I really really want to like it, but I just can't see it making a splash. However, I realize I'm looking at it through the prism of the current meta. It may see more use as the meta evolves.

1) Scum offers some really awesome turret options which will further increase the value of autothrusters

2) Scum offers some pretty direct counters to current popular builds. If phantoms and large turrets drop in value, so does high PS. PS 7 might not be a bad bid in a few months (fingers crossed).

So I'm not overly optimistic about it, but if the meta changes, maybe they'll be more popular than I anticipate.

2) Scum offers some pretty direct counters to current popular builds. If phantoms and large turrets drop in value, so does high PS. PS 7 might not be a bad bid in a few months (fingers crossed).

Torkil Mux. The bane of named Phantom Pilots.

If I could put it to slogan:

Star Viper!

The E-wing that doesn't suck!

I kid (mostly) but that's what it reminds me. It's this weird X-wing cross interceptor hybrid, only less rebel (not as much stat stacking and durability without the evade and R2-D2) and more imperial (shenanigans aplenty with boost and segnor's), and I think Xizor carries this mentality across beautifully (it's an arc-dodger that can soak hits like an absolute boss by spreading the damage across squadies, or not get shot at at all!)

Unfortunately, the generics also remind of the E-wing, but I'm hoping people will prove me wrong there. The fact that they cost the same as knaves if they come with auto-thrusters makes me slightly hopeful, it's just that the actually useful upgrade slots are stuck on the characters and Virago.

It has a great dial, a phenomenal action bar, the Segnor Loop, and good stats.

Why haven't I seen any discussion about it? It seems that most people who are buying them only want the Autothrusters from it.

because its BUTT ugly?? lol

Prince Xizor w/ Virago, Autothrusters, Adv. Sensors, and Outmaneuver (or VI or Predator)

Syndicate Thug Y-wing w/ Ion Turret and Unhinged Astromech

3 x Z-95

Have the generics create a big furball in middle and Xizor dances around blasting things. Should be able to stay out of arc and have a lot of fun.

Don't forget the amazing Daredevil + Advanced Sensors - toss them on Guri, and watch her float like a butterfly... may as well toss on inertial dampeners and autothrusters...

Then toss in Lone Wolf N'dru, A heavy Scyk with mangler cannon and a syndicate thug with an unhinged mech and autoblaster turret with the btl a4 title....

A bit barebones - but..

Xizor, Guri and 3 black sun soldiers...

Could maybe swap the Ion Turret for a Blaster Turret.

Though, the Ion was there for control. Hm. What do you think?

Definitely Blaster Turret and maybe the Moldy Crow title so you can pile the focus on. He's going to be one nasty HWK.

I think the SV will see some play. The basic BSE + AT is the same amount of points as a Knave. It has a better dial, action bar, and more durable with ATs. You are a little more crit prone in a SV, but ATs will keep you alive longer. You can even get a system slot and Illicit for 1 point.

I kind of want to try this build for maximum shielding(trolling) of the Virago:

Xizor + Elusiveness + Title + Sensor Jammer + ATs + Inertial Dampeners = 41

Serissu = 20

BSS X 3 = 39

total = 100

Good luck putting any kind of damage on the Prince.

My numbers put the PS1 as being overpriced by about 2 points. Comparing to the BTL-A4 Y-wing at 23 points for around the same cost (or equal with R4 Agro), I would say that is about right.

Guri is nice but sits at the awkward PS5. Xizor seems like a cheap way to bid to PS9.

The Starviper is a hard ship to place in a fleet because of its nature. It has an average set of green movements, which cause it to be an average flanker. Because of it's green 1 movements it does make for a great formation flier, but it is not a tank with only 1 shield and 4 points of hull. This creates a new problem, crits can easily take this ship out early. Its PS only reaches 7, which is lack-luster as well.

So what will the Starviper's role be? I'm not sure comparing this ship to an E-wing is a compliment, as that ship has more problems that just its price. I love the ship because of its role in Shadows of the Empire and will be racking my brain to find a place for it in my fleet.

I'm not sure comparing this ship to an E-wing is a compliment, as that ship has more problems that just its price. I love the ship because of its role in Shadows of the Empire and will be racking my brain to find a place for it in my fleet.

Considering the great statline and unparallelled access to amazing upgrades, the E-wing's only problem is its price (it's too **** high as a base)

Mr Viper ditches that amazing upgrade bar (sans virago) for a more reasonable price

I'm not sure comparing this ship to an E-wing is a compliment, as that ship has more problems that just its price. I love the ship because of its role in Shadows of the Empire and will be racking my brain to find a place for it in my fleet.

Considering the great statline and unparallelled access to amazing upgrades, the E-wing's only problem is its price (it's too **** high as a base)

Mr Viper ditches that amazing upgrade bar (sans virago) for a more reasonable price

And I agree with all of this.

