Dudes, you have to have the right cards and cardboard tiles to fly the ships. I don't understand how you won't have the same dials as well. This argument is pointless. Shut up now before this place gets locked too.

As to the mini's colors, doesn't matter at all. That's something different.

but that does feel like a slap in the face in a lot of ways.

Yeah I can see how getting free dials, pilot cards and the rest is just like being slapped in the face... It's not like you're already getting a good deal with Most Wanted, 3 ships for $40...

In some ways it actually is. I'm not sure how much all of that 'wasted' material in Most Wanted costs but it would be simple enough to allow ships to use the dials that came with them and use that cardboard for other things. Those three completely unnecessary dials take up quite a bit of space which could have been used for other things. When you've purchased a ship you get the dial that the ship uses it has been as simple as that.

Dudes, you have to have the right cards and cardboard tiles to fly the ships. I don't understand how you won't have the same dials as well. This argument is pointless. Shut up now before this place gets locked too.

You've always been free to mix dials for a given ship type before.

Why so serious? Don't most people just place their dials on the ship cards so as not to crowd the playing area during activation?

I don't, and I wish other people wouldn't. Having dials on the table makes it easy to tell who's already moved, gives you a better mental map of what's going on.

Those three completely unnecessary dials take up quite a bit of space which could have been used for other things.

Such as? Or do you not really get the whole point of the Most Wanted pack? It's designed to get a number of ships out for S&V fairly quickly and simply.

I mean I suppose they could of offered a S&V HWK and Firespray as separate expansions. Which would of meant that everyone had to spend even more money to get a decent collection of S&V ships.

This way you're effectively getting 6 ships worth of stuff, for less than the cost of 3. If you honestly think this is akin to physical assault... Because if so, then you win the most assine comment of the year.

To make the point, let me sum up how your comment reads...

"Oh my god!!! I can't believe FFG is giving us extra stuff we can use if we already own these ships, and they're not even increasing the cost of the package. They might as well come to my house and physically assault me because this is the same thing!!!!"

I totally get the annoyance, having all these models and not being able to use them all together (I don't even need to use that many, it just bugs me, call it ACD or AR, whatever it's called).

I also get why they don't want you using the wrong dial in a tourney. There /could/ be differences, and it isn't your opponents job to know whether there are or not.

The solution is for FFG to sell extra dials, or maybe the whole card sheets. If they didn't include the cards it wouldn't stop many ship sales.

I think the Most Wanted pack is a good deal. Not great for someone just joining the game and wanting to only collect S&V, but is suspect the number of people in that position could be counted on one foot!

If you completely cover the faction side of the dial, no one would ever know what faction that dial belongs to. Under current rules... that's legal.

And are you going to paint your dials matte black?

As I pointed out on page 1 or 2 doing that is not a good idea.

There's effectively 2 types of TO's when it comes to faction dials. Ones who will enforce the rules and ones who won't.

If your TO won't enforce the rule in the first place. Then there's no reason to paint or otherwise cover up the face of the dial. They won't care what faction the dial belongs to. They might however object to having someone paint over their dial, because they may think it looks fishy.

If your TO will enforce the rule, then covering the face of the dial won't accomplish anything, because if they are going to enforce the rule, they won't accept a dial if they can't tell what faction it belongs to.

The key is, that the TO doesn't have to accept any modified components if he or she doesn't wish to. So the rule about personalizing your dial is not a loophole that you can exploit to get around the rule requiring the correct faction.

So by painting the dial the only thing you really accomplish is making it so your dial won't be accepted no matter what faction you play in a tournament. You also take the chance of a TO who would otherwise accept the wrong faction dial from not accepting your modified one.

VanorDM speaks the truth here and gives good advise. If you are missing a faction correct dial and are unable to borrow one, contact the TO to see if it will be an issue to use the dial of the same ship/different faction.

As players that are unhappy about the current wording of this tournament rule; voice this to FFG. I believe FFG to be a fantastic company that supports its players. Maybe FFG can explain the ruling or maybe they will reverse it (as they did with fan modified miniatures).

Fly casual

I totally get the annoyance

I get it too, but I think what they did makes more sense in the long run. Besides it's not like the FFG SWAT team will show up at your house or at your LGS if you use a rebel dial for your S&V list...

Not great for someone just joining the game and wanting to only collect S&V

I think it's as good of a deal as either the Aces pack are really. Yes it costs $10 more, but you also get 3 ships instead of 2. So even if you don't have a HWK, Firespray or extra Y, you're still getting your monies worth from the MW pack.

Why so serious? Don't most people just place their dials on the ship cards so as not to crowd the playing area during activation?

I don't, and I wish other people wouldn't. Having dials on the table makes it easy to tell who's already moved, gives you a better mental map of what's going on.

