actually give a bonus to a Factory-New starship, at least for a little while.

For your other question: Docking is being at a landing point at the starport to conduct business. Berthing is having your ship stored in a semi-secure garage/pad with limited access.

At the end of the manual, there is listed costs for "docking fee" (100-1000 cr per silhouette) and "berthing fee" (20-800 cr per silhouette).

What's the difference between docking and berthing? (my main language is not english and i couldn't find a translation)

Also, is that intended to per day of stay in a spaceport? A one time fee? I couldn't find any answer even on the forums

As I understand it and would use it, docking would imply a partially or completely enclosed space for the ship or ships to land, either on a planetary surface, space station, or larger ship. A berth would be a place for a ship to pull up alongside a jetty or pier, usually on a space station. A ship berthing at a space station would more than likely offload passengers and cargo through airlocks instead of a boarding ramp.

Thanks for your input

About docking/berthing, i was under the impression that docking was "having the ship ready to launch at will" and berthing is "ship is stored like underground or anywhere that it needs a couple of hours to be able to takeoff"

Maybe i was wrong, though.

I still haven't understood if it's per day or what.

Landing a YT-1300 is around 2000 Cr. I don't think that's per day, but also it can't be forever... i'm confused

It was supposed to be per day. Some very high traffic/valuable starports could easily charge 2000+ credits to land a YT-1300 for a day, although they'd likely break it down by the hour. In those cases your landing just long enough to unload and take on new cargo, than your off to berthing or back into orbit. Prime locations on coruscant & Nar Shaddaa would follow this kind of pattern, for example, as well as some space stations.

I don't consider the manual to be listing the brand-new price. Just the average price you might find with a dealer. I doubt you're going to find many brand-new ships out there unless you personally commission one.

Thanks for your input

About docking/berthing, i was under the impression that docking was "having the ship ready to launch at will" and berthing is "ship is stored like underground or anywhere that it needs a couple of hours to be able to takeoff"

Maybe i was wrong, though.

I still haven't understood if it's per day or what.

Landing a YT-1300 is around 2000 Cr. I don't think that's per day, but also it can't be forever... i'm confused

Docking vs Birthing is for most Purposes about space and time-frame. Docking = Short Term vs Berthing = Long Term

• Docking being Temporary and it varies from StarPort to StarPort. Quicksilver's example is a great example.

It was supposed to be per day. Some very high traffic/valuable starports could easily charge 2000+ credits to land a YT-1300 for a day, although they'd likely break it down by the hour. In those cases your landing just long enough to unload and take on new cargo, than your off to berthing or back into orbit. Prime locations on coruscant & Nar Shaddaa would follow this kind of pattern, for example, as well as some space stations.

• Berthing - That can be a underground facility, a large empty hanger, or even just an empty lot. It really comes back to where you are. That will facilitate the costs just like docking does. In once place you can pay to dock for a day on Nar Shaddaa is what you pay to have a berthing for your ship for a month.
  • On one world like Coruscant a designated spot at the StarPort could be in a large open space like where their Acclaimers where landing at the end of AotC.
  • It could be a hanger like the one the Millennium Falcon was in at the beginning of a ANH.
  • Rent-able or Owned Hangerbays at a StarPort or SpaceStation.

I made some house rules and suggestions for drawbacks on used ships in Cartol's Emporium of Useful Things (page 33). Might serve as an inspiration...

One of the ways I inflate the cost of a "used" ship to something reasonable is by adding the cost of modifications. It's rare to find a stock ship out there, so the used cost of a stock ship is practically useless, except perhaps as a base point. I also don't agree with the 21st century view of depreciation being used as a template for starships. Having starships decades old is quite common, and those ships are just as useful as a "new" version of the same ship. Typically, the only customers that buy factory new ships are large ones: governments, multi-planetary corporations, or (for small yachts) extremely rich individuals.

And to reiterate what Quicksilver said, the wookieepedia entries are based on WEG or Saga edition, which doesn't translate to FFG credits directly. It would be like looking at the US$ price for a new car, then checking out used prices for similar cars 10 years ago in Aus$.

To my mind, a ship that is 100% functional is going to go for the "new" price. Cosmetic damage (repaired) might take off 5%. Minor functional damage (still flyable) would take off 50-100% the cost of repair. Serious damage would take off 75-100% the price of repair. In all cases, a ship isn't going to depreciate beyond half its new cost unless it is never going to fly again and is basically a collection of parts. The effort involved in making a ship is great; far more then making a new car today. The exception would be fighter-craft of course. But even a light freighter should be thought about more like a new home then a new car.

I made some house rules and suggestions for drawbacks on used ships in Cartol's Emporium of Useful Things (page 33). Might serve as an inspiration...

Thanks, that looks like an excellent document. I will definately use that in my campaign, and the bucket of bolts qualities look really well done.

One question: there are a lot of ships in your document. Any way to distinguish between official and non-official ones? Especially with ships that appear in FFG manuals already, are your stats the same or are they different?

Also, you might want to add your document to the compiled resources list thread

But even a light freighter should be thought about more like a new home then a new car.

This clicks with me! It actually makes a lot of sense.

There are no official stats in the catalogue. It's all home brewed, it was made before the manuals were released. So overlap was bound to happen, and continue to happen.

My blog appears in the resource list, although not a direct link to the pdf.

One question: there are a lot of ships in your document. Any way to distinguish between official and non-official ones? Especially with ships that appear in FFG manuals already, are your stats the same or are they different?

Note that all the ships listed at http://swrpg.viluppo.net/transportation/starships/ are FFG official stats, and they include references to the book and page where you will find the details.

One question: there are a lot of ships in your document. Any way to distinguish between official and non-official ones? Especially with ships that appear in FFG manuals already, are your stats the same or are they different?

Note that all the ships listed at http://swrpg.viluppo.net/transportation/starships/ are FFG official stats, and they include references to the book and page where you will find the details.

Thanks! I'm using your list to build a list of choices for my players. Having the option to collapse categories and order by price is great.

It's missing Force and destiny but i guess it's by design, so i'm looking at that manual for extra ships

you may have already gotten past this but set the price for repairing critical hits as Difficulty of repair roll (i.e. 3 purple = 3) x Sil x Rarity x 1000 credits. This allows for variable pricing for differnt size hits different rarity as well as differnt levels of critical hits.

If the PCs are reparing the ship themselves than I leave out the multipler for the difficulty of the repair roll. The rest of the formula is for parts/ tools/ repair shops etc...

Thanks! I'm using your list to build a list of choices for my players. Having the option to collapse categories and order by price is great.

It's missing Force and destiny but i guess it's by design, so i'm looking at that manual for extra ships

We have not intentionally omitted anything I know of, but I’m just a guy who helps type in some data into that system. Aahzmandius_Karrde is the guy who owns and operates that site.

That said, I do have F&D Beta, and I’ll take a look at what ships are missing from the system and see if I can add them in the near future.

One thing that might be helpful is how selling goods might be handled. Generally character can sell goods that are effectively used for 1/4 of their starting value and negotiation rolls go from there. That could at least give a starting point inside the rules. Rolled threat might indicate outstanding repairs. A despair=lemon.