One big issue though. That 1 shield rather than 3 the E-wing has.

It looks great, and will look great on the table while I'm getting it blown up through my own ineptitude. And the Virago title differentiates one of them from the Defender/E-Wing, illicit upgrades are great from what we've seen so far and I can't wait to see other ones FFG come up with in future waves.

I'm not sure comparing this ship to an E-wing is a compliment, as that ship has more problems that just its price. I love the ship because of its role in Shadows of the Empire and will be racking my brain to find a place for it in my fleet.

Considering the great statline and unparallelled access to amazing upgrades, the E-wing's only problem is its price (it's too **** high as a base)

Mr Viper ditches that amazing upgrade bar (sans virago) for a more reasonable price

And I agree with all of this.

One big issue though. That 1 shield rather than 3 the E-wing has.

Compared to the E-Wing, you're trading the Evade action and two points of shields to gain the Boost action and two points of Hull. You're also trading away the ability to do hard 3s for the ability to do a hard 1, and losing the 5 straight.

For a generic with three evade dice, losing Evade to gain Boost and Autothrusters access is pure win. Trading 3-turns for 1-turns is also a win for the Scum. Losing the shields hurts, especially with all the people who are going to be dabbling with the Ten Numb/Mangler combo (spectated a Juggler match on Vassal where poor Guri was just mauled by the thing). But overall, I'd consider the generic StarViper to be generally superior to the generic E-Wing any day of the week.

My numbers put the PS1 as being overpriced by about 2 points. Comparing to the BTL-A4 Y-wing at 23 points for around the same cost (or equal with R4 Agro), I would say that is about right.

Guri is nice but sits at the awkward PS5. Xizor seems like a cheap way to bid to PS9.

Oh no, do you realise what you just done?

I can already see all those posts about the Starviper being overpriced and needing a fix spamming in every discussion we have about it, like with the Defender, just because you said it is overpriced by 2 points...

You should be more cautious with your words Major, some people take them as the absolute truth and won't even bother to try the ship to make an opinion by themselves...

Biggest problem with the star viper is that I'd rather be flying it's big brother the Agressor. Also, that ugly blacksun logo. Ick.

I think a properly kitted out Xizor with support fills a role not dissimilar to that of Whisper or Echo in an Imperial list or a similarly kitted Corran in a Rebel list.

I can see me running him with a Black Sun mini-swarm and he should do quite well.

there is an intersting phenomenon on this forum. whenever a new wave is announced, one or two ships get all the love. (the agressor, in this wave) and other ships get either discounted or ignored (like the defender) Then, once the ships actually hit the table, opinions change.

the agressor is very different, it's cool, IG-88, I mean, who doesn't think he is cool? dual cannons, segnor loop, IG-2000 title?

these things are new, and generate a lot of interest, but many waves have a "sleeper" not flashy, does not generate a lot of posts, but winds up being awesome.

My predicted awesome ship is Kavil with Agromech, but I think the starviper may be underappreciated (I personally loathe the ship asthetically, it does not look like it belongs in the star wars universe, just my opinion, I know.) I think it will be a capable ship in the game though. It's a little like the defender but with a better dial for dogfighting.

My numbers put the PS1 as being overpriced by about 2 points. Comparing to the BTL-A4 Y-wing at 23 points for around the same cost (or equal with R4 Agro), I would say that is about right.

Guri is nice but sits at the awkward PS5. Xizor seems like a cheap way to bid to PS9.

Oh no, do you realise what you just done?

I can already see all those posts about the Starviper being overpriced and needing a fix spamming in every discussion we have about it, like with the Defender, just because you said it is overpriced by 2 points...

You should be more cautious with your words Major, some people take them as the absolute truth and won't even bother to try the ship to make an opinion by themselves...

But it's a fair point. Like it or not, PS1 generics in this game have one role: Blocker. If they get to shoot, that's a cool bonus, but their low PS makes it hard to even rely on anyone being in their firing arc, or on them surviving long enough to actually fire. For the price of one Black Sun Enforcer, I can field two Black Sun Soldiers. That will give me more blocking ability, more firing arc coverage, and they'll probably stay on the table longer thanks to more total HP.

My numbers put the PS1 as being overpriced by about 2 points. Comparing to the BTL-A4 Y-wing at 23 points for around the same cost (or equal with R4 Agro), I would say that is about right.

Guri is nice but sits at the awkward PS5. Xizor seems like a cheap way to bid to PS9.

Oh no, do you realise what you just done?

I can already see all those posts about the Starviper being overpriced and needing a fix spamming in every discussion we have about it, like with the Defender, just because you said it is overpriced by 2 points...