It's also much easier for you to tell which of your ships have moved and which haven't. I put mine in order of pilot skill to make it easier to avoid bumping (because then I know who's moving first while setting the dials. At our club we also tend to make an activation order and firing order list; that really helps with keeping track of who's doing what and when.

There's also already enough crap strewn on the table that you end up having to lift just to place your templates.

I totally get the annoyance

I get it too, but I think what they did makes more sense in the long run. Besides it's not like the FFG SWAT team will show up at your house or at your LGS if you use a rebel dial for your S&V list...

Not great for someone just joining the game and wanting to only collect S&V

I think it's as good of a deal as either the Aces pack are really. Yes it costs $10 more, but you also get 3 ships instead of 2. So even if you don't have a HWK, Firespray or extra Y, you're still getting your monies worth from the MW pack.

Yes, but if you want to fly a Firespray or HWK, it's pretty expensive. Also if you only want a Y-Wing, or just one Z-95. Like I said though, can't be many people in that situation.

Those three completely unnecessary dials take up quite a bit of space which could have been used for other things.

Such as? Or do you not really get the whole point of the Most Wanted pack? It's designed to get a number of ships out for S&V fairly quickly and simply.

...

If the goal is to make more ships out into S&V quickly then maybe instead of extra dials for ships we already have they could have put in more of those base tokens that are needed to field a given ship when pilot cards are already available. Maybe they could have also squeezed in a fringe transport ship although that would need a couple pilot cards as well so many not.

So frankly, you have a few people who are losing their freaking minds and making much ado about nothing.

That's almost exactly what I was thinking. Oh well, some people have OCD, some don't...

RoV

I hope they stick to it.

I honestly don't care what people play with in a pick-up/messing around game, but if I'm coming to play in a competitive, timed environment and my opponent wants to play Scum, he better have the correct cardboard to go with it.

If you want to play "collectors cardboard" you should play that instead of X wing.

It's not about collecting cardboard. It's a slap in the face to someone who buys all the proper ships they need, to then one day have FFG say "Oh, that stuff you just bought last month? You totally don't need any of it".

Those three completely unnecessary dials take up quite a bit of space which could have been used for other things.

Such as? Or do you not really get the whole point of the Most Wanted pack? It's designed to get a number of ships out for S&V fairly quickly and simply.

...

If the goal is to make more ships out into S&V quickly then maybe instead of extra dials for ships we already have they could have put in more of those base tokens that are needed to field a given ship when pilot cards are already available. Maybe they could have also squeezed in a fringe transport ship although that would need a couple pilot cards as well so many not.

Aren't tiles more an issue than the cards? Assuming you had two S&V sets, and N'dru/Leeachos are on the flip side of the generics, at best you're going to get something like 3 Black Suns and 3 Pirates in the same squad along with the uniques.

Yeah, the whole "must use the dials with the matching printing on them" is problematic, but is it really as much a barrier to using the Z-95/Firespray/Hwk expansions as the tiles?

Because you'll actually need those faction-themed dials to play that ship with Scum.

Only because someone decided that is the new thing to do.

With all of the "you can just use the old dials and no one will mind" comments it seems pretty clear that as long as the dial used belongs to the right type of ship people are fine "cross faction" dials. If most of the community is fine with using the dials that came with the ship model when flying that ship there really wasn't any need to go and release the SAME dials with a new graphic scheme just to use the ship somewhere else. I believe it also goes against something seen in the tournament rules:

"Players may mark their tokens and their maneuver dials to indicate ownership as long as the function of the component is not compromised."

Ships can be used anywhere and when you can mark dials as long as you don't ruin their function, which I say is simply to show what maneuver the ship will perform, there should be no issue using dials anywhere.

As irate as everyone seems over needing the right dials for high level FFG tournaments, and as convinced as everyone seems that FFG will change stance. They won't. If they ruled you needed the right ones they did so for a reason. It could be as simple as they want the factions to look neat on the table. It's also a massive simplification of what's in Most Wanted: with dial requirement's it's six ships. With dial mixing allowed it's more but turns into a quagmire of component limitations.

Nobody'd be batting an eyelid if they were different ships, which, from a mechanical perspective, they sort of are.

Heck, I'd love to not need copies of each upgrade card for each ship in my fleet. Each copy of Tactician does the same thing for every ship it's attached to, so why do I need to buy one Phantom for each ship that I want to put Tactician on? Why can't I just have it on the table and say, "All of my Blue Squadron Pilots have this card"?

Because those are the rules set by the people who make the game. You don't have to follow them when playing casually, and I'm sure plenty of people will let it slide there. But Regionals, or even some Store Championships? I can assure you that folks will care.

Aren't tiles more an issue than the cards? Assuming you had two S&V sets, and N'dru/Leeachos are on the flip side of the generics, at best you're going to get something like 3 Black Suns and 3 Pirates in the same squad along with the uniques.

Yeah, the whole "must use the dials with the matching printing on them" is problematic, but is it really as much a barrier to using the Z-95/Firespray/Hwk expansions as the tiles?

Yes, it is. You might think that the card and tile requirements should be enough but they apparently are not.

Each Z-95 expansion includes two tiles and four cards. This means that when you fly it you have three cards left over along with one tile. You pick up Most Wanted and you get two more Z-95s. Now logically you should be able to fly one of them using that 'extra' tile from the Expansion pack along with the corresponding card but because of dial requirements you are not allowed to do so. This is also going to work the other way as any unused tiles from Most Wanted are just going to have to sit there because you couldn't use the expansion dial with those tiles.

If you're just interested in importing ships to use in S&V the effect is less noticeable for the Y-Wing, HKW, and Firespray because of the 'extra' dials in MW. MW doesn't contain an actual HWK or Firespray so moving those out doesn't change anything but that Y-Wing you get in MW is completely useless in your Rebel squadrons despite being in the exact same situation that the Z-95 is in.

To me the biggest issue with dials is simply that if you has purchased Z-95 expansions to field them in numbers those are all completely useless if you want to field the same number of them in some Scum squadron. Feel like flying four Z-95s in a Rebel force means owning four expansions and to fly that many in Scum means getting two Most Wanted packs. I guess it's just me but it seems that owning two Expansions and Most Wanted should give me four Z-95s which should allow me to fly either one assuming the base tiles and card work out.

They won't. If they ruled you needed the right ones they did so for a reason. It could be as simple as they want the factions to look neat on the table.

No it is not. You can paint your dials hot pink, one each color of the rainbow, or even paint your imperial dials red with a rebel symbol on the back of them.

I just spent 2 minutes looking for gamestores for you OP.

http://www.comicsandgames.com/

good luck.

coolstuffinc.com has a store in Hollywood.

If the goal is to make more ships out into S&V quickly then maybe instead of extra dials for ships we already have they could have put in more of those base tokens that are needed to field a given ship when pilot cards are already available.

What???

Instead of putting more dials and pilot cards in they should of put in more base cards???

Do you honestly think Most Wanted would of be better with more Z's instead of a extra Y and the stuff for a HWK and Firespray???

Do honestly think that would of been a better way to get more shops into the S&V, by putting in fewer ships?

Because you'll actually need those faction-themed dials to play that ship with Scum.

Only because someone decided that is the new thing to do.

With all of the "you can just use the old dials and no one will mind" comments it seems pretty clear that as long as the dial used belongs to the right type of ship people are fine "cross faction" dials. If most of the community is fine with using the dials that came with the ship model when flying that ship there really wasn't any need to go and release the SAME dials with a new graphic scheme just to use the ship somewhere else. I believe it also goes against something seen in the tournament rules:

"Players may mark their tokens and their maneuver dials to indicate ownership as long as the function of the component is not compromised."

Ships can be used anywhere and when you can mark dials as long as you don't ruin their function, which I say is simply to show what maneuver the ship will perform, there should be no issue using dials anywhere.

The function of a dial is also to identify which faction the ship belongs to, apparently. And it makes sense, too. If I'm playing as Rebels against a Scum player, the last thing I want is for my opponent to have all Scum dials except a single Z-95 or Y-Wing that is identical to the ones I'm using. The moment our ships get tangled up in a fight, I'm liable to pick up his dial if it's close to my ship and, suddenly, he has a pretty good argument that I was cheating by looking at his face-down maneuver dial. All because my opponent mixed his dials.

Heck, I'm sure some people would do this purposefully if FFG rescinds their ruling.

there should be no issue using dials anywhere.

Except you know how FFG said otherwise. So if your going to play in their tournaments you'll have to abide by their rules.

The function of a dial is also to identify which faction the ship belongs to, apparently. And it makes sense, too. If I'm playing as Rebels against a Scum player, the last thing I want is for my opponent to have all Scum dials except a single Z-95 or Y-Wing that is identical to the ones I'm using. The moment our ships get tangled up in a fight, I'm liable to pick up his dial if it's close to my ship and, suddenly, he has a pretty good argument that I was cheating by looking at his face-down maneuver dial.

That is, honestly, stupid. This game allows players with identical dials to play each other in Rebel v. Rebel matches - have you ever see one degrade into drooling confusion and outrageous cheating entrapment? Please.

Not to mention that the rules allow for personalization of dials, which solves your perceived issue entirely.