You should be more cautious with your words Major, some people take them as the absolute truth and won't even bother to try the ship to make an opinion by themselves...

Ha ha, it's not the first time I have said that the generic Star Viper is overpriced...

I really like the generic Star Vipers, just not for their cost. It is hard to justify taking one over a BTL-A4 Y-wing with Ion + R4 for the same cost. I could maybe see myself taking the occasional Star Viper for 23 points, which competes in cost directly with the BTL-A4 Ion Y-wing without R4.

My numbers put the PS1 as being overpriced by about 2 points. Comparing to the BTL-A4 Y-wing at 23 points for around the same cost (or equal with R4 Agro), I would say that is about right.

Guri is nice but sits at the awkward PS5. Xizor seems like a cheap way to bid to PS9.

Oh no, do you realise what you just done?

I can already see all those posts about the Starviper being overpriced and needing a fix spamming in every discussion we have about it, like with the Defender, just because you said it is overpriced by 2 points...

You should be more cautious with your words Major, some people take them as the absolute truth and won't even bother to try the ship to make an opinion by themselves...

But it's a fair point. Like it or not, PS1 generics in this game have one role: Blocker. If they get to shoot, that's a cool bonus, but their low PS makes it hard to even rely on anyone being in their firing arc, or on them surviving long enough to actually fire. For the price of one Black Sun Enforcer, I can field two Black Sun Soldiers. That will give me more blocking ability, more firing arc coverage, and they'll probably stay on the table longer thanks to more total HP.

So it began...

My numbers put the PS1 as being overpriced by about 2 points. Comparing to the BTL-A4 Y-wing at 23 points for around the same cost (or equal with R4 Agro), I would say that is about right.

Guri is nice but sits at the awkward PS5. Xizor seems like a cheap way to bid to PS9.

Oh no, do you realise what you just done?

I can already see all those posts about the Starviper being overpriced and needing a fix spamming in every discussion we have about it, like with the Defender, just because you said it is overpriced by 2 points...

You should be more cautious with your words Major, some people take them as the absolute truth and won't even bother to try the ship to make an opinion by themselves...

Ha ha, it's not the first time I have said that the generic Star Viper is overpriced...

I really like the generic Star Vipers, just not for their cost. It is hard to justify taking one over a BTL-A4 Y-wing with Ion + R4 for the same cost. I could maybe see myself taking the occasional Star Viper for 23 points, which competes in cost directly with the BTL-A4 Ion Y-wing without R4.

Imagine if the Starviper was 23 pts, I could actually field 4 of them with Autothrusters... hmmm.... Maybe that's actually what they wanted to prevent by making it cost 25 pts.

This dial though, there is a lot going on for it. But I agree, I'm really not sure we'll see a lot of Generic Starviper in competitive list. Unless you love torpedoes, there is not many way to customize them.

Will the Starviper have any use? Yes! It will look very pretty on my desk as a paperweight.

Just kidding; I have many plans on how to make Xizor work. I have a general idea of what I want to do with him; he's going to be loaded to the gills with upgrades and then flies next to a cheap, bulky Y-wing to take his hits. But I need to build phantom-countering ability into his list to make it competitive. I can VI Xizor up to 9, but that is only so useful against Whisper, and precludes PtL+AdvS, which can be really powerful. I could also include Torkil Mux, whose ability would be great to counter phantoms but also makes him a target, when I want Xizor to be the target.

I am thinking that the Starviper will be the knife fighter of the S&V. They are the Tie Interceptor type role.

I'm hoping that PS won't be as big of an issue in the new meta. Maybe I'm dreaming, but I'd love for it to be less dominating.

My numbers put the PS1 as being overpriced by about 2 points. Comparing to the BTL-A4 Y-wing at 23 points for around the same cost (or equal with R4 Agro), I would say that is about right.

Guri is nice but sits at the awkward PS5. Xizor seems like a cheap way to bid to PS9.

Oh no, do you realise what you just done?

I can already see all those posts about the Starviper being overpriced and needing a fix spamming in every discussion we have about it, like with the Defender, just because you said it is overpriced by 2 points...

You should be more cautious with your words Major, some people take them as the absolute truth and won't even bother to try the ship to make an opinion by themselves...

Ha ha, it's not the first time I have said that the generic Star Viper is overpriced...

I really like the generic Star Vipers, just not for their cost. It is hard to justify taking one over a BTL-A4 Y-wing with Ion + R4 for the same cost. I could maybe see myself taking the occasional Star Viper for 23 points, which competes in cost directly with the BTL-A4 Ion Y-wing without R4.

One of them can actually move...

Honestly, I see a nice role for the Starviper. With Autothrusters, it will be very, very annoying for a turret to kill one. Even more than an Interceptor, due to the built in extra health.